Grids by pre-entry

[CCSRacer114]

Anybody want to clue me in as to why CCS grids in N. FL are done by Pre entry and not points? I'm pretty sure I know why, I'm just dying to hear someone try to justify it.

1. It's Florida Region not North Florida Region.

2.  Rules are rules, learn to live with them.  Grids are by entry date.  My Moroso entry is already in the mail.

3.  Got a problem with big grids and people who are newbie racers... get points and get a white plate.... I did.

So, you alluded that you knew why we grid by entry date... what's your GUESS?

[fiptas]

1. It's Florida Region not North Florida Region.

2.  Rules are rules, learn to live with them.  Grids are by entry date.  My Moroso entry is already in the mail.

3.  Got a problem with big grids and people who are newbie racers... get points and get a white plate.... I did.

So, you alluded that you knew why we grid by entry date... what's your GUESS?

1. No shit, thanks for the tip.
 ::)
2. Yeah well the rule is bad, and causes real saftey issues that effect me.  Bad rules get changed when people speak up and force changes.
3. White plates are not going to change anything, they grid by the same system.


You seem to have trouble understanding the point so I'll state it again, in a different way.
In general faster riders will accumulate more points and be gridded at least near the front. With racers that finish further back or generally slower gridded in the later rows. It is safer, only a fool would argue otherwise. All the other orgs that I can think of realize this and use either points or qualifying to avoid the obvious safety risks of not sorting pace to some degree.  It also is supposed to be competitive road racing, not a battle of the fax machine or office assistants.
     As for why, the only reason I can think of for an Org to choose pre-entry grids given the above safety issues is money. Whether it's reduced staffing needs because "it's easier" or the large cash flow boost pre-entry's generate. As anybody in business knows getting paid in advance, sometimes months in advance in this case is the best of situations.

[PJ721]

just curious...since your tag line says you have a  WERA number I'm guessing you run with them...how do they grid?

[MELK-MAN]

ok.. if you KNOW your fast, you better PAY FIRST.. and it should not be a problem, cause your fast..  ;) It may be a way to get money up front, but they really don't "get" the money till after that race is run. Everyone has the opportunity to send in post dated checks to enter races at ANY time before the 1st race. Myself and others did, and it gets you an up front grid position. Also.. it was the 1st race of the season.. no points... How can you grid by points.. ;) No perfect way a doin things, but i like all my races on 1 day, and for now, the HD way is how i like it.

[Woofentino Pugrossi]

This has been hashed out over and over and over the last couple years.

Isnt gonna change.

[Eric Kelcher]

Actually Henry may still deposit checks and CC after the race; due to issues with NSF and declined credit cards CCS runs everything upon arrival at the office.

[fiptas]

just curious...since your tag line says you have a  WERA number I'm guessing you run with them...how do they grid?

Points. Those who have no points are gridded in entry order behind those that do. First race of the year is by position previous year followed by entry point. Like I said WERA, CMRA,  AHRMA, USGPRU, every org I can think of does points or qualifying, except CCS.

[Super Dave]

I believe that WERA grids by pre entry by points, then post entry.  Similar to AHRMA.  

Similar problems as gridding by entry.  

Unless you're qualifying for a race, there will be people in the back that are faster, and people at the front that are slower.  That's called racing.  

Racing expert does usually mean that the skill level of the riders is at a level of safety that IS above that of the Novice racers.  Accidents to happen.  That's called risk, and life is full of it.  

Unfamiliarity with a track or organization can breed a certain amount of discontent compared to the security blanket provided by previous experiences with other organizations.

As for enough people whining about grids in CCS...

The whining is about ten years old, maybe older, but it won't change.  There is no easy way to do it, period, for CCS.  It has not proven to be safer.  Kind of like proving that a DOT, SNELL, or BSI helmet is better than another.

Racing IS considered to be somewhat dangerous.  The alternatives are track days.  

[fiptas]

ok.. if you KNOW your fast, you better PAY FIRST.. and it should not be a problem, cause your fast..  ;) It may be a way to get money up front, but they really don't "get" the money till after that race is run. Everyone has the opportunity to send in post dated checks to enter races at ANY time before the 1st race. Myself and others did, and it gets you an up front grid position. Also.. it was the 1st race of the season.. no points... How can you grid by points.. ;) No perfect way a doin things, but i like all my races on 1 day, and for now, the HD way is how i like it.

You know, this isn't about whether I'm fast or not. The sad thing is I'm really not. It's about a very dangerous situation that is caused by the way CCS chooses to grid their races. As for the post dated check thing, I'd be interested to hear if that's true and doubt it. Your "supa star" status may have something to do with you being able to do that.  ;) The first race of the year is very easily handled through previous years finish position. Just think Greg, if you go to a WERA race this year the hard fought win you got at Jennings last year will actually mean something, and you will be assured a grid somewhere near the front.  
     I agree with you about the HD way. I much prefer the Saturday practice, Sunday race format and have found HD and staff to be professional and really nice folks. Most of the people in the pits have been the same, really good people. I guess that's why I got so torqued about it; the rule unnecessarily puts a lot of good people at risk. A change might be easier than you think.

[james-redsv]

I agree with fiptas, whats the big deal taking points into consideration when setting up the grids? I like that idea wheather or not you could say its safer or not. Why cant the guys that race the whole series and get more points be rewarded with better grid positions? It not some kind of super costly or hard thing to do. Simple really and would be an improvement over the current system. :o

[fiptas]

I believe that WERA grids by pre entry by points, then post entry.  Similar to AHRMA.  

Similar problems as gridding by entry.  

  

This is wrong as far as I know; I post entered at the track a couple of times and still was gridded according to points. I'll confirm though.
     As for the rest, like everything in this thread, a bunch of BS weak rationalizations that never respond to the point. Everyone knows racing is dangerous. That has nothing to do with the issue. Why does an Org knowingly cause a very unsafe situation to happen? What is so compelling about pre-entry?
    Anyway I'm done. It's clear that y'all lemmings are content with getting bent over and would rather sit around medicating each other's ass instead of doing something about it.

[Super Dave]

This goes toward the arguement that certain places are more unsafe than others.

Often, there are no facts to back it.

Starts, by themselves, are probably the most dangerous opportunity on a racing surface.  

Case in point, after all these years, my biggest start incident that I was involved in was during an AMA Pro road race.  That has qualifying.  That's a whole lot of races that I can use to generalize upon.

The organizations that you used as examples don't put on as many races as CCS.

And as a guy that races with ARHMA with an occasional frequency...

Because the guy won the championship, it doesn't make him fast.  When you're dodging him when he takes an odd line going into turn one at Daytona...  AHRMA has had some pretty good incidents involving riders that didn't have points coming from the back getting collected by riders up front that had points from the previous season.