Ultra Light thunder bike 250cc class rules for 2013

[CHIRINOM]

Thank you all for your support throughout the 2012 season. Congrats to Walter Ferreyra for winning the ULTB national championship at the Daytona ROC, and all of the other regional champions, Anthony Mazziotto III, Shon Staton, and Bruce Barry. 2012 has been a fantastic year.

As you know, the Ultra Light Thunder Bike riders have all been running under a gentleman's agreement to keep their bikes 250cc and unmodified. This was due to a CCS rule change after 2011 which opened up the class to other machines and modifications which would create a HP advantage. Ultra Light thunder bike riders showed their support in hopes that the ruling would change for 2013 limiting the displacement and mods as agreed to under the gentleman's agreement. As previously mentioned, running under the gentleman's agreement for 2012 has been huge success.

I am now being informed that CCS has decided to allow 300cc machines into the class, again completely out classing the current 250cc riders. At this time only one manufacturer is building a 300cc machine and it is said to have much more Horsepower than the 250. Why risk loosing the current following to allow a higher horsepower machine to run in a class which has a strong following and growing?

A 300cc machine is better suited to run in GTL, LWGP, thunder bike.

May 4,2011
"Ultralight ThunderBike is basically a SuperSport 250s class for bikes such as the Ninja and Honda 250, which aren't as competitive in other classes." said Kevin Elliott, owner of the Championship Cup Series. "Single & Twin cylinder liquid-cooled engines up to 250cc as well as Twin Cylinder air-cooled 350cc machines qualify for this class. Although some restrictions apply, bikes must be completely stock OEM for the most part and run street tires."

[MAZZ77X]

I agree. If they allow the 300 in the "Spec" class it must be scored seperate. Maybe like a LW Superbike within the LW Supersports???

The whole theory behind the 250 is equality...... ::)

[scubabill]

Is Kevin going to allow 700cc bikes in to MW? That is equivalent to what was done in ULWTB. Maybe with an intake restrictor, the SCCA Mazda spec class uses that system to good effect.

[Cab305]

Turn out has been progressively larger every event. With riders from other classes showing interest in joining.
Why mess with a good thing?


Even when they made it open class, everyone agreed to keep it fair. Unless there is more than a dozen NEW racers showing up tomorrow all with brand new 300's they should allow the class to make the decision themselves, how many people could have possibly petitioned for this considering the 300 is barely in the showroom?


Or was it just a couple of loud voices?

[roadracer162]

And thus the conundrum of racing classes. Do you make it a class for the has been, and the new bike must race up a class? Or do you make it part of a current class which the has been becomes the also ran.

It is what happened with the ultralight super bike class when they allowed the SV into it. The SV had been competitive in the next higher class until the bimota completely blew it away.

The SV which was competitive in lightweight now is dominant in ultralight with little mods and even comparative to a Ducati 1000 in supersport. But yet the Ducati 900 is not allowed in ultralight.

In the end I think CCS has always catered more towards the new model bikes and the older bikes get outclassed. In this sense I believe the thinking would be if you are on a bike that the same manufacturer has upgraded to a faster bike, then  get the newer faster bike. I know this mentality may work in the bigger class but it makes a huge difference in the 250 class. I guess that is why it's called ultralight thunder bike and not the 250 class.

[CHIRINOM]

And thus the conundrum of racing classes. Do you make it a class for the has been, and the new bike must race up a class? Or do you make it part of a current class which the has been becomes the also ran.

It is what happened with the ultralight super bike class when they allowed the SV into it. The SV had been competitive in the next higher class until the bimota completely blew it away.

The SV which was competitive in lightweight now is dominant in ultralight with little mods and even comparative to a Ducati 1000 in supersport. But yet the Ducati 900 is not allowed in ultralight.

In the end I think CCS has always catered more towards the new model bikes and the older bikes get outclassed. In this sense I believe the thinking would be if you are on a bike that the same manufacturer has upgraded to a faster bike, then  get the newer faster bike. I know this mentality may work in the bigger class but it makes a huge difference in the 250 class. I guess that is why it's called ultralight thunder bike and not the 250 class.

I say go with what the majority is requesting. At this time it is true parity amongst machines with truly low cost. Having to run out and buy a new $4000.00 motorcycle or modify our current race bikes when we have perfectly capable machines in our garages does not accomplish this. Remember that the Ninja 250 in it's current trim was still produced in 2012. There is nothing old about it.

[RacingKelly]

This class has been growing in many country's around the world for the last few years and is growing for many reasons. some reasons are that the class will be the best class around the world for young pilots in the next years. one of them is the low cost of it, and another one is that its so competitive. The most important is that the class is very good for learning, also all these reasons are what are helping young pilots with low economy resources. We already have the 125's the moriwaky's and the 250 spec class "ninjas", that's why i think that putting the 300cc class is unnecessary. So i hope that the "CCS INSTITUTION" leaves the 250 spec class stays how it is, and i hope that the CCS TECH INSPECTION makes sure that all the bikes are the same.
I will see you in the spec class in a year!!



                                                                                                                REMEMBER THIS WILL BE THE BEST CLASS ON WORLD IN THE NEXT YEARS!!!


                                                                                                                                         
Sean Dylan Kelly #40 im 11 years old
10 championships (FLAMRA, SEMRA, OMRL (ohio), PBIR SERIES, FL SUPERMOTO, 305 MOTARD)     THANK YOU SO MUCH!

[sami888]

i do not see why the new bike should not be allowed the difference in the HP is not that big. i believe it would be a good idea to keep the class growing not have it stuck with a certain older models

[fdlr248]

Mr. Elliot has you know me in the past, for running the Ninja 250 last year in the ASRA Michelin TC pro-series and taking third place in then national tittle. I have supported the 250 Spec class since the conception of the idea, to run this class in Florida. I knew it was a great idea for the introduction of young riders like my daughters for example, they can not wait to get on the track. Also was a great idea for beginner female riders as we will see next year.
The 250 class was created for a lot of different reasons, but mainly a race class that the blue collar worker can afford for them and their families. We can build a very competitive bike for less than $3,000.00, a lot of vendors are making race components for these bikes now, like woodcraft, vortex, dynojet, ect. Even vendors like Dunlop are making offers to the spec class to introduce their tires, a class mostly dominated by Bridgstone tires.

Also the Spec class was created to be a race base on skills not performance, I have seen a rider in a 06 EX250 out run and out skill another rider on a 09 250r. At the last Jennings GP 2 hour endurance race 14 250 where present at the grid, we had as many bikes as the light, middle, and unlimited class combine, that tell the racing community, that is a big interest in racing the 250 class.

Mr. Elliot is my concern that the introduction or allowing the 300 in the 250 spec class will drastically reduce the class grid and turn a lot of new young riders, females, and blue collar workers away from the sport. I personally will not spend the money in another 250 for my girls, if I know they can not compete against the 300. reason I left the formula 40 middle weight class when they allow 750. 

Mr Elliot I personally thing it will be financially a great idea to keep the class as it is, as the grid keeps getting larger after every event, by allowing the 300 we may just change the name to Kawasaki 300 class, since Honda or the upcoming Yamaha will not be able to compete. I know the final decision is made at your office, but financially will be a disaster for CCS to allow the 300 in the 250 spec class,  since a lot of the 250 spec class riders will stop riding the CCS events and move to the local GP events like the Jennings GP events.

As of today I have not seen a 250 spec rider get off the bike, that has not stop smiling after any race!

Regards.

Frank De La Renta
CCS# E 130  TC# 46

[roadracer162]

Frank, you must send your request to the Texas office and better by email directly to the contacts listed on the CCS ASRA site.

i do not see why the new bike should not be allowed the difference in the HP is not that big. i believe it would be a good idea to keep the class growing not have it stuck with a certain older models

...and therefore the conundrum

Miguel, I understand fully your point, but in speculation will only one person go out and by the 300cc and dominate the whole series? Believe me I know what it is to run an underpowered machine. You observed this in the Vintage race at homestead, but it is still a lot of fun.

May I suggest not banning the 300cc machine but maybe look at regulating it you could do intake restriction but exhaust restriction can also be done. Stock dimension exhaust of ??? Can be instituted allowing the 250 a chane to regain some of the performance deficit. Yes I know keeping it affordable is the priority, but if I bought a crashed 300cc for $500 I would think it is affordable. In that same spirit ny FZR 400 cost me $700 in total to make race ready but yet it is uncompetitive in ultralight, not legal in ultralight thunder bike and sorely out classed in lightweight. Should they make a class specific for my old bike? I wish they would. The FZR 400 had its day as a spec class racer and a lightweight supersport racer. Now there are faster bikes.

[roadracer162]

I wish there was a 400 class and I would welcome the 300cc within the class

[bruce71198]

   I'm dissappointed in CCS' decission to include the 300 in the ULWTB class. I haven't posted my disslike of this on the forum becasue I want to give it some time to sink in and not sound bitter and negative. My initial thought is to allow it in ULWTB because it needs a place to race. But it is a first year bike and Kawi is the only one with a 300, so let the 1 or 2 that show up run at the front of ULWTB pac or chase the ULWSB pac ? Or leave the class structure as they wish and run an ULWSS class with a 250cc limit. CCS made Thunderbike rules to allow engine mods so those that want to run with the 300 now have an option, open your wallet !! The other option available to all of us is to seek out an organization that better suits your preferance....