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Buying bike w/ no title?

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bongoray

Buying bike w/ no title?
« on: March 13, 2003, 05:18:41 pm »
Guys,

Anyone ever do this before? I have a fellow NESBA member who has a bike for sale. This bike will only be used for racing and for track days. He says he doesn't have a title for it. He bought it from a racer with only a sales agreement, and he would do the same for me.

This is a great bike and a good price. I just want to know how I can cover my ass. Again, this bike will never be registered. Only track days with NESBA and races with CCS. I know CCS requires an unaltered VIN plate, but do you have to have the title?

Thanks!  

Bongo

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rick

Re: Buying bike w/ no title?
« Reply #1 on: March 13, 2003, 05:22:21 pm »
There's lots of race bikes that end up that way so, I wouldn't sweat that too much. Someone doesn't ever plan to put it on the street so, they don't bother registering it, yadda yadda - it happens.

...But, there's the oft told tale of the fuzz showing up at some Texas track and seizing all the bikes that didn't have any sort of proof of ownership. Scary!
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TreyBone

Re: Buying bike w/ no title?
« Reply #2 on: March 13, 2003, 05:35:33 pm »
I bought a racebike (the one before i have now) with no title, bill of sale, nothin. It was a race bike. I rode it till i got better and had to get a better bike. I sold it the next season to a guy (he races in louden) with the same thing, no title, or bill of sale. I see he is still racing it. I got to run with him a little bit last year at VIR ;D  
The bike I am racing now I bought early in last years season. I did get a title signed over to me but since i didn't want to have to pay property tax on it I never transfered it over. I still got it, but havn't done anything with it :-/

So if you have no intention of putting it on the street ever again, and you are pretty sure it ain't stollen, GO FOR IT.

I mean would you title a racing go-kart, or scooter?
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hdpromos

Re: Buying bike w/ no title?
« Reply #3 on: March 13, 2003, 06:00:07 pm »
If the bike was checked during one of our paddock sweeps and comes up with altered VIN. numbers or worse, stolen. Your bike will go out on a hook and you will have some "bracelets" to wear.We do this because of bike theft rings that steal bikes and sell them to racers. Don't be fooled by a deal that seems too good to be true.Because it usually turns out to be stolen. If they have a title you don't need to register it for the street and you know it is not stolen. It's not just Florida but all over the USA. Don't help these "fools" and their dirty business.

HD
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Baltobuell

Re: Buying bike w/ no title?
« Reply #4 on: March 13, 2003, 06:07:54 pm »
Why doesn't it have a title? Somebody bought it from a dealer somewhere. I have no title for my own bike, but the frame and cases say "FOR RACE USE ONLY" as the bike was assembled from parts and I got a bill of sale with reciepts for the major pieces. Be aware, it may be just a good deal, but think where did it come from. Somebody has paper somewhere.
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mdr14

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Re: Buying bike w/ no title?
« Reply #5 on: March 13, 2003, 06:24:25 pm »
I know the salvage laws are a little wacky in illinois.
I am a licensed rebuilder in Illinois. That means I can legally own and purchase salvage vehicles. I can not sell a salvage titled vehicle to an illinois resident that does not have a rebuilders license. If I do, it is as a bill of sale only, no title will be exchanged. If your out of the state, I don't care and either does Illinois. Its not up to me or the state of Illinois to enforce salvage laws in other states.

Yes, it is very hard to get a rebuilders license in illinois.

Your best bet is to call the secretary of state police, give them the vin # and have them check it out for you. then you are covered. No I do not have their # handy, sorry, a little surfing on the web will get you what you need.
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Jeff

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Re: Buying bike w/ no title?
« Reply #6 on: March 14, 2003, 06:06:56 am »
Quote
If the bike was checked during one of our paddock sweeps and comes up with altered VIN. numbers or worse, stolen.


When/where has there ever been a paddock sweep?  I'm curious as I haven't seen one in the last 3 years in the MW...

FWIW, my bike has a salvage title somewhere signed over from my insurance company back to me.  However, if I were to sell it, I'd be hard pressed to find the doc and would likely just provide a bill of sale.

Then again, I know where my bike came from...
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MightyDuc Racing

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Re: Buying bike w/ no title?
« Reply #7 on: March 14, 2003, 08:44:35 am »
My bike has a custom frame, and therefore no VIN numbers.  HD, you know the bike's history (Mattson - Butch - Me).  I'm assuming I'm ok if the cops come rumbling through, right?  It was built by Mattson as an AMA race bike from a kit, but based on a Duc...is there a gray area I should worry about here?  
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dahustler

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Re: Buying bike w/ no title?
« Reply #8 on: March 14, 2003, 09:37:05 am »
ok guys ask yourself this. You are driving across country with your shiny new racebike that you got a great deal on, but no title, in your trailer.  You get pulled over by a state trooper who isn't in the best of moods. He decides that he wants to take a look inside your trailer. Then he decides to run vin#'s. etc. Is a good deal worth going to jail over? Even if it works out in the end, is the time wasted and the extra hassle worth it? No, there haven't been any track sweeps lately, but whos to say we won't have one this year. And, if they do what will they find? All it takes is to find one stolen bike and we will all be considered thieves. All I'm saying is have the vin# ran, if it comes back clean get a bill of sale. Cover your ass. My .02
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MightyDuc Racing

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Re: Buying bike w/ no title?
« Reply #9 on: March 14, 2003, 12:43:27 pm »
What about race bikes with a custom frame and no vin #???
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Baltobuell

Re: Buying bike w/ no title?
« Reply #10 on: March 14, 2003, 01:06:12 pm »
Whoever bought the cusom frame paid for it and got a recipt. Even if it was a sponsored free frame, they had a shipping order or something to say it was free from the manufacturer.
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the_weggie_man

Re: Buying bike w/ no title?
« Reply #11 on: March 14, 2003, 04:48:55 pm »
Custom bikes, kit bikes, etc. you should have recipts for the parts. Race bikes will have a statement of origin like a dirt bike.  Any street bike should have a title even if it's a salvage title.

Don't take the chance if you can't get any proof of ownership.  Get the vin# and have a copper run it to see if it's legal or not before you buy.  If the guy won't let you run the # you know something is wrong.  If the vin# is altered or missing .... stay away for sure.

A "good deal" on a bike isn't worth the trouble of getting busted for possessing stolen merchandise ..... and vehicle theft is a felony. :P

All those things that you know would never happen to you may just come up, like the copper on the road or the sweep at a race or just a tech guy thinking your vin# doesn't look right. That happened
a few years back at Blackhawk and if memory serves me the cops took the guy away in shiny bracelets.

And think of this ..... buying a bike your not sure of only makes the thieves look for more bikes to steal because they know there is a market for them.  You buy a stolen bike, you are the same as the thief in my book, because you are supporting their bullscat.
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