Is this true? (Hayden injured)

[JBraun]

'me-me-me'.....  I caught alot of that in his interviews as well, especially the statement "I took Rossi's crown away from him"

the first thing hayden said on the podium was "thanks to everyone who helped me get here"
And he did take Rossi's title, why can't he say it?

I was pissed about the way he treated the flag though, I believe it was an honest mistake, but one he shouldn't make. Nicky has run a yellow ribbon on his lid all year, and is generally a patriotic guy, but someone needs to teach him about flag etiquitte.

[K3 Chris Onwiler]

Try racing a Moto GP round with a fractured shoulder causing such pain that you can hardly lift your arm to reach the handle bars - and then make sure you hold the flag nice and high while controlling the bike on the cool down lap.

Spoken like someone who'd know a thing or two about racing with pain....
It didn't help that whoever handed Nicky the flag out on course gave it to him upside down.   Hey, he won the championship.  A championship is a test of endurance, and it damn well should be.  You get a #1 trophy every time you win a race.  You get a championship for doing best over the long haul.
So Nicky isn't fit to wash out Rossi's jock strap, right?  Vali hasn't beaten Nicky at Laguna.  Nobody has.  "Oh, but Nicky has home field advantage there!"  Yeah, and all the MotoGP regulars don't have more experience at all the rest of the tracks on the circuit?  Some of them since they were children on 125cc bikes?  Nicky did it the best this year.  That's all there is to it.

[GSXR RACER MIKE]

Again, I didn't really want to get into a debate about this because I'm not a Nicky hater (I'm just not a big fan), but I find the support of Nicky getting the championship rather strange and based more on liking him as a person more than anything. The reason I say this is due to the years of whining and crying about the CCS championships not being fair because it ultimately penalized racers who occasionally win and crash out at other races and rewarded those riders who were CONSISTENT but may not have won at all and ran more classes. Using the 'new formula' that CCS used for it's regional championships in 2006 (which rewards people who win occasionally but may not finish all the races) Rossi would have been the winner after the adjusted points were calculated using performance index - Rossi with apx 230 points and Hayden at apx 221 points. It just seems so hypocritical to me that so many of you guys complained so strongly about the previous CCS 'points only' system being so unfair, yet applying the new 'more fair' CCS points/performance index championship system to this seasons MotoGP results and Rossi would have been the winner. Again, I'm not a big Rossi fan either!

The following is a collection of facts I compiled and posted on another forum, I just thought it would be fitting here as well (interpret as you will, but the numbers speak pretty loudly for themself):

Nicky Hayden
Total Points (2006) = 252 (apx 221 by CCS formula)
avg points per race completed = 15.75
races completed = 16 / DNF's = 1
total points if no DNF's (based on average) = 268

Points per race (2006)
16-20-16-20-11-16-20-25-9-16-25-7-13-11-11-0-16
Races won in 2006 = 2

Total number of road racing championships in last 10 years = 3
2006 MotoGP / number of races won = 2
2002 AMA Superbike / number of races won = 9
1999 AMA 600 Supersport / number of races won = 5

**********************************************

Valentino Rossi
Total Points (2006) = 247 (apx 230 by CCS formula)
avg points per race completed = 17.64
races completed = 14 / DNF's = 3
total points if no DNF's (based on average) = 300

Points per race (2006)
2-25-13-0-0-25-25-8-20-25-0-20-25-16-20-20-3
Races won in 2006 = 5

Total number of road racing championships in last 10 years = 7
2005 MotoGP / number of races won = 11
2004 MotoGP / number of races won = 9
2003 MotoGP / number of races won = 9
2002 MotoGP / number of races won = 11
2001 MotoGP / number of races won = 11
1999 250 GP / number of races won = 9
1997 125 GP / number of races won = 11

[Team_Serpent]

Again, I didn't really want to get into a debate about this

To late 

I find the support of Nicky getting the championship rather strange and based more on liking him as a person more than anything.

Huh?  Maybe in your mind.  I doubt most fans know Nicky as a person and know whether or not they like him on a personal level.  Although the way he has handled himself while in the public eye has given most fans the impression that he is a good person.

The reason I say this is due to the years of whining and crying about the CCS championships not being fair because it ultimately penalized racers who occasionally win and crash out at other races and rewarded those riders who were CONSISTENT but may not have won at all and ran more classes. Using the 'new formula' that CCS used for it's regional championships in 2006 (which rewards people who win occasionally but may not finish all the races) Rossi would have been the winner after the adjusted points were calculated using performance index - Rossi with apx 230 points and Hayden at apx 221 points. It just seems so hypocritical to me that so many of you guys complained so strongly about the previous CCS 'points only' system being so unfair, yet applying the new 'more fair' CCS points/performance index championship system to this seasons MotoGP results and Rossi would have been the winner. Again, I'm not a big Rossi fan either!

Hey, guess what - we're not talking CCS club racing, we're talking Moto GP!  You know the guys that do this full time.  Hello, anybody in there? 

The following is a collection of facts I compiled and posted on another forum, I just thought it would be fitting here as well (interpret as you will, but the numbers speak pretty loudly for themself):

Nicky Hayden
Total Points (2006) = 252 (apx 221 by CCS formula)
avg points per race completed = 15.75
races completed = 16 / DNF's = 1
total points if no DNF's (based on average) = 268

Points per race (2006)
16-20-16-20-11-16-20-25-9-16-25-7-13-11-11-0-16
Races won in 2006 = 2

Total number of road racing championships in last 10 years = 3
2006 MotoGP / number of races won = 2
2002 AMA Superbike / number of races won = 9
1999 AMA 600 Supersport / number of races won = 5

**********************************************

Valentino Rossi
Total Points (2006) = 247 (apx 230 by CCS formula)
avg points per race completed = 17.64
races completed = 14 / DNF's = 3
total points if no DNF's (based on average) = 300

Points per race (2006)
2-25-13-0-0-25-25-8-20-25-0-20-25-16-20-20-3
Races won in 2006 = 5

Total number of road racing championships in last 10 years = 7
2005 MotoGP / number of races won = 11
2004 MotoGP / number of races won = 9
2003 MotoGP / number of races won = 9
2002 MotoGP / number of races won = 11
2001 MotoGP / number of races won = 11
1999 250 GP / number of races won = 9
1997 125 GP / number of races won = 11

Look, no one is saying that Nicky has accomplished more than Rossi during their racing career or won more races in 2006.  So, nice collection of facts but they don't change a thing.  Nicky is champion this year!  Isn't it great to have an American back on top of the world?  Something about Nicky must have really have gotten under your skin to be so negative about this. 

[spyderchick]

And one thing no one seems to be talking about is that there were 4...count them...4 Americans in the top 10 in MotoGP points.

I like Vale, but he made mistakes, he had some bad luck. And no, we are not using CCS style points, we are using MotoGP points, which is all that matters today.

I also think it says alot about Nicky's determination to win, because it would have been so easy to whine about his injury before the race, so that he would have had an excuse. He gave no excuses, he went and performed. Vale crashed. That, my friends is why we run the races. It not about percenption, it's about performance.

Next year will be a new day with the machines be re-engineered and all that good stuff. Vale can bring it, Nicky can bring, and so can the rest of the competitors.

[Team_Serpent]

And one thing no one seems to be talking about is that there were 4...count them...4 Americans in the top 10 in MotoGP points.

I like Vale, but he made mistakes, he had some bad luck. And no, we are not using CCS style points, we are using MotoGP points, which is all that matters today.

I also think it says alot about Nicky's determination to win, because it would have been so easy to whine about his injury before the race, so that he would have had an excuse. He gave no excuses, he went and performed. Vale crashed. That, my friends is why we run the races. It not about percenption, it's about performance.

Next year will be a new day with the machines be re-engineered and all that good stuff. Vale can bring it, Nicky can bring, and so can the rest of the competitors.

Here, Here!  and from what I've read Hopper and the new Suzuki look to be very fast.

[JBraun]

  Rossi would have been the winner after the adjusted points were calculated using performance index

I'm tired of hearing "if Rossi"

Rossi didn't, Nicky did.

Hayden is world champion. No one stacked the deck in his favor and the rules weren't changed for him. He went out and did what he had to do to be champion. End of story.

He is no less a champion than Rossi was in 2001. Now we get to see if he can carry the torch.

[JoeNashville]

I have to admit that I was REALLY disappointed in Nicky's disrespect of the American flag when he got the championship. Watch the cool down lap and the flag is hitting the ground as he has it wadded up, then it's dragging on the tire and chain and almost got sucked into the countershaft sprocket. To top it all off I saw a 'tribute' video to his championship and it showed Nicky's bike in winners circle with the American flag laying on the ground where a certain someone tossed it, all I can say is  ?

I have trouble respecting a guy that doesn't represent his own country with pride and respect.

I agree with your concerns about the disrespect of the flag during Nicky's celebrations. Very painful to those of us who know and care about it. I cut Nicky some slack in this case and yes I am a Nicky fan. But the fact is virtually no one in his generation knows anything about how to properly display and care for the flag. In fact, most people who display it don't and disrespect the flag on a daily basis. All you have to do is look around. It started right after 9-11 with their zeal to display the flag and 'show' their patriotism without understanding what they were doing. I'm sure people mean well, but they don't have a clue. I had to let it go so my blood pressure would go back down.

On a lighter note, I think Nicky has much more to show and can't wait for next season. It should be one of the best years ever with so many great riders including all the Americans.

[catman]

Well said - the flag does deserve more respect all over,the moment was unfortunate but woohoo- 3 3 americans are IN THERE(top ten) and we got #1- S'all good! Thread too!

[GSXR RACER MIKE]

He is no less a champion than Rossi was in 2001.

Actually....

Rossi WON 11 races in 2001, so in my eyes that does indeed make him more of a champion than Nicky with only 2 wins in 2006! In fact EVERY season Rossi was champion he won AT LEAST 9 races. Just because someone gets a championship they are not by default as talented as someone else who got it, that's like saying there is no difference in talent between every winner in history when I think we all know that's not true. How about an example.

In 2003 I was running 4 classes all season long between the MW/GP/GL regions, due to money constraints I was at the back of the pack the entire season because I couldn't afford to be buying tires. Toward the end of the season I checked the points to find out that I was winning 9 individual class championships, Hell I was stomping on everybody in those classes (points wise at least)! Had I continued to race I would have easily won not only those 9 classes but possibly the other 3 as well since attrition was very high that season and I was in 2nd place in those 3 classes, that would have put me with up to 12 championships in 2003. Now according to your train of thought that means that I must have been one hell of a racer! But I wasn't, and I did the 'right thing' and didn't go to the last 3 events to let the other racers 'catch up' and pass me in the points, in fact in a few classes the other racers barely were able to pass me in the points by the end of the last event. This was utilizing a points only system like MotoGP that so many CCS racers had complained about as being unfair, how ironic.

I don't have a problem with Nicky catching the championship when Rossi stumbled and lost his grip on it, but to say that Nicky got it thru his abilities above and beyond Rossi's is not reality. Rossi is clearly the better, more winning rider, even if I don't especially like him (but definately respect him as a racer).

Something about Nicky must have really have gotten under your skin to be so negative about this. 

In a way your correct.

When Hayden got the AMA Superbike championship in 2002 on the RC51 (while competing against 750cc I-4's) there was alot of favoritism in the rules that year going to the 1000cc V-twins in general and against the I-4's. Tell me how the rules have been in Mladin's favor when he has won all his championships? Hell in Mladins case he has had the rules changed AGAINST him (more or less) in some cases, yet his domination was only broken by this single 'year of the twins' as I have heard it called (due to all the V-twin factory riders ironically doing so well that season). Hayden was just in the right place at the right time back then as well.

I greatly anticipate the 2007 MotoGP season, I think Nicky's crown will be "taken away from him", because in my opinion he only stumbled onto it thru Rossi's bad luck this year.   

[Mongo]

Sorry Mike but not a bit of what your "reasoning" is makes sense.  You either are champ or you are not.  There is no better champ.  Not sure what your issue with Nicky is but you obviously have one, if you feel I'm wrong try re-reading your posts.  There is nothing wrong with people being happy or excited a fellow American beat the best of the best of the sport we're in. You can't understand that?  That to me makes no sense nor does any of the other bs about how Rossi could have would have should have won.  Rossi's crash wasn't bad luck.  Pedrosa crashing out Nicky was.  Rossi's earlier mechanical issues were not. 

But hey, whatever helps you keep the hate alive I guess. 

[GSXR RACER MIKE]

Mongo,

So then you also believe that I would have been the deserving champion of up to 12 championships in 2003 as I described and I made the wrong decision by stepping back and letting the BETTER riders have them? All I did was follow the rules of the game and my consistency showed thru, but there's no way I deserved to be the champion in all those classes, I was sorry ass slow. That was the very reasoning behind CCS changing the rules to more heavily reward those who win and penalize those who don't.

My issue isn't specifically with Nicky, it's with his type, time for another example. I work with people who are in positions of great power within a $100 million dollar a year company, applying the thinking you guys seem to have would mean that those people in those positions are the best for them? Yet things like what your last name is, who's ass your head is up, how deep your throat is, and who's back your willing to stab have far more to do with success than anything from what I have seen in the last 18 years of employment with them. The people in positions of power are there because they did the things required to get there, no matter how incorrect. Again, my issue is with the situations he's been in which resulted in him getting championships, not really him as a person so much (other than that blattent flag disrespect! ). I just don't look at him as a true champion, hell the guy couldn't even hold his head up with pride and look at the camera during the interviews after he won  ? I've never seen any other MotoGP champion do that.