848 legal for middleweight supersport?

[Graham]

The class rules are the same for this bike in supersport and superbike.IT cant be both can it?

[d-wire]

yeah, it can run it ss and sb just like the inline 4's.....just has to have dot's for ss. ( and follow the other ss rules)

[Graham]

Supersport rule : Twin cylinder, liquid cooled up to 850cc
Superbike rule: Twin cylinder,4 valve per cylinder up to 850cc

                    The 848 is a twin cylinder,4 valve,liquid cooled bike, how can the max cc be the same in both classes? The 1098 is not legal for heavyweight supersport but is for heavyweight superbike. So i would think the 848 is not legal for middleweight supersport. MY superbike  R6
doesnt put out 134hp with 70lbs torque but thats the stats for a 848 stock.Could someone explain  how the same cc for superbike is th same for supersport, thanks.

[Mongo]

Why wouldn't the displacement be the same in both classes?  Been a long time since a simple overbore was the norm for Superbikes.

[benprobst]

Supersport rule : Twin cylinder, liquid cooled up to 850cc
Superbike rule: Twin cylinder,4 valve per cylinder up to 850cc

                    The 848 is a twin cylinder,4 valve,liquid cooled bike, how can the max cc be the same in both classes? The 1098 is not legal for heavyweight supersport but is for heavyweight superbike. So i would think the 848 is not legal for middleweight supersport. MY superbike  R6
doesnt put out 134hp with 70lbs torque but thats the stats for a 848 stock.Could someone explain  how the same cc for superbike is th same for supersport, thanks.

since when do OEM claimed hp numbers equal real world rear wheel numbers? And you should have built it better if your "superbike" doesnt make 130 hp. The majority of the good SS bikes I have seen run on the dyno are knocking on the 130 door. Im so tired of all the complaining about the ducatis. If they are so freaking fast, go buy one! How many national championships did they win in the 600 and 1000 classes last year?

[Graham]

wasnt complaining, just asked the question about the same cc for supersport and superbike,still looking for that answer?IF anything i should of asked why the 848 coudnt increase its cc for super bike like the 1098 can for superbike.The r6 coudnt ever get 70lbs of torque,pretty important on the race track.I can get the 135hp just not that torque number.So relax, if you dont have the answer am looking for dont post if it upsets you,its just a question.

[benprobst]

wasnt complaining, just asked the question about the same cc for supersport and superbike,still looking for that answer?IF anything i should of asked why the 848 coudnt increase its cc for super bike like the 1098 can for superbike.The r6 coudnt ever get 70lbs of torque,pretty important on the race track.I can get the 135hp just not that torque number.So relax, if you dont have the answer am looking for dont post if it upsets you,its just a question.

Fair enough, ill calm down.  My guess is that the wording in the rule book is specifically for the 848. Not just for any twin under 850 or whatever. They know the 848 is already on the border of outclassing some of the bikes, and they know if they gave it 925 cc or something it would start getting a little silly if the right people with big checkbooks decided to go racing. So they most likely decided to keep the controversy down just let the thing in both classes with stock displacement.

[roadracer162]

Is it displacement that makes a motor Superbike? I would venture to say no but more the change to higher compression pistons even at the same displacement as stock.

My Ducati 800ss produces 86 rwhp with some 60 ft/lbs of torque. It still won't keep up with an R6.

I have also found that my Ducati and my FZR600 is a pretty equal match. Ducati at 805cc and high compression pistons as compared to the FZR with 630cc and high compression pistons. Go figure.

Mark

[Graham]

I just wanted to no why the 848 has the same cc for supersport and superbike? The 1098 can increase its cc for heavywieght superbike but the 1098 is not legal for heavywieght supersport.Both of these bikes are similar to each other.Not saying cc is what makes a superbike.Remember iam not complaning, I just found this to be odd.Dont answer this with a another question, I am not looking to debate this its simple question.99% of the time i get beat by another rider not always the bike, I have lots of room for improvement, i just found the above question to be a little odd.Nobody else thinks so?

[JBraun]

The majority of the good SS bikes I have seen run on the dyno are knocking on the 130 door.

I always hear these numbers thrown around. At RA in 07 (before the grid fiasco that overheated and killed my motor) my zx6 was making 117hp on a dynojet. Compared to other 600s, my bike was so fast I felt like I was cheating. Granted, it was not tuned for peak power, and was big from 9k to redline.
I heard a lot of talk about Brian Hall's motors that season too. Speculation was that his stuff was making well over 130. But I saw his bikes on the dyno, and they were the same as mine.
Either the dyno I use is really consevative, or others are optimistic, or maybe things like this just get exagerated...

[Mongo]

Graham - no it is not odd.  It all depends on how much of a displacement advantage the sanctioning body feels is right for that type of bike.  Personally I agree with the CCS rule as I think the amount of stuff you can do to an 848 under Superbike rules will make it faster than the same modifications to a 600 - hence the 600's getting a bit more of a displacement advantage in SB vs SS.

[Graham]

Thanks mongo for clearing that up.I heard the 848 was going to be a strong bike and if it starts dominating 600ss, i would think ccs would look in to it. What about the 1098? Its not legal for supersport but is for superbike. They did give the inline four an extra 45cc this year and all other engines\configurations are unlimited displacement besides the 1098 has a cap at 1150cc for superbike.Why give the 1098 extra cc for superbike?The 1098 only really has one competitor the suzuki 750.Does the sanctioning body really think 825 cc suzuki could beat a 1098 superbike to the point the 1098 needed in extra 52 cc? And they do not state anything about the specific 1098... meaning 1098,1098s,or the 1098R.WE all no the 1098 R is about 10lbs lighter, 10 more hp and about 10lb of torque more than the 1098 or 1098s model  stock.I would bet on any 1098 would tear up the suzuki.Thanks for your help mongo for answering my original question,the rest of this really has no point, but your thoughts are welcomed,lol.