Kaw 650R Ninja vs. SV650

[russ1962]

Looking for opinions and knowledge.  Selling my 636 and looking to "step down" a bit, and wonder which of these bikes is the best to buy for 2006.

Opinions?

(my 636 is for sale in the classifieds)
http://www.racemotorcycles.com/cgi-bin/board/YaBB.pl?board=ccsclass;action=display;num=1138991290

Russ

[ninelives59]

roadracing worlds new issue will cover all your questions.They have an article on both this month.

[russ1962]

....  and how about the SV650 vs. the SV650S?

What's the difference, besides the 650S being about $550 more?

Russ

[tshort]

Just read a review about this in current issue of Cycleworld - sounds like it will be off the pace considerably compared to SV, at least in terms of stock HP and 1/4 mile figures.

[grasshopper]

The SV at "THIS" point in time is the better way to go. There is more aftermarket backup for the SV, more knowledge about setup, tips, and tricks. The aftermarket is endless.

Time will tell if the following will be the same for the little Kawasaki.

Go with the SV, buy one all race prepped, you should be able to find one for a decent price this time of year

[Super Dave]

I think Russ will probably start with a clean, reliable new one that he can have professionally race prepped by the people he's worked with for some time.  And who've done some good work in the past.

Russ, I don't think anyone really knows.  The Kawi's make more power in the 600 class than Yami's and Suzuki's...but there aren't a lot of them winning under consistent conditions locally.  

So, although the RRW article does say that in street trim they are different, with the Suzuki having an advantage, until some get out there, I don't think anyone can really say.

Some clip-ons, shock and fork work, proper geometry, race tires, etc...

Hey, they race Harley's too.

Russ, does your wife have something to do with the ability to get autograph cards made?

[PJ721]

RRW puts the SV above the Kawi for track/race use....

[lbk]

On top of the article, the things I noticed about the Kawi looking at one in a dealership are.

First I don't know how you'd get a set of clip on's on that bike. Second those rearsets are just going to be a pain for aftermarket guys which will probably mean a higher price. Non adjustable front forks, that even worse than the stock SV front end.

As far as the SV goes, Did they ever get the engine failures resolved on the newer models?

SV's are great bikes if they haven't resolved the engine troubles go with a first gen. You can find them dirt cheap ready to go, and still competitive.

[Zac]

On top of the article, the things I noticed about the Kawi looking at one in a dealership are.

First I don't know how you'd get a set of clip on's on that bike. Second those rearsets are just going to be a pain for aftermarket guys which will probably mean a higher price. Non adjustable front forks, that even worse than the stock SV front end.

Clip ons won't fit with stock bodywork, but I know the Catalyst bodywork (and probably most others) is designed around clip-ons.  The rearsets won't be a big deal either, once you remove the stock ones, the aftermarket ones will be pretty conventional and similar to most other bikes.  I'm currently machining up a set, and I've seen another 650R with simple adapter plates to allow rearsets from another bike to fit.

I think the Kawi has a lot of potential.  The engine is super compact.  I haven't read the RRW article yet, but most of the magazine complaints I've read all concerned things that the average racer would change (handlebars, rearsets, brakepads, heavy choking exhaust, shock, fork internals).  In full supersport trim I don't think it will be at any disadvantage to a similarly prepared SV.

We are currently starting up a spec class for the bike with ASMA (very limited mods, even requiring the stock exhaust), so we'll see how they work.

-z.

[lbk]

Clip ons won't fit with stock bodywork, but I know the Catalyst bodywork (and probably most others) is designed around clip-ons.  The rearsets won't be a big deal either, once you remove the stock ones, the aftermarket ones will be pretty conventional and similar to most other bikes.  I'm currently machining up a set, and I've seen another 650R with simple adapter plates to allow rearsets from another bike to fit.

I think the Kawi has a lot of potential.  The engine is super compact.  I haven't read the RRW article yet, but most of the magazine complaints I've read all concerned things that the average racer would change (handlebars, rearsets, brakepads, heavy choking exhaust, shock, fork internals).  In full supersport trim I don't think it will be at any disadvantage to a similarly prepared SV.

We are currently starting up a spec class for the bike with ASMA (very limited mods, even requiring the stock exhaust), so we'll see how they work.

-z.

Ok, but what about the subframe and frame being one? That's going to be an expensive fix in case of a crash, and no option to lose weight by switching to an aluminum subframe.

I'm not trying to rip on the bike, I like it and was excited to see it in, but there it definitely has some items that I wouldn't be too fond of.

Also I read about the spec class for them, that's actually pretty exciting to me, and if it takes off and there are enough riders on the grid, that could definitely be a fun racing experience.

[damico]

lbk beat me to the punch. Bending the subframe on the kwak would suck. You could cut it off and weld (easy cuz the frame is steel) tabs to mount a different subframe but then is it still ss legal?
The crank in parrallel twins is always a sore spot at high stress levels, it looks like a jump rope ( the big arch). If you build them big or rev the piss out of it the tend to brake. Ask Brian Lacy about this he used to race an EX and had lots of failures.

[weggie_man]

For this year the SV has to be the way to go.

I know some WERA people are planning to run the Kaw. Wait a year and see what comes of that one. Maybe Kaw will step it up next year.