08 LW class rules

[123user]

Unfortunatly I believe the 2 bikes driving this rule change will make the cost of being competitive in LW more than MW. Kind of a change of role.

Middleweight bikes are probably the most over-engineered vehicles available today.  It makes sense that building competetive machines out of less engineered/refined design is going to be expensive.  In the same respect, it follows that engineer/mechanic/tinkerer types are going to be drawn to the LW classes, while the MW classes are (and will continue to be) comprised of less "handy" racers.

I guess I'm biased because I race one of the "cheater" bikes... but if I look only at the results from this year I would be convinced that the SV is the dominate bike because it dominated every class it is legal for!

Obviously, some SV's racers won't be happy until they have a spec. class!  Which is what the Ultra-light will become with the inclusion of super-biked SV's

[APP_Racing]

I don't have a ton of history on this topic but.....Moving the SVs to ULWSB doesn't make much sense to me.  I have seen them race with Buells and be competitive.  Guess what I am saying is that  HP doesn't always win races.  Understanding that boundaries need to be set.  But what, is MOTO-ST going to have a 4th class as well.   Or what about a competitive 450 Supermoto, seen them run well, just look at Hallet this year with Eslick.

[Super Dave]

Oh, yeah, you had to bring up the Supermoto bikes...LOL!

I believe that they are in UlwSB, right?  I smell an additional class coming on.

[HAWK]

I started racing in ULW and progressed to LW but it had nothing to do with being a tinkerer, I did it because I didn't see jumping into deep end as a logical starting point. For the record I am an SV rider, I oppose the moving of SVs to ULW and while I see the SV slipping in comparison to the current bikes coming into LW I have no problem with that. If you do some searching on this forum you will find that I supported the inclusion of the BMW and DUC in LW last year ( http://www.ccsforum.com/index.php/topic,14589.15.html ) and my position has not changed on that. I point out that the BMW may find it's way into to  LWSS ranks to try and motivate the current SV riders to also oppose this rule change as it will not only creat a spec class for the SVs in ULW it will also set the stage for their exit from LW. I'm not looking to push the BMW or the DUC out of LW, I would like to avoid seeing the current ULW class destroyed.

As far as the SV moving to ULWSB, 90HP is easy on a superbike SV while 70 is playing with a live granade for most the the ULWSB croud. I would like to see the ULW crowd given a little warning, some of these guys have spent time and money on bikes that will be annihilated by this move, let them know that this is comming in 2009 and that they should make some decisions.

[L8brake731]

My 2 cents....

If there was a semantic change in the rule book from "water cooled" to "liquid cooled" it would place BMW where they should be. Since they are "dual cooled".

If I were in ULWSB, I'd be pissed too! Oh yeah, now I am.

[Super Dave]

I don't think the new BMW was an issue in LW.  It wasn't in the parameters, correct?  Or was there a slight modification of the cc's for twins from 2006 to 2007.

[HAWK]

I don't have my 2007 rulebook handy so this is off the top of my head. The BMW is legal for LWSB, the original ruling last year was that it would be legal in LW but after a considerable debate it was allowed to only run in SB.

[Gixxerblade]

I think you can still race up a class. I can't wait to beat a Beemer on a now UL bike. 

[HAWK]

Yes you can always race up a class, I think you will still see a lot of SVs on the LW grids next year. I just recieved an e-mail from Eric and there will be different prep rules imposed on the SV in ULW so you will now need 3 SVs. One for ULWSB, one for LWSS and one for LWSB as there will now be
3 levels of prep. I'm a little concerned about the $5000 I just invested in a SB motor for my SV.

[Super Dave]

The BMW is legal for LWSB, the original ruling last year was that it would be legal in LW but after a considerable debate it was allowed to only run in SB.

Well, I think my point is missed.  As you know, there are lots of BMW's.  But there was a model added to the line for 2007 or maybe even 2006.  I think its displacement was larger, something, or the rules were changed that moved it's classification.  Maybe that was already in place.

Displacement plays into the rules. 

As an example, in HWSS, as the rules are currently, you can run up to a 1000cc liquid cooled twin.  That displacement goes up in HWSB.  As an example, as the current rules are written, the Ducati 1098 and the Buell 1125 are legal for HWSB, but not HWSS.  I never looked at it that closely as I was racing an SV1000 which isn't over the 1000cc limit as it is. 

So, having those changes for SS vs SB would be reasonable.

We're talking semantics, I suppose.  Again, I'll be interested in seeing the whole rules package.

Doesn't develop extra motivation for me and spending money to enter my H1 project, forever unfinished, in UlwSB.  But I've been working on it for longer than some people have been racing.  I'll keep working on it.

[ducatiboy]

Hawks are screwed!

[HAWK]

Yes Dave you are correct, the BMW went from 1100 to 1200 last year, the 1100 has been SS legal for some time the 1200 was the one that created the controversy last winter and ended up SB only. Bmw has upped the power and reduced the weight for 2008 with the HP2. BMW claims 136 HP at the crank, and 392 lbs dry weight for the 1200cc HP2. I believe the sticker shock er price is said to be $15000-$20000 although BMW only says TBD.