Factory Effex numbers?

[MarkMarine]

From the CCS rulebook:



18.1.3 All machines must have 3 sets of numbers;
           one on the center front and one on both sides.
           Numbers must be a minimum of 6" high, be
           spaced 1/2" apart and allow 1/2" of background
           color (White for Novices and Experts and
           yellow for Amateurs).


The way I read this, If I order number boards from factoryeffex.com ( [size=78%]http://store.factoryeffex.com/Custom-Number-Plate-Kits_c_279.html[/size] ) that have 6" numbers, 1/2" spacing and 1/2" border of number color (mine are yellow) I should be fine right?


My concern: I bought an expert's old bike. It has a nice custom paint job with white plates, and I don't want to repaint the bike or cover the plates with huge ugly boards. I plan to stick these 6" numbers with yellow backgrounds and 1/2" of clearance of yellow in the white "plate area" on the bike.


Does anyone think this will be a problem?

[Woofentino Pugrossi]

Tech is pretty flexible with the plates size, but thats more than likely a no-go.

Couple options.
Couple graphics companies/parts places sell stick on number plates (lockhart Philips sells them for example). They can be trimed to fit the front fairing (keep them large enough as far as you can). May cover some of the custom paint, but shouldnt hurt it when you go expert and remove it. Then again it IS a racebike and will eventually end up on its side. (heck you could just order yellow vinyl and make your own).
Other is to just mask off the number plates on the body and paint it yellow. This would be the cheapest, but you'd have to remask it off to paint it white when you go expert.

[twilkinson3]

Rob if he orders a plate from factory effects that mathes the rulebook and it covers the white....why would that not pass tech?  I'm thinking I'm missing something here but that sounds like what you recommended to him...(and if I'm a bit confused on the answer...lol)

[Burt Munro]

I may be reading this wrong, but what I think he's asking is if it would pass Tech to have numbers that have a 1/2" border of yellow around each individual number against a background of white. As a Tech inspector in the Midwest Region I would have a problem with that arrangement. The key here is that it would be extremely difficult to determine if that bike has Amatuer or Expert plates once it's on the track and at speed. What is clear to make out on a stationary bike from 4' is one thing. At speed from 100' is another. Get a sheet of yellow vinyl that you apply to cover (and wont damage the paint) the white and you won't have a problem.

If I'm misreading the intent I apologize.

[Woofentino Pugrossi]

Rob if he orders a plate from factory effects that mathes the rulebook and it covers the white....why would that not pass tech?  I'm thinking I'm missing something here but that sounds like what you recommended to him...(and if I'm a bit confused on the answer...lol)

No he's asking about numbers with 1/2" borders only, no actual number plate.

These are what hes looking at.

[twilkinson3]

gotcha - now it makes sense

[Factory Effex]

The "border" and "background" are synonymous with respect to our Sport Bike Number Plate Kits. The number plate background (aka border) can be as small as 1/4", or larger than 1" if specified in the comments section when ordering. Therefore, the same technique can be used to cover exisiting backgrounds that may be painted, per se, and you can simply trim the excess vinyl to conform to the shape and lines you desire. Thus, being able to conform to the stipulations of the rulebook. 

[MarkMarine]

That is a good summary of my intent. I want to put the factory effex numbers with the yellow background (the amount of yellow background required by the rulebook) as I read it, over the blank white areas of the bike.

The way I think of it, if I had an all white bike, couldn't I just use these numbers and pass?
What about all black?

I would think the answer to this is yes, and if not the rulebook needs to be clarified with the actual amount of yellow background. 

[MarkMarine]

[MarkMarine]

That's the bike, and you can probably see the number plates are a different size/shape than the yellow stick on board.


Also, its an SV and I am an amateur. No one will have trouble reading the number, all of my sponsor stickers, and weather i saved this morning. I'm not going to be going that fast  ::)

[Woofentino Pugrossi]

Rule book DOES state 10X12" number plates for the tail and front. Now on bikes that dont have enough actual "real estate" they let things swing a bit. Just put a yellow stick on "plate" vinyl and trim it and add 6" numbers and it will be fine. Hell that "9" looks like its 10" tall.

Here is the whole number requirement for CCS

5.3 NUMBER DISPLAY REGULATIONS
5.3.1 Numbers will be assigned by CCS or ASRA.
5.3.2 Expert CCS Sprint Riders will use white display areas or plates.
Amateur CCS Sprint Riders will use yellow display areas or plates.
5.3.3 All ASRA Expert riders will use white display areas or plates. All ASRA
Amateur riders will use yellow display areas.
5.3.4 Number plates, or number display areas, will be a minimum of 10 by 12
with radiused corners.
5.3.5 Painted displays or separate plates.
A. Front display may be painted only if the front section of the fairing
is of adequate size and display is clearly legible. Otherwise, a 10 by
12 plate must be mounted. The front display area must be unbroken
by air intakes, and only one number display will be allowed.
(1.) If the rider chooses to position the front number display to the
side of the air intake, that number display MUST be on the same
side as the scoring station used during each event. (i.e. if you are
competing at Summit Point, the front display must be on riders
right. If you are competing at Roebling Road, the front display
must be on riders left.) It is the riders responsibility to have the
number display on the correct side before coming to Tech Inspection.
B. Side displays may be painted on rear body work only if that body
work presents a basically flat surface of adequate area. Otherwise, a
10 by 12 plate must be mounted. The side plate must be mounted on
the seat or tail section and to the rear of the rider. Mounting must be
high enough to insure that the number is clearly visible when the
machine is leaned (cornering) without interference caused by rider
extremities or machine parts.
(1.) If the tail section profile does not allow the machine to comply with
Section 5.3.5.B, a single number display on the top of the tail section
may be installed and orientated to be read from the rear of the machine..
It is the rider's responsibility to have the number display correct before
coming to Tech Inspection.
5.3.6 Numbers must be black and approximately 8" high and 1" wide, of
standard block lettering with no shading, outlining or serifs. Number must
be spaced approximately 1" from each other as well as the edge of the
plate or display area. 6" or 4" numbers may be used on the rear plates as
long as the number is clearly visible at speed. All numbers on any display
must be the same size.
5.3.7 The following samples show the type style required to comply with these
rules:
l 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0
5.3.8 Number plates must be free from any stickers or sponsorship logos
except as required by specific class rules.

Doesnt matter how slow you are. You'd be surprised how hard it is to see numbers even on the ninja 250's going around when theres a pack of bikes or the station is at a weird angle.

Kinda similar to my sv's front plate.

[roadracer162]

That old rule has become outdated. It seems it was written in mind for the GPZ550 where there is no place on the tail for the 6" numbers so the 10x12 plate must be used. With that in mind and to the letter of the law a 10x12 plate should be used on the R6. Thankfully the folks in tech use some reasonable judgement in that area.


Scoring: is primarily done my electronic scoring. The transponder has become the item of concern for the rider with the responsibility for it solely on the rider. If it falls off or isn't working the rider will forfeit his/her position on track. The numbers have very little in scoring unless there is a complete failure of the electronic scoring system i would guess.


Rider identification is why the number plate is used and with a couple hundred riders out there in a weekend it can be tough to positively identify a rider. I don't know how important the colour of the background come into play. In the Florida region my #22 is only given to me as an expert and not an amateur. Where it does come into play is when there are multiple regions competing at an event and there could be a white plat #22 and a yellow plate #22, but they wont be in the same race.

[truckstop]

I'd think the bigger issue with those numbers is that they're smushed together. You need space around each individual number or it can get hard to read.

The actual size is less important than legibility, but you have plenty of real estate to work with there. Plenty of small vinyl cutting shops around who are familiar with the rules that will cut you custom numbers.

[roadracer162]

Separation of numbers is an important subject. Are mine legible? They do not fit the letter of the law(in this case rule). They are 5" tall and 4" wide with the number plate another 1" surrounding it. On the side they are the same numbers but the border is a little smaller.

[MarkMarine]

Those factory effects numbers have the exact height, seperation, and the right border amount from the rule book. I think it follows the rules better than my R1, and I never caught any grief for that, but it was all black. I'm concerned any grief I get will be from old school guys thinking I'm trying to "pretend" to be an expert, where really I'm just not trying to pay for another paint job, or ruin the one that is on there.

[roadracer162]

Mark I really think you will be fine, but don't take any opinion here as the ruling. Those numbers and graphics are much more professional than my stuff that I have done.

[Burt Munro]

Truckstop has it right.
The key issue is how legible your numbers are. But please remember that how legible they are when you're admiring your bike sitting on a stand from 4' away is a world of difference from how easy they are to read when your on the track and at speed.  Most Starting/Scoring locations are positioned on one of the faster portions of the track. The people who need to be able to read your number plate each time you cross the finish line only have an instant to decipher what number bike just flew past them. They don't have time to try and sort out whether the number on the bike was a 1 or a 7 or whether they read that 6 as an 8 or 9 when you have a pack of 4 or 5 bikes flash, all within feet of one another.

This past weekend I was the Starter for the CCS/ASRA races at Topeka. Yes, we have electronic scoring units. They are wonderful when things work correctly. Unfortunately, they don't help out for other important issues. The Starter needs to be able to identify which bike is which from quite a distance in order to know when bikes are getting lapped. It's not good for anyone when he fails to get the correct flag displayed. This is especially critical at the end of the race for the checkered flag. Doesn't matter if you're in first or last place. When the leaders start lapping bikes it gets to be a real challenge which bike should be the first one to get the Checker. Once you put the Checker out there's no taking it back. Put it out for the last bike on the lead lap by mistake, you just cost that guy a lap.

I can't tell you how many bikes we had this past weekend that were a nightmare to try and decipher - either from numbers that were too small or because they weren't spaced far enough apart or because the serifs weren't cut off of the 1's and they looked like 7's or they had some stylish font that was just hard to read.

Corner workers need to be able to read your numbers too. You could have something falling off your bike and you need to be Black flagged or Meatballed. You don't want to be pulled off the track erroneously because they couldn't read your number.

Please, just make sure your numbers are functional. Cool looking number plates will get you style points at a bike show or to impress your friends. But they don't cut it when it comes to real racing.

[MarkMarine]

Ok thanks for your feedback.

[Factory Effex]

Just to reiterate the fact of the matter, our custom number plates are that indeed, "custom." You are able to define and choose the proper number spacing, number size, number font, number orientation, and background size. You can acheive this and still have them look "cool," as well as professional, FOR RACING!

Below are a few important differences to note, between our number plate kits, and off-the-shelf individual numbers (which we also offer):

> Custom made to your specifications
> Durability / Thickness - 16 mil with protective laminate
> Scratch and water resistant with UV stable ink (same materials used for our leading MX products)
> Pre-printed and pre-aligned - Never worry about if they are straight or level again
> Receive 4 Sets - Allows for spares
> Any number size you need is available (individual #'s only have select sizes)

[truckstop]

Just to reiterate the fact of the matter, our custom number plates are that indeed, "custom."

i missed the part where the size a spacing can be adjusted, and the higher level of customization. just looked at the picture and thought the format was basically the same (all the examples show the numbers smushed together). cool that you offer the options.

MarkMarine - putting a sheet of yellow vinyl over the white paint shouldn't hurt the paint that's on it, unless it was a crappy paint job to begin with. I'm a perennial amateur but have always painted my bikes with white plates, and covered that with yellow because it's easier to just pull the yellow off.

[LWT Racer]

I have FX numbers and have had no issues with tech.

[Woofentino Pugrossi]

I have FX numbers and have had no issues with tech.

But tech can vary region to region and even track to track. Had a tech guy (wasnt burt) at gateway in 03 told me my throttle "doesnt close fast enough" even though the rules state only self closing. Nothing about how fast.

[MarkMarine]

The FX numbers are pretty legal, I use them. Just get the proper spacing and border per the rulebook, I run LRRS so it's 6" numbers, 1/2" spacing and 1/2" border of (white or yellow, depending) and if I ran a CCS I'd get the 8" ones. An aside, they are bad ass, I get tons of compliments, and the guys at FX are great. They are even custom making me my team logo stickers and other livery for the bike, for really really cheap.  Can't say enough good things about them.