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Tenative 2007 Schedule

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extrakt0r

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Re: Tenative 2007 Schedule
« Reply #72 on: November 29, 2006, 08:17:54 pm »
Numbers of racers on the grid goes up and down in cycles. 

Then the lawyers took over a bit more, and track days for cars and bikes drove up the prices for track rentals through increased demand. 


Simply put, racing isn't inexpensive, and it probably shouldn't be.  Something less expensive is a track day.  Tires can live for a long time when they don't have to perform at a higher limit, and there's no need for a new bike for contingency or for the personal feeling that a new bike will make one more competitive.

The reason Racing is so expensive is not becuase of CCS IMO...Or the lawyers...

Entry Fees are the cheapest part of this sport...

$325 for a set of tires is plain rip off...

There is so much VAR in this business, between Tires, $12+ for a gallon of Gas, $1K for exhaust systems that do not cost $200 to make, $400 rearsets here and there...Everyone fees it is necessary to mark everything up 150%...

I see the LP Dealer book, and I wasn't born yesterday...The Vendors of this sport is what kills the sport, not CCS or WERA or CRA...

The RACING part is the cheap part...

Sure, Lawyers may have made Entry Fees go up, but I can race a Good amount of races in one weekend, and still not spend as much on all those entry fees as one set of tires...

This whole business is based on Maximum Price for the smallest quantinty...That is why this business suffers on all fronts...

Just all IMO's...
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ahastings

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Re: Tenative 2007 Schedule
« Reply #73 on: November 29, 2006, 09:11:18 pm »

I see the LP Dealer book, and I wasn't born yesterday...The Vendors of this sport is what kills the sport, not CCS or WERA or CRA...

I think you are confused on vendors. Maybe manufactures, but not vendors. If you look at the LP catalog the average markup is only about 30% to full retail and that is about average. Most racers never want to pay full retail.
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Arnie
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Court Jester

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Re: Tenative 2007 Schedule
« Reply #74 on: November 29, 2006, 10:02:52 pm »
The reason Racing is so expensive is not becuase of CCS IMO...Or the lawyers...

Entry Fees are the cheapest part of this sport...

$325 for a set of tires is plain rip off...

There is so much VAR in this business, between Tires, $12+ for a gallon of Gas, $1K for exhaust systems that do not cost $200 to make, $400 rearsets here and there...Everyone fees it is necessary to mark everything up 150%...

I see the LP Dealer book, and I wasn't born yesterday...The Vendors of this sport is what kills the sport, not CCS or WERA or CRA...

The RACING part is the cheap part...

Sure, Lawyers may have made Entry Fees go up, but I can race a Good amount of races in one weekend, and still not spend as much on all those entry fees as one set of tires...

This whole business is based on Maximum Price for the smallest quantinty...That is why this business suffers on all fronts...

Just all IMO's...

i agree 100%
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HAWK

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Re: Tenative 2007 Schedule
« Reply #75 on: November 30, 2006, 04:44:28 am »
The reason Racing is so expensive is not becuase of CCS IMO...Or the lawyers...

Entry Fees are the cheapest part of this sport...

$325 for a set of tires is plain rip off...

There is so much VAR in this business, between Tires, $12+ for a gallon of Gas, $1K for exhaust systems that do not cost $200 to make, $400 rearsets here and there...Everyone fees it is necessary to mark everything up 150%...

I see the LP Dealer book, and I wasn't born yesterday...The Vendors of this sport is what kills the sport, not CCS or WERA or CRA...

The RACING part is the cheap part...

Sure, Lawyers may have made Entry Fees go up, but I can race a Good amount of races in one weekend, and still not spend as much on all those entry fees as one set of tires...

This whole business is based on Maximum Price for the smallest quantinty...That is why this business suffers on all fronts...

Just all IMO's...

The answer there is a spec series. To be cheap on tires it would have to be a lightweight bike at most and the rules would have to be STOCK PERIOD. If you are looking for a cheap class then the $1000 shock and $250 rearsets don't fit.  Some of you will absolutely hate it but that is why you have 19 other classes to run. With a spec series you could attract the track riders with small budgets that aren't sure they want to go 160 MPH....yet :biggrin:
« Last Edit: November 30, 2006, 04:51:16 am by Hawk »
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Paul Onley
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Re: Tenative 2007 Schedule
« Reply #76 on: November 30, 2006, 07:52:31 am »
I raced a spec class.  Certain parts were restricted.  So, you had to use OEM...and their cost was above what the aftermarket had to offer.  Cheating occured too, at a high cost, but it was virtually impossible to police. 

If your not "designed" as the appropriate rider for the bike, you're at a disadvanage.

And you can also eliminate contingency sponsorship dollars/certificates, in addition to most sponsorships.

WSB has spec tires.  Teams used to be able to set up sponsorships.  Now everyone pays, increasing team costs.

Did it change the results?  Bayliss was still a winner.
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Super Dave

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Re: Tenative 2007 Schedule
« Reply #77 on: November 30, 2006, 08:00:36 am »
The reason Racing is so expensive is not becuase of CCS IMO...Or the lawyers...

Entry Fees are the cheapest part of this sport...

$325 for a set of tires is plain rip off...

There is so much VAR in this business, between Tires, $12+ for a gallon of Gas, $1K for exhaust systems that do not cost $200 to make, $400 rearsets here and there...Everyone fees it is necessary to mark everything up 150%...

I see the LP Dealer book, and I wasn't born yesterday...The Vendors of this sport is what kills the sport, not CCS or WERA or CRA...

The RACING part is the cheap part...

Sure, Lawyers may have made Entry Fees go up, but I can race a Good amount of races in one weekend, and still not spend as much on all those entry fees as one set of tires...

This whole business is based on Maximum Price for the smallest quantinty...That is why this business suffers on all fronts...

Just all IMO's...

Cost of insurance for CCS at Daytona is $42k plus.

The last time I paid for daily insurance for  my school, it had almost doubled from what it was a a few years prior.

Mark up?  Well, that's capitalism, and it is a good thing. 

$325 for a set of tires?  In Europe the tires that are pretty much the same, there are usually variations in compound and construction for different regions, cost around $500.  Is that a rip off?  I raced on the tires of seven, fifteen, and twenty years ago...these are better and more versitile;  a real value for the cost.

As for any comparison to four car tires...doesn't apply as cars have completely different loads.  And give me a set of high performance tires on a race track on my car...they aren't going to last long either.
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Super Dave

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Re: Tenative 2007 Schedule
« Reply #78 on: November 30, 2006, 08:06:52 am »
Point is, the tracks are there.  There are orgs that run them.  If you're really bummed, get another license and run a few weekends with another org at the track you love.  It might do you some good!

+1   Does anyone race @ Putnam or is it just a trackday venue now?

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Jeff

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Re: Tenative 2007 Schedule
« Reply #79 on: November 30, 2006, 08:52:04 am »
Todd, check with Putnam and  see what they have on the schedule for 07.

Guys, look as mentioned, racing is not cheap.  Can it be cheap?  Absolutely.  However, the amount which you CAN spend is virtually unlimited.  I know guys who run an entire season for a couple thousand bucks.  They run take-offs, pump gas, stock everything and only a couple races.  They aren't winning anything, but they're having fun and being happy.

If WINNING and constantly improving is your "fun and happy", it costs money.  Period...

Put it another way...

There are people who are happy enough on life.
There are others who are made happy through a few drinks every now and again
There are others who are made happy through a 12pk a night
There are yet others who put $1k up their nose each day and still aren't happy

It's all in who you are and your intended goals.  And for reference, there is a scatLOAD of support available for the 'average guy'.  You just need to be more competitive in marketing yourself than the others are...

Racing costs money.  Racing itself, of ANY nature is not cheap.  It is an elite sport.  Think of it as owning your own personal football team.  Each person has their own team which they must run and support.  It's expensive!  There's no way around it.
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Eric Kelcher

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Re: Tenative 2007 Schedule
« Reply #80 on: November 30, 2006, 09:38:52 am »
It is nice that Dean will let you buy a race license per event. I was looking at doing some WERA but after everything I would have to buy or rent I gave up on that idea.


FYI the one event license is available at all tracks other than Daytona.
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Eric Kelcher
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tzracer

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Re: Tenative 2007 Schedule
« Reply #81 on: November 30, 2006, 12:27:10 pm »
I have switched to racing a 125.

Why? It is the most fun I have had racing. It is the cheapest bike I have ever raced. Cheaper than (a properly cared for) SV.

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Woofentino Pugrossi

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Re: Tenative 2007 Schedule
« Reply #82 on: November 30, 2006, 12:53:07 pm »

Guys, look as mentioned, racing is not cheap.  Can it be cheap?  Absolutely.  However, the amount which you CAN spend is virtually unlimited.  I know guys who run an entire season for a couple thousand bucks.  They run take-offs, pump gas, stock everything and only a couple races.  They aren't winning anything, but they're having fun and being happy.


+1. I think 03 was my "biggest outlay of cash" racing in CCS. Maybe $4000 for the year. Old reliable F2. Tires lasted 3 weekends. Ran on 93octane pump gas. 3 races a weekend (t-bike, hwss, gtu or mwss). Still had fun especially playing in hwss with Kimmie and the TLR.
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Burt Munro

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Re: Tenative 2007 Schedule
« Reply #83 on: November 30, 2006, 03:13:44 pm »
I have switched to racing a 125.

Why? It is the most fun I have had racing. It is the cheapest bike I have ever raced. Cheaper than (a properly cared for) SV.



Brian,

You forgot the biggest plus for a 125.  It's easy to bump start.....  especially when you're in kind of a hurry!!   :kicknuts:
« Last Edit: November 30, 2006, 03:17:49 pm by Burt Munro »
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