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Author Topic: Should the GSXR565 (and similar bikes) be outlawed?  (Read 43416 times)

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MACOP1104

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Re: Should the GSXR565 (and similar bikes) be outlawed?
« Reply #175 on: February 23, 2015, 09:03:30 pm »






Exacrly.  Put that rider on a DB5 and what'a he going to do?   Mazz, Kcraget, Xavier?   
SV's are Dominate in alot of races in the Mid Atlantic and And Atlantic region.Very fast riders and high cornering speed.

racer880

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Re: Should the GSXR565 (and similar bikes) be outlawed?
« Reply #176 on: February 27, 2015, 10:26:53 am »
I been running LWT on and off depending the season since 79. I moved back to Middleweight a few seasons ago. Best thing I ever did. SV is a joke anymore for Expert down here unless you are 100 lbs.

Wolfie109

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Re: Should the GSXR565 (and similar bikes) be outlawed?
« Reply #177 on: January 09, 2016, 08:50:41 am »
After reading as much as I can about this topic, I was curious if there was a definitive approval from CCS that the so called cripple triples are allowed in the Lightweight classes.

LWT Racer

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Re: Should the GSXR565 (and similar bikes) be outlawed?
« Reply #178 on: January 09, 2016, 07:21:19 pm »
Yes, cripple triples (gsxr750 with cylinder disabled = 565cc ) is legal for LWGP and GTL.   But it will get crushed by a destroked 600 or good air-cooled Duc.
Sam Wiest #60
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Lighweight Racing - The struggle is real.

bruce71198

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Re: Should the GSXR565 (and similar bikes) be outlawed?
« Reply #179 on: January 11, 2016, 02:37:27 pm »
Yes, cripple triples (gsxr750 with cylinder disabled = 565cc ) is legal for LWGP and GTL.   But it will get crushed by a destroked 600 or good air-cooled Duc.

I would like to see that play out. Do you think if one could get a 100hp out of a cripple it could do battle with the Duc?

Eric Kelcher

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Re: Should the GSXR565 (and similar bikes) be outlawed?
« Reply #180 on: January 12, 2016, 06:36:36 pm »
After reading as much as I can about this topic, I was curious if there was a definitive approval from CCS that the so called cripple triples are allowed in the Lightweight classes.
Triple regardless of build method, factory, destroked/bored Triumph/MV, deactivated cylinder 4 etc limited to 500cc liquid cooled 4 stroke.
Eric Kelcher
ASRA/CCS Director of Competition

bruce71198

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Re: Should the GSXR565 (and similar bikes) be outlawed?
« Reply #181 on: January 13, 2016, 01:12:45 pm »
Triple regardless of build method, factory, destroked/bored Triumph/MV, deactivated cylinder 4 etc limited to 500cc liquid cooled 4 stroke.
What displacement can a  de-strocked 4 cylinder be for LW classes?

TEvans

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Re: Should the GSXR565 (and similar bikes) be outlawed?
« Reply #182 on: January 20, 2016, 10:10:24 am »
If you want to run a 600 then run it in the Middleweight class where it belongs.....

kvanengen

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Re: Should the GSXR565 (and similar bikes) be outlawed?
« Reply #183 on: January 20, 2016, 10:58:21 am »
I can’t believe this conversation is still going on. I remember caring about this a few years back for about a day. Personally, though I run an SV and in theory would be put at a disadvantage if the 565 becomes legal, I just don’t really care, it’s CLUB RACING! And on that same note, it’s CLUB RACING, so why go through the effort of taking a perfectly good 600 and detuning it so you can race Lightweight. Seriously, that is one of the most foolish things I’ve heard in a while. If you want to run a 600 than just man up and race it in middleweight. If you want to race lightweight than simply buy any damn SV650 and run it. It’s not like there is a shortage of SV650 bikes around.

Everyone is overthinking this and I’m not sure why. Just buy the bike that is designed for the class you intend on running and SHUT UP AND RIDE!

That is all. Good Day!

bruce71198

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Re: Should the GSXR565 (and similar bikes) be outlawed?
« Reply #184 on: January 20, 2016, 12:15:59 pm »
I can’t believe this conversation is still going on. I remember caring about this a few years back for about a day. Personally, though I run an SV and in theory would be put at a disadvantage if the 565 becomes legal, I just don’t really care, it’s CLUB RACING! And on that same note, it’s CLUB RACING, so why go through the effort of taking a perfectly good 600 and detuning it so you can race Lightweight. Seriously, that is one of the most foolish things I’ve heard in a while. If you want to run a 600 than just man up and race it in middleweight. If you want to race lightweight than simply buy any damn SV650 and run it. It’s not like there is a shortage of SV650 bikes around.

Everyone is overthinking this and I’m not sure why. Just buy the bike that is designed for the class you intend on running and SHUT UP AND RIDE!

That is all. Good Day!

This from the guy with THE most over engineered SV on the planet. Ya, it's club racing.

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Re: Should the GSXR565 (and similar bikes) be outlawed?
« Reply #185 on: January 20, 2016, 03:41:04 pm »
I would like to see that play out. Do you think if one could get a 100hp out of a cripple it could do battle with the Duc?

No, a good Duc will crush a cripple tripple.  Those Ducs are so insanely fast when built.....
Sam Wiest #60
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Lighweight Racing - The struggle is real.

kvanengen

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Re: Should the GSXR565 (and similar bikes) be outlawed?
« Reply #186 on: January 28, 2016, 08:49:43 pm »
Haha well played, Bruce. If you know my equipment, you know damn well that the bike I ride in most races is nothing special. It's not the lightest or fastest out there. On the other hand, yes, my SB is a wicked SOB. But again, I hardly ride it. In fact, I rode it in two races last year. Let me take this even further. The motor I ran until the last race weekend was bone stock. I bought for $250 with 30k miles on it.
« Last Edit: January 28, 2016, 08:54:36 pm by kvanengen »

Farmboy

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Re: Should the GSXR565 (and similar bikes) be outlawed?
« Reply #187 on: January 30, 2016, 01:07:29 am »
I like butter. I like it on bread, popcorn, and especially blueberry waffles.

Sometimes, I even just eat plain old butter, by itself. Just a little bit, though, not even a full pat or anything like a spoonful, oh no.
Jim Berard CCS MW#904

dmj_88

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Re: Should the GSXR565 (and similar bikes) be outlawed?
« Reply #188 on: February 05, 2016, 10:57:19 am »
 :pop:

dmj_88

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Re: Should the GSXR565 (and similar bikes) be outlawed?
« Reply #189 on: February 05, 2016, 11:23:04 am »
Triple regardless of build method, factory, destroked/bored Triumph/MV, deactivated cylinder 4 etc limited to 500cc liquid cooled 4 stroke.


This got me thinking, why is the displacement cap for a liquid cooled 4 cylinder MORE than that of a liquid cooled 3 cylinder in LWGP


I have no horse in this race (a good thing since it would have been beaten to death by now) just curious.

perform66

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Re: Should the GSXR565 (and similar bikes) be outlawed?
« Reply #190 on: December 12, 2017, 09:59:29 pm »
I think saying performance advantage is bad wording. There are a ton of bikes now in the lightweight class that have similar performance a better question would be "at what point is a bike no longer a "lightweight" bike?" 

110hp+ is not lightweight.  That is middleweight performance.
160mph+ is not lightweight. That is middleweight.

I'm not saying those things because I want the SV to remain the top of the lightweight food chain.  I have no issue if another bike, say the FZ-07 is actually good, take over the crown.  I would love for there to be 4-5 different makes of 650/700 twins out there. 

Yes, the rules have been in place for awhile.  But you have to look at what the lightweight class is about and it's not HP race.  565/Big Ducs are hardly LW bikes anymore.  They have created this point and shoot racing in the LWT field which just shouldn't be.   I'm not saying all the Ducati's are guilty.  I don't want them outlawed, I like the bikes.  But the 1100's should be Thunderbike and thats it.

I think one rule change should be that the GT Lights (for team challenge and sprint) should be Superbike rules, not GP.   This won't happen but it would help.





britx303

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Re: Should the GSXR565 (and similar bikes) be outlawed?
« Reply #191 on: June 26, 2018, 06:33:41 pm »
I want a 565!! :biggrin:

Grady

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Re: Should the GSXR565 (and similar bikes) be outlawed?
« Reply #192 on: December 11, 2018, 07:19:42 pm »
I want a 565!! :biggrin:
The elimination of "vintage" classes and replacement with "Classic" adds in interesting addition to this thread. Build your 565 from a 2006 or earlier R6 or Gixxer600 and run it in Lightweight Classic. Then you will have four races in LW that you can run your 565 in. I guess Vintage did not attract enough riders to make it financially feasible for CCS. I bought a nice FZR400 and built it to race LW vintage.
I raced it once and two weeks later had a crash on my other bike that I was trying to sell riding less than 100 ft to tech not wearing a helmet. Left in a helicopter. ALWAYS wear your helmet when riding. I would say most riders do not wear their helmet to tech. Including me. Stupid stupid stupid.
Away from the track from that injury for a year but was planning on a comeback of sorts at Daytona on the FZR. New rules made the decision to try car racing easy.
Pondering it though as my 2005 Bimota/Ducati air cooled 1100 twin would be legal in Classic MW by the new silly rules. Oh....I would have to take off the BST Carbon wheels and put the stock OZ mags back on.
Not gonna do that either. I supported the Vintage attempt by CCS when they introduced it. But 2006 isn't vintage anything.
But from an income to CCS standpoint there are plenty of 2006 and earlier bikes running modern classes already at the track so for another class to race the numbers may work out better for the club.
See you guys at the track but will most likely be spectating.
Back on topic: The 565 rule, I believe was made so FZR400s could be competitive with the onslaught of SVs dominating LW. I remember one that was over 100hp but not always reliable.
But the rule has been on the books for a long time. Why it is there is irrelevant. The folks who figured out they could fit in the class legally with a destroked 600 are racing within the rules. Very creative.
I have heard some bad mouthing about them and it is uncalled for. Rulebook interpretation and maximization of the rules is part of racing. Cheating is not. OK it is but it should not be. 565s are not cheaters. Get over it.
If enough people approached CCS and wanted the rule changed I am certain it would be considered.
"CCS may refactor any bike...." But in the meantime have some respect for the creative builds.
Cheers!


Eric Kelcher

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Re: Should the GSXR565 (and similar bikes) be outlawed?
« Reply #193 on: December 12, 2018, 10:05:39 pm »
The elimination of "vintage" classes and replacement with "Classic" adds in interesting addition to this thread. Build your 565 from a 2006 or earlier R6 or Gixxer600 and run it in Lightweight Classic. Then you will have four races in LW that you can run your 565 in. I guess Vintage did not attract enough riders to make it financially feasible for CCS. I bought a nice FZR400 and built it to race LW vintage.
I raced it once and two weeks later had a crash on my other bike that I was trying to sell riding less than 100 ft to tech not wearing a helmet. Left in a helicopter. ALWAYS wear your helmet when riding. I would say most riders do not wear their helmet to tech. Including me. Stupid stupid stupid.
Away from the track from that injury for a year but was planning on a comeback of sorts at Daytona on the FZR. New rules made the decision to try car racing easy.
Pondering it though as my 2005 Bimota/Ducati air cooled 1100 twin would be legal in Classic MW by the new silly rules. Oh....I would have to take off the BST Carbon wheels and put the stock OZ mags back on.
Not gonna do that either. I supported the Vintage attempt by CCS when they introduced it. But 2006 isn't vintage anything.
But from an income to CCS standpoint there are plenty of 2006 and earlier bikes running modern classes already at the track so for another class to race the numbers may work out better for the club.
See you guys at the track but will most likely be spectating.
Back on topic: The 565 rule, I believe was made so FZR400s could be competitive with the onslaught of SVs dominating LW. I remember one that was over 100hp but not always reliable.
But the rule has been on the books for a long time. Why it is there is irrelevant. The folks who figured out they could fit in the class legally with a destroked 600 are racing within the rules. Very creative.
I have heard some bad mouthing about them and it is uncalled for. Rulebook interpretation and maximization of the rules is part of racing. Cheating is not. OK it is but it should not be. 565s are not cheaters. Get over it.
If enough people approached CCS and wanted the rule changed I am certain it would be considered.
"CCS may refactor any bike...." But in the meantime have some respect for the creative builds.
Cheers!



FYI De-stroked 565 are not legal in Lightweight Classic
There are only 2 lightweight classes that a destroked 565 is currently legal for Lightweight GP and GTLights, guess there is third if you are over 40 as F40Light follows LGP rules
Eric Kelcher
ASRA/CCS Director of Competition

Grady

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Re: Should the GSXR565 (and similar bikes) be outlawed?
« Reply #194 on: January 03, 2019, 02:55:13 pm »
Thanks Eric.
I must have overlooked where in the Lightweight Classic specs it was pointed out that destroking a model year eligible bike was not legal.I'll look again but am glad to hear it. But a built up FZR400 to a 565 would be correct? Otherwise why was that displacement added to the class when going from LW Vintage to LW Classic? Regardless, I am not spending the money on my very cherry FZR400 to make it a 565 so it will be more competitive in the LW Classic class. Not sure what I will do with it.
And this highlighted in the rulebook: Includes all carbureted machines through 2006 model year and all fuel               injected machines through 2002 model year. So my comment above about my Bimota being legal in MW Classic is in error. It is fuel injected.
 
« Last Edit: January 03, 2019, 03:08:51 pm by Grady »

britx303

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Re: Should the GSXR565 (and similar bikes) be outlawed?
« Reply #195 on: January 29, 2019, 05:27:22 pm »
As a part-time vintage racer I will admit that I ain't gonna complain about vintage going away. It would have been nicer if all the vintage WERA racers in the mid-atlantic region would have actually gridded up, since most don't want to drive to georgia once or twice a month just to do a regional. Thank you to CCS for trying to do something with vintage anyways. The classic still deserves a longer lifeline though......... :jammin: