HP vs. Weight: Help me settle a debate

[Super Dave]

Well, it almost doesn't matter, in some ways.  IF EVERYTHING IS EQUAL, it probably matters more.  But, again, in road racing, HP is definitely not everything.

F2?  We were doing high 14's to 16's at Blackhawk in 1993 on them in legal supersport trim.  Bikes are capable, but the rider has to be responsible for the correct suspension set up.  And that's the real key.

If you were awesome with set up, you were really experienced, your combination weighed less, it might have a slight advantage.

Again, Denning goes maybe a half to three quarters of a second faster at BFR on his R6 vs R1.  30HP difference?  So, lets just say 5# per HP...so that makes the R1 150# "lighter" so to speak given the senario I've made up....

The time isn't much, is it?

But Ed Key goes so fast...

Yeah, he knows how to ride, tune, and set up a bike.  The intensity that he rides is pretty high an that's what makes him so tough.  

[Nate R]

Well, how much does your F2 weigh?

It's not 15 HP wasted. That's 15 HP used on your body. On a bigger bike, Your body might be allotted 20 HP, but the bike will be faster because it has less lbs per HP to lug around.

OK, Let's assume the F2 is 430 lbs 1/2 full of fuel and You're 105 lbs. If the bike makes 88 HP, that means there's 88 HP pushing 535 lbs total.

So, each HP is pushing 6.07 lbs (535/88 )

Let's say someone else is 180 lbs in gear. That means the total weight is 610 lbs.

So, each HP is pushing 6.93 lbs for them.

So, how much LESS HP would = 6.93 lbs/hp for you?

Well, 535/6.93 = 77.2. So, for you 2 to have the same weight/Hp ratio, you'd have to have 77.2 HP. So, basically, in this example, it's like you having 11 HP on him.  

This is just an example, and depends on the actual bike weight and HP.  In this case, you CAN use the 7 lbs/HP thing, because this works out to about 10.7. Some people misuse that though, and see it as taking 7 lbs off of the bike itself = 1 HP over the bike before losing the weight.

Point is, If the F2 weighs 430 wet, and makes 88 HP, you have an 11 HP advantage over someone weighing 180 in full gear.

[Super Dave]

My F2 weighed in the AMA scales with fuel at 410 and it made 93HP on Power Mist T111 in AMA/CCS Supersport trim.  I weighed in at 165.

Regardless, my point is, HP doesn't substantially change lap times with all things being equal.  If we're equating HP with weight, then that's relavant.  If you wanted to make things weigh less, then get lighter wheels so the suspension doesn't work so hard and the bike can be easier to turn.

[Nate R]

Well, right, it is relevant. The point here was that her bodyweight makes a rather significant difference in the ratio.

[tigerblade]

My friend (SV) has been giving me (RC51) crap about only being a few seconds faster at MAM.  We're at about the same skill level.  I'm not sure by how much, but I weigh more than he does.  It's all in good fun; just wondered what thoughts you guys had.   ;D   ;)

(EDIT) By "guys" I always mean "guys and gals"!  ;)

[HandleThis66]

okay okay, so i need corner speed and experience.  i was just wondering how much advantage i really have if someone with a very similar riding capability was dicing it out with me.  i'd like to know if we were on the same byke how i could really use the hp at the end of the race if i was trailing by a smidge...but that depends a lot on the size of the track.  i guess i'm just looking for all handicaps to make up for my inexperience.  three years since i learned to clutch and throttle a 2 wheeled device...gotta lotta heada me! :o
sweets and thanx - rhiannon :-*

[Super Dave]

HP doesn't make for substantially faster lap times.  If it did, a racer that has two bikes would go substantially faster on his higher HP bike.  Fact is, Larry Denning doesn't go much faster on his R1 than he does on his R6.  

Again, Denning goes maybe a half to three quarters of a second faster at BFR on his R6 vs R1.  30HP difference?  So, lets just say 5# per HP...so that makes the R1 150# "lighter" so to speak given the senario I've made up....

Like I said before, it doesn't make a whole lot of difference.  

[tigerblade]

Like I said before, it doesn't make a whole lot of difference.  

Which means I'm just faster than my buddy.   ;D ;)

[Xian_13]

There is only one way to truely find out...
Trade bikes ;D

[Super Dave]

There is only one way to truely find out...
Trade bikes ;D

Exactly...

[sdiver68]

No, that doesn't work either, since both should be afraid of crashing someone else's bike.

In the end, there are only results, everything else is excuses  ;D

[tigerblade]

I'm not afraid of crashing his bike.   ;D