Amateur, Expert, what have you....

[Ohfugit]

Speaking as someone who is looking to get started
A novice class sounds great...
Where do I sign  ;D

[Super Dave]

Ok, so let's start on the starter program.

We can call it Novice for our purposes here.

After successful competion of a riding school, a racer becomes a novice.

Racing classes:  Lightwieght Sport, Middleweight Sport, Heavyweight Sport, and Lightweight Solo and Heavyweight Solo.  

Riders may not "bump up" into larger displacement cateories.

Saturday events...
Lightweight Sport - rules as per Lightweight Grand Prix

Middleweight Sport - rules as per Middleweight Grand Prix

Heavyweight Sport - rules as per Unlimited Grand Prix

Sunday events...
Lightweight Solo - rules as per Lightweight Sport with 50% more laps than Sport races.

Heavyweight Solo - rules a per Middleweight and Heavyweight Sport with 50% more laps that Sport races.

(We need to give riders two race opportunities?)

As per CCS's program, two entries would cost $120...includes practice.  Pay your gate fee...you're racing for less than a cost of a track day.

No points structure.  Certificates of accomplishment for top ten.

Minimum stay as "novice" two event weekends?

Maximum?  Although I wanted to place a maximum time on this, no I'm almost reconsidering.  Maybe there is a class of racer that would race with such infrequency that they may never learn a whole lot.  At some point, a rider would just be too fast for it, I suppose, but that rider might be lured by contingency in Expert Sportsman?

Any thoughts on this?

[motomadness]

Hmmm.  Sounds familiar.  Sounds good to me.  You can get your feet wet while not worrying about your equipment.  It's almost like track day races.

Here's a novel idea, start holding race schools at track days, then market the novice class to the track day guys to draw them without making it too expensive.  I think the track day rider is concern with tire life in terms of days, not races, so this format might be attractive to them.

[Super Dave]

Hmmm.  Sounds familiar.  Sounds good to me.  You can get your feet wet while not worrying about your equipment.  It's almost like track day races.

Here's a novel idea, start holding race schools at track days, then market the novice class to the track day guys to draw them without making it too expensive.  I think the track day rider is concern with tire life in terms of days, not races, so this format might be attractive to them.

Yeah, I'm lifting ideas now...LOL!  Made sense.  It was simple while keeping things segregated and giving that extra ride.  Doesn't need to be 25 or 30 minutes, but a little longer would be good.

Having schools at track days....

Yeah, it should be that way.  But I have to assume that CCS's expense in doing so would be cost prohibitive.  It's a money maker for them, it's a money maker for the guys that teach the simple program.

[motomadness]

Why couldn't schools be on Fridays?  The upside would be in favor of the newbie getting two days to race and enjoy the experience.  I don't think you'd get any fewer people just because it's a Friday.  Track days guys go to events that are held during the week all of the time.

Of course, my comments relate more to the ideal situation.

[Super Dave]

Why could schools be on Fridays?  The upside would be in favor of the newbie getting two days to race and enjoy the experience.  I don't think you'd get any fewer people just because it's a Friday.  Track days guys go to events that are held during the week all of the time.

Of course, my comments relate more to the ideal situation.

You can't have Blackhawk on Fridays, for a quick example.

Keep it easy.  Yeah, you'd like it, but that adds another day of rental to the track and staff.  Big $$.  

[Super Dave]

Ok, here's some ideas for the "Pro Expert" racing classes.  Currently, I think I counted seventeen or eighteen classes...this would reduce it in half.

Thunderbike - Yeah, same.
Sportbike Light - LWSS rules
Grand Prix Light - LWGP rules

Sportbike - MWSS rules
Formula Grand Prix - MWGP rules

Formula Sportbike - HWSS rules
Unlimited Sportbike - ULSS rules

Unlimited Grand Prix - ULGP rules

Increase the laps by 50% over current sprints.

Eliminate GTL, GTU, and GTO from the "pro expert" schedule...

With the reduction in classes, qualifying could be done for particular categories -smaller bikes, larger bikes?  Numbers in the field?  Two to three sessions...your one qualifying lap on that bike is your time for all your races that you ride that bike in...that would keep a rider from having to try and manage three tires or something for three qualifying sessions.

How about a Purse that pays from first to fifteenth?

$350 for the win with fifteenth getting $50.

Expert Sportsman...

Keep the basic format as current, basically...Include the F40's, Supertwins, UltraLWSB, GT's with certs, etc...

Does one combine LWSB and LWGP...and MWSB and MWGP?

125's?  How about a combined Sportsman/Pro expert field?  Small purse for top five like a GT?

[OmniGLH]

Well, racing isn't supposed to be a cake walk, now is it?

C O M P E T I T I O N

That's what it is.

 

Racing is absolutely NOT supposed to be a cakewalk.  Racing is one of the few places left that you still have a WINNER and everyone else walks away with a relative ranking.  Kids who play soccer games where they don't keep score... schools who don't do grades... without that, what exactly is supposed to inspire to you want to do better?  

No one "deserves" to win, IMO.  If you want to win, then you have to do what it takes to get yourself up on top.  Some folks may never get there - due to talent, budget, desire... and that's just the way the cookie crumbles.  

[Super Dave]

Ok, here's a new version of the rules that I was working on...

2.2.4 Riders will be issued Regional Series licenses as Novice, Sportsman, or Expert  
 
A.  CCS Officials will issue Expert licenses to those riders with proven experience or ability as follows:
 
(1.)  Applicats who are renewing a CCS Expert license or who are applying with an Expert license from one of the racing organizations listed in 2.2.1  
 
B.  CCS Officials will issue Sportsman licenses to those riders with safe and reasonable ability and experience as follows:
 
(1.)  Applicants who are renewing a CCS Amateur (as per current nomenclature) or who are applying with an amateur license from one of the racing organizations listed in section 2.2.1  
 
(2.)  Any Novice Rider who in the opinion of CCS Officials has safe and reasonable ability.
 
C.  CCS Officials will issue Novice licenses to riders that meet any of the following criteria:
 
(1.)  Riders that are applying with Provisional Amateur/Novice licenses from one of the racing organizations listed in 2.2.1   
 
(2.)  Riders applying with a certificate indicating completion of an approved Riders School.
 
(3.)  Riders applying with a CCS Sport Rider card.  
 
2.2.5  STATUS CHANGES -  Riders who change in status during the season will not carry points to their new status  
 
A.  Expert riders will be granted the opportunity to be moved to Sportsman status.
  
B.  Sportsman riders must petition to be moved to Expert.  Riders who in the opinion of CCS Officials has the ability and reasonable experience for Expert competition will be moved to Expert.  CCS reserves the right to deny Expert Status to any Sportsman rider that may not meet this criteria.
 
C.  Sportsman riders may petition to be moved to Novice.  Riders must show proof of inexperience or a lapse in competition
 
D.  Novice riders will be offered the opportunity to move to Sportsman status with proof of safe and reasonable ability and experience after a minimum of two events.

[Super Dave]

My original thread of origin starts here....

http://www.racemotorcycles.com/cgi-bin/board/YaBB.pl?board=rules;action=display;num=1091400129

[Thingy]

Dave-

I really like the idea of reducing the number of classes and increasing the length of races.  I also like the idea of three skill levels.  However, I have a couple of comments.

1) While it would be nice to have a class for every single bike, CCS may have an issue with having several of the classes only have light attendance.  That is why they keep adding 600 classes.  They get the best turnout and therefore the most entry fees.  The new class structure will have to financially benefit CCS if there is to be change.  Although if the rules staed consistent like that, I would assume that riders would gravitate to the new classes.  (Is that like the factories and the AMA rules? :) )

2) (This sort of contradicts my first point.)  If a bike will be eligible for a class in CCS, I think it will need to be eligible for a minimum of two classes in order to get riders to attend for the weekend.  This should not be an issue for bikes that can race up a class.  (ie: 600s in the 750 class)  However, if I read the rules correctly, there would only be one race that an expert rider with a liter-bike could race in.  Is that correct.  There are only 3 classes that would work now.  That is not too bad, but I don't think just one would work.

Correct me if I am wrong, as I have not read the entire thread.  Also, feel free to give me crap for buying that dang 1000.  ;)

[Thingy]

Oops, there are two classes for a 1000.  I have not checked other classes yet.  Sorry Dave!