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Author Topic: How do you decide which classes to run? I'm from WERA  (Read 2304 times)

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KneeScraper

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How do you decide which classes to run? I'm from WERA
« on: January 23, 2011, 11:55:01 am »
 I raced WERA in 2010 as a Novice.  I ran C SuperStock, C SuperBike, B SuperBike, and SR SBK MW NV in WERA.  I usually ran 4 sprint races on Sunday, and work schedule permitting, would run two SOLO 20 races on Saturday.  I got bumped to Expert for 2011. 
 
I am still racing WERA for 2011, however, I am also going to try CCS.  I live in central PA and will most likely be racing at Summit Point and NJMP, however, I may go to other locations as well.  I am not running ASRA.
 
My racebikes are a 2008 R6 and a 2009 R6, both r models, not the s model, with the typical suspension upgrades/bolt-ons, pipe/fuel management upgrades, and stock displacement.  I will be 41 years old by the time I saddle up for the 2011 season.  The 2011 CCS rulebook is not online, or at least I haven't found it.  According to the 2010 rules, my age, and my race bikes, I am eligible for the following classes:
 
Middleweight SuperSport Expert
Heavyweight SuperSport Expert
Unlimited SuperSport Expert
Middleweight SuperBike Expert
Heavyweight SuperBike Expert
Unlimited Superbike Expert
Middleweight Grand Prix Expert
Unlimited Grand Prix Expert
Formula Forty Expert
 
My first question:  Other than looking into who is paying what for contingency, how do most of you decide which classes to run?  Should I run the SS class, the SBK class, and the Grand Prix class in middleweight and only run with the middleweight classes?  Or should I run the heavyweight and/or Unlimited classes as well as middleweight, sticking to just SS and DOT race tires, or just stick to SBK and run slicks and a few of the Grand Prix classes in each displacement class?  How common is it for 600’s to run in the Unlimited classes?  I imagine that other than a few GSXR750’s, the Heavyweight classes are full of 600’s.
 
BTW, I will run the Formula 40 Expert class.
 
My second question:  I am not sure how the three different levels (SS, SBK, Grand Prix) actually break down on the grid, specifically in regard to attendance and importance.  Is it common for guys to run the SS and SBK classes and not run the Grand Prix classes, or is it common for most guys to run the SBK and Grand Prix classes and not run the SS classes?  Or do most guys just run their own displacement class and skip running in classes above their bikes’ displacement?  In other words, which classes are a priority?
 
I am looking forward to your personal input.  In our WERA classes for each different displacement class, we just have SS and SBK, we don't have a third Grand Prix class, although we do run Formula 1 which is unlimited displacement, although it isn’t what I call a “priority class” to race.  I am wondering if most of your priority classes are SS and SBK.  (WERA's Formula 2 will not permit current 600 SuperSport bikes)
 
My third question:  For a typical race weekend, what type of races run on Saturday?  I am guessing all the sprint races run on Sunday, or do you guys run sprint races on Saturday and on Sunday?  In WERA, we run SOLO 20 races on Saturday, and they are typically 20 lap races, and we run our sprint races on Sunday.
 

Yeah, I know.  Long post with lots of questions.  See you on the grid this summer!

SVbadguy

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Re: How do you decide which classes to run? I'm from WERA
« Reply #1 on: January 23, 2011, 01:00:14 pm »
There are a lot of factors for what classes some races in, based on ranging from racing for fun to racing for the overall regional championship.  Money is another factor- both what you have to spend and what you could earn.

Someone racing for the overall championship with a 600 may enter every MW, HW and UNL race.  Some guys will just do two races per weekend.  You could choose them based on how competitive you think you would be or which ones have the most money/contingency to gain.

Take a look at last year's results for any of the tracks you plan on racing and you can see the grid size and composition.
http://www.ccsracing.us/schedules/2010/2010schedule.html

GT races are usually the first races run on Saturday followed by maybe 7 sprints. At national events that's followed by qualifying.
Sunday is all sprints and Team Challenge when it's on the schedule.

There have been a few occasions where GT races have been run on Sunday.
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ahastings

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Re: How do you decide which classes to run? I'm from WERA
« Reply #2 on: January 23, 2011, 01:47:01 pm »
the heavyweight grids are usually a little smaller then the mw grids and just like wera just another 600 race with a couple 750s. as for unlimited, now that you are an expert dont waste your time on a 600. the SS classes usually have the best contingency. pretty much same as WERA. you also have GTU and GTO on Sat which are same as wera solos but with no cash purse. CCS has no vintage, so there are some sprints on sat also. usually mw gp is one of them.
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Re: How do you decide which classes to run? I'm from WERA
« Reply #3 on: January 24, 2011, 02:41:28 pm »
I think the question is what's your ultimate goal(s)?

If it's just to get a crapload of track time then enter races based on how they fall on that weekend's event schedule, for example some people like back to back races, others hate them.

If it's to try and place as well as possible in individual races your probably going to have the best luck in the lower entry classes (unless your a top 5 finisher at the Expert level, then enter whatever).

BUT.....if your looking for a championship everything gets all screwy due to how that system is set-up with a Performance Index (P/I) calculation which drags down ALL the points you earn. Unfortunately your averaged P/I (for ALL the eligible races you've run for the entire season) is applied against ALL the points you earn for the season, which means that ANY bad finish you have will drag down your overall P/I and cause you to lose even more points (points that you had already earned in other races). Due to that the most important thing when chasing a championship is to get the highest P/I you can achieve in EVERY race you run, avoid ANY class that you can't get a high P/I in. Another thing is the significance of the number of entries in any class, the less people in a race the greater the drop in P/I from one finishing position to the next. As an example, finishing 3rd in a race with only 5 racers would cause just as much damage to your overall P/I as finishing 13th in a race with 30 racers - the only difference would be that you earned 14 extra points in the race that you finished 3rd. With the way its set-up now, finishing higher in individual races that have more racers racing in them is far more beneficial toward a championship.

As a real world example let's say you ran 100 individual races so far in a season earning 2200 total points and an averaged .900 P/I, that means your adjusted points would be 1980 (2200 x .900). If you then entered a race with 30 racers and finished last (for example you crashed) you not only wouldn't earn any points, far worse you would only get a P/I of .033 for that race. If you averaged that 1 single bad finish P/I in with your 100 good finishes it would drop your overall averaged P/I down to .89142 which means that your 2200 overall points would no longer be worth the 1980 points that they were worth going into that race, they would now only be worth 1961.12 points (2200 x .89142) - so by racing that single race and having a bad result it COST YOU 18.88 points. In fact in order to even leave that race with at least as many adjusted points as you had going into it (thru a combination of P/I and earning more points) you would have to place 15th in that race.

Even though I don't agree with the system being set-up the way it is, I've still taken the time to understand it's larger impact on overall points. I personally believe that averaged P/I is bad for racing since it encourages people not to race extra classes they know they may not do well in. I think a far better system would apply each individual race results P/I to the points acquired in that race only - that would encourage racers to run as many races as possible and only penalize a bad finish in reduced points paid out for that individual finish, not taking away points that you all ready earned in previous races. But that's a whole different issue that's been discussed elsewhere.

Hope this helps!  :thumb:
« Last Edit: January 24, 2011, 10:39:11 pm by GSXR RACER MIKE »
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KneeScraper

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Re: How do you decide which classes to run? I'm from WERA
« Reply #4 on: January 25, 2011, 11:15:43 am »
Thanks for the info, guys.  I have only raced one year in WERA and have been bumped to expert, so I really doubt I'll be running in the top 5.  I also had never even heard of the performance index points adjustment.  Based on what was posted here, I completely agree that someone chasing a championship would shy away from entering additional classes.  To me, based on what was posted here, that just sounds stupid.  I don't see the point in even having a points index, but if it has to be implemented, I agree, their should be a separate P/I for each class entered.  I like to see full grids, and this P/I as I understand it would prevent me from entereing an additional class if I were chasing points.

I think I will stick with the MW and HW classes in SS and SBK.  Sounds like I'll stay away from Grand Prix.  I'll run the Formula 40 too.  Thanks guys! :biggrin:

George_Linhart

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Re: How do you decide which classes to run? I'm from WERA
« Reply #5 on: January 25, 2011, 11:52:51 am »
The Performance Index was a response to racer's complaints that regional championships were just buying the trophy by entering more races than others could afford.  Now you can't just enter more races, you have to finish well in more races.  You absolutely can not show up an do 1 lap of a race just to pick up points.

George

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Re: How do you decide which classes to run? I'm from WERA
« Reply #6 on: January 25, 2011, 12:29:03 pm »
To add to what George said, the system was more or less designed to heavily reward good results with a higher averaged P/I and more adjusted points, the problem is the way it's structured it also backfired by penalizing even consistently good finishers averaged P/I and all their previously earned points if they didn't finish well in even a few races during the season (for example they crashed, had bike problems, didn't finish well in a class they normally didn't run, etc.).

Nice concept, it just needs to be tweaked like I mentioned in the earlier post. In my opinion a racer shouldn't ever be penalized for running extra classes or attempting to race harder and crashing or not finishing well as a result. By fixing the system if you didn't do well in a race you would either earn a minimal amount of points or none at all, but at least you wouldn't be losing points you already earned in previous races.

Hopefully someday the P/I system will get fixed!  :thumb:
Smites are a cowards way of feeling brave!   :jerkoff:
Mike Williams - 2 GSXR 750's
Former MW Region Expert #58
Racing exclusively with CCS since '96
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ahastings

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Re: How do you decide which classes to run? I'm from WERA
« Reply #7 on: January 25, 2011, 02:57:18 pm »
The perf index is only used for calculation of overall awards. It is not used in determining  individual class championships . Due to ccs points system it is needed to make the overall championship more meaningfull
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KneeScraper

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Re: How do you decide which classes to run? I'm from WERA
« Reply #8 on: January 26, 2011, 12:32:26 am »
Ahhh.  I see both sides of the story.  I had no idea that CCS had a P/I. 

Some food for thought.  I'll leave it there.  I sense that I may have stirred up a hornets nest that has recently settled....... :biggrin: