Naked Bike Racing

[TiffineyIngram]

Racers are still getting the same amount of track time.  Same amount of practices (in fact, if they choose the LP Day option, they get an extra couple of rounds--but that is a choice), and race lengths have not been shortened.  And sport riders should get to spend time at a track on a race weekend.  What better way for them to meet racers and learn how a weekend really works?

[Super Dave]

I'll voice information that I can generalize upon.

It seems that there are the racers, and the track day guys.  They are different.  A minor few track day guys might some day try racing, maybe.  Racers might some day quit racing and might actually do track days.  

I haven't seen the track day crowd as an active farmland for racers.  They want to do something different.

Admittedly, I think racers feel impeded upon by the track day crowd.  If there is room to have track time for a sport rider program, that means that there always was time for racers for practice, etc.  I think since we do bear the extraordinary brunt of the financial responsibility for renting the track, we feel as though it is "ours" for the day.

Just a few years ago, we did have more practice time and rotations.  In the Midwest, we get to watch scooters race.  As an expert, I'd rather pay a bit more for my races, give me more purse races, get rid of some classes, and let the races go just a little longer.

It think it's more important to focus efforts into trying to maintain more racers in the industry that it is to try to farm out more.  Does that make sense?  Ultimately, a older racer is much better at making an impression on a potential racer than any kind of mailing or sport rider day.  Thoughts?

[james-redsv]

I came into racing from doing track days, and I still do track days as well. For some people racing is the next step up from track days, some, :o but not most. I do agree CCS should stick to racing and leave the track days to other groups. SuperDave, we do need to get more people involved in racing, if it were up to you only old guys would race and there wouldnt be any new people at all. How can this sport survive like that. :o

[Super Dave]

SuperDave, we do need to get more people involved in racing, if it were up to you only old guys would race and there wouldnt be any new people at all. How can this sport survive like that. :o

No, I don't think you recognize what I'm saying.

In business, you focus yourself on keeping your current customers (the racers with licenses), but you do put something toward getting new ones.  But, it costs way more to try and get new customers.  

The "standard" racer lasts about 2 to 2 and 1/2 years.  That's cr@p.  

Look at this on the higher level.  Dealership A decides to support a racer, we'll call him Jim.  Jim has been racing for five an a half years.  Jim knows how the system works, can prep things, he can ride competently.  The dealership takes pride in his accomplishments as they understand the work he does and the image that he portrays.  Riders that meet Jim see that he is a pretty good rider and racer.  He works hard and he has decent results.  Some people that do business at the dealership might actually find that it's rewarding to help Jim out financially.  Additionally, some riders might find that, because of Jim, road racing looks fun.  Jim is happy to point them in the right direction.

On the flip side, Dealership C decides to support Bill.  Bill started racing about a year ago.  He's an amateur that rides about mid pack.  Really isn't sure about what he's doing, but he gets around the track.  Bill buys some products that his "buddies" recommend that really don't do anything for Bill's performance.  Bill thinks that dealership C should give him a new motorcycle, because that will get him to the front.  The dealership decides to do that.  Bill's performance doesn't change, but in an effort to make a showing, he wads the bike, and it is a complete wash.  Bill quit's road racing, the dealership decides not to put any funds toward racing.

Experienced racers legitimize a sport.  How long has Nicky been on a bike?  With that kind of involvment comes a lot of knowledge.  Ed Key...he's done a whole lot, stuff that I know about that most people don't know about.  When I've got one of my guys that I feel could possibly get and idea from Ed, I'll take them over to Ed and introduce them.  Because of the way this silly sport IS, there are few like him.  

Every year, I get to watch a group of people come in, and a group go, probably to never return again.  When the older guys go, that's even worse, because that's a resource for the new guys.  

I'm not saying that we don't need the new guys, but if the system were set up better to keep the new guys around under a system that is better suited for the racer in general...it would be more fun for the racer and the organization wouldn't be scrambling to try and keep the racers that they have.

As it is now, some riders get involved in racing way too early, too soon.  Most racing/safety schools teach flags, etc.  And I don't see most of those guys going racing anyway.  But once a guy is involved, try to keep him, under reasonable circumstances.

That is part of what my school was about:  Trying to help the guys that are already racing learn something that will give them some tools to understand how this all works.

What do you think, James-redsv?

[james-redsv]

I think the reason, if we arent talking about money, most stop racing is lack of a reachable goal. It goes something like this, 1st year beginner racer, do a few Am races to get the feel for racing with a goal of a Am championship or 2 the next year and turn expert. The 2nd year go to almost all the races, by the end of the year you are leading the Am SS, SBK points and passing some experts. You win the SE, SS SBK and are expert for year 3. 3rd year you are a mid pack expert but by mid season you are up front some. At the end of the year you end up 3rd overall in the expert class. Now whats left to do the 4th 5th 6th years, just win an expert title and thats it, unless you are a kid and could possibly go to the AMA and get a factory or support team ride. Basicly you have done all you can do in 3 years of club racing, so why keep racing, it kinda starts getting boring. I havent seen anything CCS has done to run people off. Im not quiting CCS just because they have a hard time updating the points or work in a track day on a race weekend. One thing they did do that pissed me off, they dropped CMP from the SE series and added Barber and Jennings, both are not SE tracks. CMP is the closest track to me and we dont even go there, its too stupid ???. So what can be done to make it more interesting to the guys that have been at it for a while? I dont know. Hey maybe some of the guys Im racing against this year wont be back when they have to turn EX. I guess that would be good for me, less compitition in the overcrowded expert class. Im planning on racing next year, which will be my 3rd ::) Then after that , I might go back to racing enduros, I havent won any of thoses in 8 years or so. Hey a new goal racing enduros, anyone want to trade a KTM 400 for an SV? Just kidding, I still havent gotten this road racing out of my system yet ;D ;D

[Baltobuell]

 I'll go with James on this, but with Dave too. Last year I was a rookie and did pretty good for an ol fart This year as an Amature again, got hurt in the first race and took a look at the cost. Risk vs reward. Spend $1,000, risk injury from sombody elses mistake, pick up some wood. Ok, reevaluate, let's go for fun. Spend $600 end up running with mid pack and now it's scary and go without wood. Still had fun and loved it BUT, Now bike is obsolete, and replacement is going to average out to maybe $1,000 a weekend if I'm going to do it right. So what the heck am I doing. I could have been classed an expert if I'd have entered 1 more race so it's hardly a goal, if anything I feel like a sandbagger. Had I understood Sportsman HW and F40 didn't count maybe I'd have rode 1 more race last year. Clearly I'll never aspire to AMA factory rider status Going just for fun and personal achivement is OK, but a boat is fun too and women hang at dock bars.
 I dunno. Race season/vacation home/ 40'boat, we all have choices for our commitments. A Junior ranking between AM and Expert would keep some riders in longer to move through the ranks.
Oh Tiff, back on topic, I don't think fairings have much if anything to do with end results and maybe writing that in the newbie manual might be enough to get the new guy feeling more confident.
 I've set myself up for crucifixtion now so let's hear it.

[Super Dave]

At the end of the year you end up 3rd overall in the expert class. Now whats left to do the 4th 5th 6th years, just win an expert title and thats it, unless you are a kid and could possibly go to the AMA and get a factory or support team ride. Basicly you have done all you can do in 3 years of club racing, so why keep racing, it kinda starts getting boring. I havent seen anything CCS has done to run people off.

Well, if in three year of potential club racing, it gets boring and CCS isn't doing anything to keep you there...  Seems like there is a problem.

First, the possibility of a factory or support ride for anyone is very, very slim.  Unless you have a great deal of money to get yourself in AND you are extremely talented, probably isn't a chance to do it.  As for support, etc....it's available at the club level.  I had a Kawasaki support ride in 1999 and 2000 when it was available.  

There is FUSA too.  That is a much better stepping stone for an expert anyway.  If you're not winning every expert race you enter, you probably don't have any business at the AMA level anyway.  That's the truth.  If you can win club races like that, then you can do Yamaha money, Suzuki money, and the like.  Larry Denning has turned down some opportunities because what he does is better for him.  Mladin made $4k for his Laguna superbike win...Denning wins $8k at Blackhawk the next weekend.  Which had less stress?

[the_weggie_man]

Rule # ??? A racer must wake up on the same side of the bed every morning. Oh yeah, and naked.  ;D

[K3 Chris Onwiler]

a boat is fun too and women hang at dock bars.
  

Could I get more information about this? ::)

[the_weggie_man]

Chris, you need to check out the Sunset Tavern (same place we do the 3 hr ice race) on just about any summer weekend.

By the way, the owner there is planning to do oval track ice races every Saturday night  and road course style ice races every Sunday in January and February next year.  The road course layoutwill change every week.  8)

I think I need to talk him into an XR100 class. ;D ;D

[Baltobuell]

Cris, I was fooling around with sailboats awhile and YES, a good boat at the pier helps your social calender alot more than a solo seat bike with the promise of sleeping in a trailer at the track. Thus we ponder, sex, racetrack, sex, racetrack. Racing is better than sex for oh...what did Dave say 2 1/2years. ;D

[EX#996]

Thus we ponder, sex, racetrack, sex, racetrack. Racing is better than sex for oh...what did Dave say 2 1/2years. ;D

THAT was funny!

Personally as a woman who as done both the boat and the race track....

....  I prefer the track!

Dawn   ;D