Qualifying

[motomadness]

 ;D

I'm game.  I posted a note about a year ago about a hostel take over of CCS.

Maybe what we should try to do is figure a way we can gain greater influence in the rule making and the future direction of CCS, especially related to rider skill level and race distance/purses.

[StumpysWife]

Food for thought...

Is this an amateur/expert problem in CCS or a CCS/AMA problem?  Guys that are competitive in AMA races are doing club-level stuff because that's where the money is.

There are pro classes now--it's FUSA and AMA.

Heather

[motomadness]

SDub (Stumpy's wife),

Good point.  Personally, I would like to live the fantasy of racing professionally, and being competitive, even if it not in the AMA.  Car racers can make a lot more money than motorcycle racers, while racing less than we do on weekends and participating in very small organizations.  Maybe it's the fans, manufacturers and the promoters that make small venue car racing so popular.  How do we get that racing where and how we do it?

[EX#996]

Car racers can make a lot more money than motorcycle racers, while racing less than we do on weekends and participating in very small organizations.  Maybe it's the fans, manufacturers and the promoters that make small venue car racing so popular.  How do we get that racing where and how we do?

Clarify this point.....

Are we talking Nascar vs. AMA? or are we talking at the club racing level?  

If it's the club level, where are you getting your data?  When my family was racing cars...  you MAY break even on a weekend, but it's still money out of your pocket.

Dawn  

[Super Dave]

First, Jim...

Yeah, the turn out at Gingerman is kind of a joke.

Car racing is very expensive.  For local races at Madison, Wisconsin, I had guys that would buy $14 a gallon race fuel from me to put in their $40k motors.  Haulers, trailer, tires, wheels, multple shock set ups...

For a purse kind of like Unlimited GP.

Racers running a program?

I'm sorry, but that's a joke.  AHRMA has a committee run their stuff.  People are elected, etc.  You need someone that is a dictator there to make decisions, right or wrong.  

If you went to the race track for a club race and polled twenty people about their suspension set up, I'd bet that you'd nearly come up with the wrong answers everytime.

Car racing is done like this....  You go to the people with real knowledge...a shop that specializes in this kind of racing, etc. and you talke with them and maybe work with them.  Bike racing seems to work like this...noob goes to his dealership and gets bad information, generally, and then gets maybe gets hooked up with the new amatuer champion...who might not know anything.  There is a great lack of respect, and sometimes contempt, for shops that have actually performed at the highest levels in motorcycle road racing.  There's this feeling that riders think that they are "new" or something and that they can "figure" it all out on their own.  

A smarter guy goes to a particular shop, and makes the investment.  Guy goes fast, now it's "'cause they go money..."  

Pro classes?  As an expert, you can buy your FUSA license...get some points and you can get your AMA license.

[motomadness]

Dawn,
I am not extremely familiar with car racing, but I saw a flyer for what looked to be a locally run and promoted event.  The purse was paid out to like 24th place.  It wasn't much money, but the concept of being able to pay purses so deep was the premise of my point.  Car racing itself is understandably more expensive, but that doesn't change my perception that a car racer can "win" more money than a motorcycle racer for racing less per weekend.  There's got to be a reason for it: higher fees, more and regular spectators, richer sponsorships.  The money's got to come from some where.

[motomadness]

Dave,

I've got my FUSA license, but that doesn't make me competitive.  I still have many things to learn.  For the last two seasons I have taken some risks with my choice of racing classes.  I was trying to teach myself things, mainly how to ride, then realized that I needed to settle my focus and get some help.  I also wanted become more embedded in the sport, so I've been attending as many pro races as I can afford to just so I can be exposed to what I think I want to aspire to.  

I firmly believe, it's not the tire choice, it's the riding technique and how you setup your bike that will make you faster.  An important part of that is whom you listen to.  I'd like to thank you for all of the attention you've given my racing effort.  I know it's largely because of your help that has helped me shave massive amounts of time off of my laps.  

For someone who really only started riding bikes 4 years ago, I'm not doing too bad.  

[Super Dave]

Sean, thanks.

Competitive...ah, good one...

Define it?

I started riding at eighteen years of age in August of 1986...Made the commitment to go racing that December, and started in April of 1987.

Being competitive has to do with personal victories often times.  Afterall, there is only one real winner.

Really, we're just competing against our bike, the track, and our lack of knowledge sometimes...some find the knowledge.  Others don't seek it out.

Amatuer/expert problem a CCS problem?

Good question.  It's been this way for a long, long time.  But has the market changed.  I remember once that a particular school program owner commented on how the bikes got faster and faster every year, but the noob lap time remained the same.  Take those bikes to the same places with the racers, and the times have dropped...not as much as you think, but they have dropped as the technological improvements came.

And I would agree...the "slower" riders have a reasonable set feel for how fast to go.  Might be related to a general average of physical reaction time...something.  Meanwhile, some riders know the places to get the set up knowledge, and then exploit it.  I'm not gifted.  I'm pretty average, but with my experience and knowing where to get more knowledge...I can go pretty quick.

Would having a good group of faster riders competing in an event that had a reasonable purse event after event be more attractive to a potential specator?  Would a reasonable purse be more attractive to certain riders?  Would some riders be satisfied with having more of a laid back racing structure?  

[motomadness]

Dave,

I won't say much in response to last set of questions, I want to see what others have to say.  I do see one underlying thread in all of your questions though, and that is that we are racers trying to "guess" what spectators (the none racing type) want to see at an event.  Are any of us good at guessing that?  How do we get "good" at it?

[Super Dave]

What do they want to see?

I'll run...

Who's seen a GSXR1000?  Yeah, big deal.  And Yosh GSXR1000 is certainly pretty interesting.  But Mladin hustling it around...now that's interesting.

Personalities are important.  What really blows is when the competition at some tracks rages around "points"...it's good to see someone win.  And go fast to do it.  Was it exciting to see the lap record get set?  The people doing it are part of the personalities.  It's good that we're at least getting some track side interviews at Blackhawk.  Puts a voice with the helmeted head.  Stuff like that is good.  

Local car tracks...those guys aren't Matt Kennseth or anything, but they come back week after week.  That's good...they are the personalities.

Good racing can breed personalities too.

[TZDeSioux]

Presentation is king. Our regional events might as well be junkyards.

[ecumike]

Maybe we should each pick a personality (characher) like the WWF has.  :)

That could make for some exciting racing. :D