Toyhaulers? Any 1/2 Ton owners out there using one

[OmniGLH]

An interesting sidenote for those who may be looking to purchase a new tow vehicle in IL - it seems if you get "D" plates (the big ones) at the time of purchase, you don't have to pay sales tax on the vehicle.

Requirements for the D plates - 180/yr (as opposed to 70) and you have to have the truck safety-inspected twice a year (local truck service place 15 minutes from my house does this for a $10 fee.)  I've gotta have this truck a long time before the increased cost of the plates exceeds the savings I'm getting from the elimination of sales tax.

[gpconcepts]

Hello All,

I have a 21 ft. toy hauler that I tow with my Expedition. I have no problems except that fuel mileage isn't so great. By the way, now that the AMA has killed my class, I am only going to race local races. Because of this my toy hauler is for sale. It's a 2000 Tahoe, with fiberglass sides. It's in excellent condition. I can send pictures to anyone interested. I want 12,000.00 for it and am located in Northern CA.  

Rich Denman
gpconcepts@hotmail.com

[GSXR RACER MIKE]

An interesting sidenote for those who may be looking to purchase a new tow vehicle in IL - it seems if you get "D" plates (the big ones) at the time of purchase, you don't have to pay sales tax on the vehicle.

Requirements for the D plates - 180/yr (as opposed to 70) and you have to have the truck safety-inspected twice a year (local truck service place 15 minutes from my house does this for a $10 fee.)  I've gotta have this truck a long time before the increased cost of the plates exceeds the savings I'm getting from the elimination of sales tax.

     I am going thru this very thing in upgrading my plate from 'B' to 'D' this week. I called the Illinois Secretary of State Police Department here in Rockford Illinois and asked a bunch of questions about truck plates. According to them you don't have to get the twice a year truck inspections until you go to an 'F' plate and don't need the medical card either. If you look at the truck book at the drivers facility they lead you to believe that you need those things for 'D' plates too. Also I was told the cost of the plate is $138 per year currently and only renews in July if I remember correctly, so I will be pro-rated for what's left on my current plate toward the new 'D' plate which will be in it's last quarter of use.

     I want to be legal, but when things are not made clear at the driver's license facility itself it really makes it difficult! :-/

[StuartV666]

Some other points worth noting, regarding tow vehicles (and toy haulers).

The GCWR (Gross Combined Weight Rating - i.e. the maximum weight allowed for truck and trailer combined) on all F250 and F350 SuperDuty trucks is 20,000 pounds. No matter whether it's Single or Dual Rear Wheel. The duallies can't pull more, they can just carry more weight in the bed - i.e. the GVWR is higher, but not the GCWR. The GCWR for new Chevy Duramax trucks is something like 23,500 and the Dodge Cummins HO is 23,000, I think.

As has already been noted, an F250 SuperDuty full of fuel and passengers is already pretty close to its 8800 pound GVWR - particularly if it's a crew cab 4x4 diesel. You can't legally tow jack squat with one. An F350 is only $600 (dealer invoice) more (for an otherwise-identical truck) and has a GVWR of 9900 pounds. And, despite some common opinions to the contrary, they are virtually identical trucks. The F350 has one extra leaf spring in the rear and 2" taller blocks between the axle and bed. So, it rides just as well as a 250. I just went from an '03 250 to an '04 350 precisely because of the increased carrying capacity for minimal money and no real downside.

As another data point, the trailer I just sold was a 6x12 V-nose, single axle. I weighed it once on the way home from a race. It had 2 race bikes, a 50cc pit bike, my rolling tool chest, a couple of canopies, and some miscellaneous odds and ends in it. It was 4,500 pounds. It won't be a very big toy hauler AT ALL that exceeds the weight ratings of a 1/2 ton truck when it is loaded with race gear.

lbk, it sounds like you're in a similar boat to me. I'm shopping for a toy hauler also. I want it to have sleeping quarters up front that are separate from the cargo and living areas. I want to be able to get up early on a race weekend and go about my day (including having other people coming and going from my trailer) without having to have myself or others traipsing through where my g/f is trying to sleep. Unfortunately, for a toy hauler like that, I haven't found any yet that are less than 27'. I.e. way too heavy for a 1/2 ton truck. You might want to just wait until you have upgraded your tow vehicle and use the pop-up in the meantime.

Oh, and finally, when people start telling you you need a 5th wheel because they "tow better", tell them they should check out the Hensley Arrow or the Pull-rite hitches for bumper-pull trailers. With either of those, a bumper-pull trailer will tow exactly as well as a 5th wheel.

- Stu

[Super Dave]

Pull-Rite hitches are $$...over a grand at cost, I believe.  And you'll only tow that one trailer.

For bigger trailers, T/H and cargo, get Dynamic Sway control and Weight Distribution.  That will save you from the sway that happens, especially with tiny little Expeditions, etc...

Or you can just buy a nice Ford E350 dually diesel bus...Cost me one tenth of the cost of what most people have.  My living quarters are mobile. 8)

[OmniGLH]

For bigger trailers, T/H and cargo, get Dynamic Sway control and Weight Distribution.  That will save you from the sway that happens, especially with tiny little Expeditions, etc...

SuperDave talked me into going with a weight distribution and dynamic sway control setup.  Got it about 50% installed now... I'll have it done tonight, we're going to Topeka with it.  I'll let everyone know how well it works... but from those I've spoken to, it's supposed to be DA BOMB.

[GSXR RACER MIKE]

SuperDave talked me into going with a weight distribution and dynamic sway control setup.  Got it about 50% installed now... I'll have it done tonight, we're going to Topeka with it.  I'll let everyone know how well it works... but from those I've spoken to, it's supposed to be DA BOMB.

     You have a 'V' nose trailer also don't you? Mine is a 8.5 x 26 and I made the mistake of not ordering the welded on brackets for the weight distribution system and the ones I have seen at the trailer/RV places won't work with mine. It sucks that I bought a weight ditribution system and can't use it without fabricating some special brackets, but since my current truck does well pulling it without, I haven't fab'ed anything up.

[OmniGLH]

You have a 'V' nose trailer also don't you? Mine is a 8.5 x 26 and I made the mistake of not ordering the welded on brackets for the weight distribution system and the ones I have seen at the trailer/RV places won't work with mine. It sucks that I bought a weight ditribution system and can't use it without fabricating some special brackets, but since my current truck does well pulling it without, I haven't fab'ed anything up.

Nope.  No V-nose.

http://www.kingpinracing.com/Pics/trailer/Trailer.htm

Our weight distribution kit was just a bolt-on (as opposed to weld-on.)  We had to move some of the wiring harness to get it to fit, but overall it's been a pretty simple installation so far.  The only thing I wasn't too crazy about, is that since the trailer uses a box-tube frame, we had to use (per the instructions) self-tapping bolts to mount the brackets.  But it wasn't bad... I'm just glad we didn't cross-thread anything.

[StuartV666]

Pull-Rite hitches are $$...over a grand at cost, I believe.  And you'll only tow that one trailer.

I don't believe that's correct. The price part is. Yes, they're expensive. But with a Pull-rite installed, you can hook up to any bumper pull trailer and get the benefit. The Pullrite works just like a 5th wheel or gooseneck hitch, except upside down. It still puts the trailer's weight right over the rear axle, which is what eliminates the sway. The Pull-rite just does it from underneath the bed, instead of on top.

The other option, which is equivalent in performance is the Hensley Arrow. Maybe that's what you're thinking of, Dave. But it's even more expensive. That installs on the trailer tongue. So, with that, anybody can pull the trailer, with no sway problems, but your tow vehicle can only pull that one trailer with no sway problems. Any other trailer would need its own anti-sway solution.

All that said, I could be wrong about any of it, as I don't own either and have never towed with either. I've just been doing a lot of shopping lately.

- Stu

[GSXR RACER MIKE]

    I am going thru this very thing in upgrading my plate from 'B' to 'D' this week. I called the Illinois Secretary of State Police Department here in Rockford Illinois and asked a bunch of questions about truck plates. According to them you don't have to get the twice a year truck inspections until you go to an 'F' plate and don't need the medical card either. If you look at the truck book at the drivers facility they lead you to believe that you need those things for 'D' plates too. Also I was told the cost of the plate is $138 per year currently and only renews in July if I remember correctly, so I will be pro-rated for what's left on my current plate toward the new 'D' plate which will be in it's last quarter of use.

     I want to be legal, but when things are not made clear at the driver's license facility itself it really makes it difficult! :-/

     I must correct my previous post about price for the 'D' plate here in Illinois. I said it was $138, which is correct, it WAS $138, but now it is as Jeff said and it's $188 per year! :o Along With my $110 per year for trailer plates this is rediculous! >:( >:( >:(

[Super Dave]

I don't believe that's correct. The price part is. Yes, they're expensive. But with a Pull-rite installed, you can hook up to any bumper pull trailer and get the benefit.

You'd have to take all the weight distributing equipement and anti-sway control from the trailer you use and then put it on the other trailer.  You've got to have the ball height correct, the weight distributing correct, and the sway part set...otherwise you'd have the pivot point moving near the rear axle and at the ball.

We're a dealer for the stuff.  I looked at it for my E350 bus...but it sits really low on a van...it would drag on the ground with my bus if I went into like a gas station with an odd entry.

The Pull-Rite set up is cool...

http://pullrite.com