New trailer PICS & Maiden Voyage

[Jeff]

http://www.cbr600rr.com/pages/trailer.htm

So I dragged the trailer to MD Racing in Orion, IL this weekend to have the F4 measured and pick up tires.  Will do a write up on the measurement very soon.  As for tires, well, it saved me a trip to the "mall"  ;) and was cheaper...

She pulls very nice.  I did realize though that I couldn't get above 70 or it would start to weave.  I kept it at 65, averaged 10mpg and was fine.  Hills were fine, I was able to maintain 65.  

My right mirror isn't out far enough for me to see the back of the trailer, so passing is a pain, but I'll get used to it.

Here's a few pics of the beast :-)

Super-Dave is your trailer man!!!

[GSXR RACER MIKE]

     I like that basketball hoop you have mounted on the roof! LOL  ;D

     I am not sure if this is the case with you but my trailer will weave if I don't have enough tongue weight from the trailer on the hitch ball (I have a 8' 6" x 26' V-nose trailer). The perfect amount is 12% (10% to 15% suggested) of the trailers weight (loaded) and can be figured if you go to a weigh station with your normal load of bikes and tools and weigh the trailer alone. Be carefull though because if you have too much tongue weight it will push down on the back of the tow vehicle excessively and unload some of the weight from the front tires of your tow vehicle. In this situation the front of your tow vehicle will steer very easily which can be a bad thing. In the event of a hard stop or somewhat hard turn the front ends lack of grip can cause it to slide and not go where you want. There are anti-sway devices available and load levelers but I learned the hard way that V nose trailers are somewhat restricted on the use of these products. The problem is that there isn't enough frame exposed at the front of the trailer to mount these devices properly.
     Also the V on the front of the trailer can play havock with you when passing or being passed by other large vehicles such as semi's or motorhomes. The way it was explained to me was that the wind from the other vehicle hits the angle on the front of the trailer and pushes it away from the source of the wind turbulance. You just learn to countersteer for the 'push' to the side when passing. I heard the reason for flat nose trailers not having this problem is because the wind blast doesn't have the same leverage ability as on an angled surface. Usually this isn't too much of a problem until your towing in strong cross-wind situations.
     I encountered a strong cross-wind situation while towing during a storm on my way to Heartland Park a few years back. Worst case scenario; wet, windy, and tail loaded. At a rest stop I moved the bikes just a few inches forward to get the trailer more tongue loaded and went from being all over the road to much more controllable. You can weigh the tongue load by using a household scale, a board, and a few blocks in a ratio situation. If you want a description of how to do this E-mail me.
     I really think that your layout as on your web-site is going to be excessively/dangerously tail loaded and you should set everything in the trailer as you planned and check the tongue weight after checking the total trailer weight loaded. At least this way you will know before you mount anything permanently and waste alot of time and labor. An ounce of prevention = a pound of cure!

[Super Dave]

But Pace American trailers come with little pegs on the chassis underneath that you can put weight distribution on.  Comes standard at a certain length on their V-Nose trailers.

It can be related to the working ball height.  You might want to experiment with that too Jeff.

[GSXR RACER MIKE]

But Pace American trailers come with little pegs on the chassis underneath that you can put weight distribution on.  Comes standard at a certain length on their V-Nose trailers.

It can be related to the working ball height.  You might want to experiment with that too Jeff.

     I wanted a Pace American trailer when I ordered mine back in February 1999, but was extremely disappointed when they refused to build the combination that I wanted. I wanted an 8' 6" wide by 26' long by 6' 6" tall interior, V nose car hauler with a ramp in the back and a ramp on the passenger side of the V nose, a man door on the passenger side, and a window on the drivers side. Pace said they could do it until I gave them the next request which was a full walk-on roof with an access hatch. They claimed they would not build a V nose with a walk-on roof, only would put platforms on them, and would not give a reason as to why! They said they would build me a flat front trailer with a full walk-on roof, but not a V nose. This was the only reason I didn't order a Pace American trailer.
     I do remember, now that you mention it, that Pace has those pegs underneath the nose of the trailer for weight distribution systems. I also agree with you that the ball height, when loaded down by the trailer, may be incorrect and could cause the swaying problem.
     I also noticed that you don't have bottom out avoidance wheels under the tail of the trailer. For the minimal cost of these wheels you can avoid some costly damage to the back of your trailer (at the bottom). This damage can occur when backing up or going forward thru a large dip in the road or approaching a driveway that is somewhat steep as compared to the road.

[Jeff]

I like that basketball hoop you have mounted on the roof! LOL  ;D

LOL... you're about the 10th person to mention that :-)  See, Super Dave can get you anything

I am not sure if this is the case with you but my trailer will weave if I don't have enough tongue weight from the trailer on the hitch ball (I have a 8' 6" x 26' V-nose trailer). The perfect amount is 12% (10% to 15% suggested) of the trailers weight (loaded) and can be figured if you go to a weigh station with your normal load of bikes and tools and weigh the trailer alone.

When I got the weave, I was going down hill and was speeding up to make it up the other side (which I found unnecessary in the end).  Once I passed about 73 or so, she started to weave.  It freaked me out because going down hill, I immediately thought it would get worse if I took my foot off the gas, but figured that speed was causing it so I couldn't stomp on it either.  In the end, I backed slowly off the gas and it settled.  It wasn't even that violent, just enough to notice...

Be carefull though because if you have too much tongue weight it will push down on the back of the tow vehicle excessively and unload some of the weight from the front tires of your tow vehicle. In this situation the front of your tow vehicle will steer very easily which can be a bad thing. In the event of a hard stop or somewhat hard turn the front ends lack of grip can cause it to slide and not go where you want. There are anti-sway devices available and load levelers but I learned the hard way that V nose trailers are somewhat restricted on the use of these products. The problem is that there isn't enough frame exposed at the front of the trailer to mount these devices properly.

I put air shocks on the van to keep the rear level and it works great.  They don't make a load-leveller shock for my van, so I was stuck with air.  They turned out very good though.

You can weigh the tongue load by using a household scale, a board, and a few blocks in a ratio situation. If you want a description of how to do this E-mail me.

The tounge weight now is +300lbs, so once loaded, I don't think a household scale would do :-)

I really think that your layout as on your web-site is going to be excessively/dangerously tail loaded and you should set everything in the trailer as you planned and check the tongue weight after checking the total trailer weight loaded. At least this way you will know before you mount anything permanently and waste alot of time and labor. An ounce of prevention = a pound of cure!

Actually the layout will change, and with the position of the axles, the motors are dead center above the rear axle, so I believe I should be okay since nothing will be behind the rear axle.  The buildout of the front will add at least 400-500lbs with beds, shelves, etc.  I was surprised at how far rearward the axles would be, and it's a relief as I was worried about the weight.  Now I'm not so concerned, but I will absolutely keep an eye on it.

FWIW, I spent the afternoon yesterday putting up foil-faced hard insulation on the roof, and finishing it off with whiteboard.  I finished the insulation, but only got up 1 section of whiteboard.  It's looking *VERY* nice...

The Supa-Fly RV door is the sheeyat though :-)  It's definitely the 'finishing' touch!

[Jeff]

It can be related to the working ball height.  You might want to experiment with that too Jeff.

Explain...

I didn't play with the height since it looked level.  Should I be measuring?

[Super Dave]

Yes, it might be worth looking at.

And, do you have light truck tires on your van or passenger car tires on it.  Passenger car tires don't have the sidewall strength that Light Truck tires do.  Some times that can be relevant.

[khanson]

Jeff,

I've got just what you need.  I just bought a new dually today and my 99 diesel dually is for sale.  Brand new tires, fully serviced, it's ready to rock.

I can get 11.5 - 13 mpg pulling my 40 trailer at 70-72 mph.  If I run 60 with it I get 15.  

I think it's just what you need.  Even though it's an extended cab, it's a four door.

[Super Dave]

I was just telling Doug Cameron about your truck...

There you go, Jeff.  And Kevin has all the cool reliability mods on it.  They were done there in Waukesha too.

[Jeff]

Kevin,

I'll give you a call later today to shoot the breeze on it, but unless you're taking trades...  :-/

Who knows though.  Might be worth a 5 min chat...

[GSXR RACER MIKE]

The tounge weight now is +300lbs, so once loaded, I don't think a household scale would do :-)

     Well I guess I will just explain this here then. For weights above the capacity of your scale you use a ratio scenerio to get the weight. To do this have your trailer level and supported by the tongue jack. Now take a solid beam of some type (like a 4"x4" or larger post) that doesn't flex easily and mark off equally distanced marks on the length of it. A 4' to 6' beam marked every foot will work well. Now put one end of the beam (while positioned horizontally) on something solid like cement blocks or wood so the top of the beam is just under the trailer tongue. Position the tongue of the trailer over the first mark out on the beam. Now take your scale and set it also on top of something solid (and flat) so it is slightly under the beam and put something like a wood handle on the top of the scale (in the center) perpendicular to the beam (to create a specific point of pressure) and position the scale under one of the marks further out on the beam. Now lower the trailer tongue on to the first mark on the beam out from the solid resting point until all the weight is off the tongue jack. If the scale is positioned 3 marks out from the solid resting point and the trailer tongue is on the first mark, you have a ratio of 3:1. So if your scale reads 200 lbs. (in this scenario) then your trailers tongue weight is 3 times that or 600 lbs (remember to subtract the static weight the beam is exerting on the scale before lowering the trailer onto the beam). If you want to be even more accurate you can put a second handle (or what ever) under the solid resting point and use the first mark in on the beam as your solid point and shift everything over one position. Some people keep a beam with 2 rods permantly mounted to it for quick and easy weighing of their trailer tongue for best positioning of different loads before they haul.

[Super Dave]

I believe the empty tongue weight of your trailer is about #425, Jeff

[Jeff]

I believe the empty tongue weight of your trailer is about #425, Jeff

Well yeah!  425# is +300 ;-)

man... that fat boy needs atkins if anything does...

[MightyDuc Racing]

How much was that trailer?  Do any trailer places have financing, and how much do you guys think I'd have to spend for a 7 X 14 with shelves, chocks, and a little A/C unit and power for a TV/etc?

[KBOlsen]

You will save mega-dollars and time if you do the interior setup yourself.  Check with your credit union or bank for financing (you'll get better interest rates).

Go to HOBO or someplace for "closeout" cabinetry and flooring.  

[GSXR RACER MIKE]

How much was that trailer?  Do any trailer places have financing, and how much do you guys think I'd have to spend for a 7 X 14 with shelves, chocks, and a little A/C unit and power for a TV/etc?

     I have A/C on my trailer and can't use it too effectively due to a mistake the trailer manufacturer made when building my trailer. I paid extra for the trailer to be completly insulated, but they kinda forgot to do it. I did get a refund of that money but now I am going to have to remove alot of screws on the outside of the trailer in order to insulate the walls. The reason I have to go from the outside is because of the way the wall studs are shaped (i'm not a happy camper about this!). I tried using the A/C at MAM last summer (about 100*!) and it was worthless due to the lack of insulation and the fact that the trailer is dark colored which just soaks up the sun.
     Realize that unless you want to be restrained to parking in a certain area where electricity is available your going to need a generator. Generators can get quite expensive if you want a quiet one with enough surge capacity to start up the A/C unit (not enough wattage during start up can burn out an electric motor, so make sure you get a generator with enough surge wattage for your highest draw motor - most likely A/C or an air compressor).
     Also remember that if you get one of the cheap generators that aren't made to run for extended periods of time you may burn it up. The really cheap ones are also very loud, don't have a spin on oil filter or low oil shut down, and don't have the automatic idle down feature. A loud generator is just going to piss off everyone around you due to the noise, especially during lunch time when it's fairly quiet.
     Another concern is electronic equipment like TV's, radios, and computers. These have sensative electronics that can be hurt by 'dirty power' and you should make sure the generator you get is ok to run electronics. You may also want to look at hours of run time per gallon of fuel that the various generators have. Most that I found dropped dramatically in fuel efficiency once you get over 4000 to 5000 watts continuous output. This is a variable to consider if you want to use your generator all weekend.

[Jeff]

My trailer was $5k.  Very reasonable for what I got.  I financed it through my credit union at a whopping 8%.

I am looking for roof AC units on ebay from old RV's, etc.  One thing which I did was insulate the roof with reflective hard insulation, now I'm finishing it off with whiteboard.  

I'll be building bunks and a separating wall this weekend.  Painting the interior as well.

[KBOlsen]

John and I were discussing air conditioning... for now, my plan is to fabricate a screen door for the side, hang a mosquito net curtain at the rear, and run a box fan to draw air through at night.  If it proves to be too hot we'll look into rooftop units for next season.

Insulating the ceiling does sound like a good idea, in any case.

[Jeff]

Insulating the ceiling does sound like a good idea, in any case.

Absolutely.  The sun bakes down and heats that thin metal up to a billion degrees.  I burned my bald head on my trailer last year :-(

Home depot has the stuff for like $6/sheet.  Use a carpet knife and cut it to the width of the trailer and width between beams on the roof.  Then wedge it up there, shiny side towards the roof...

[khanson]

Jeff,

You still eyeing the dually?  I picked up my new one today.  That thing is awesome!

Look into getting a rebuilt a/c unit.  I need one myself and supposedly you can pick them up for $300 as opposed to $600.

Ill let you know.

[Super Dave]

And those wheels on your truck...

You can't go wrong with 22's! 8) 8) 8) 8)

[Jeff]

Very interested Kevin, but unfortunately my reality is that I'm stuck in the van for now...

I could likely manage a dealer trade and bring over the "negative equity" (what a term) onto a used truck, but selling the conv van outright would be difficult.

I knew it when I got it that *NO ONE* wants one used.  They just plain don't sell...  Right now I'm so swamped that I don't have the time to try to sell it outright either...

If something comes along where I could get out of the van for around $15.5k, I'd be on my way to pick up your truck...

Soooooooo...  If *ANYBODY* wants a good deal on a conversion van, give me a call!

Here's the details:

• 99 Chevy Express 1500 (new purchase 10/00)
• Cobra conversion
• 5.7L V8
• 36,000 miles
• Pwr windows/doors/tilt/cruise/tape/cd/etc etc...
• Rust-proofed & Scotch guarded
• Just installed air shocks (still have factory shocks)
• Class 4 hitch
• Just installed transmission cooler
• 4 captains chairs
• Full size rear seat / bed
• Rear heat/AC

The van runs & drives great, seats 7.  Last year while pulling my LOADED 5x8 trailer, I'd get 17mpg on the hwy going to Gateway or MAM.  In-town, I get about 12mpg.

I have an extended warranty for 6 years or 80k miles which I could sell (or I'll cash out of it).  Never had a problem, and don't anticipate ever having one with it...