Stay AM or petititon for EX?

[fatboy122]

Just replying to starting not being much priority, i started every race i entered at the ROC from the last row, yep the last row..i won 2 of them and finished 2nd in another..my starts where very crucial..i was roughly in 5th place entering the first horseshoe..starting is a priority in racing..to me thats half the battle..carry on

[tstruyk]

yup, if you dont get away with the front runners in the EX class you arent gonna catch em.  Its a WHOLE differnt world when youre racing against guys that have been doing this for years.  In a tight battle small mistakes cost you a postion, big mistakes cost you 5...

Rsimm... Do whatever you feel is right.  Me personally, I didnt think it was right for me to stay back and kick ass in the AM class.  I could have made my season WAY cheaper yeah... but to me it just didnt seem right to take that money away from the true AM's.  Your situation is different, you didnt recieve the points to get the bump.  IMO if you think you are ready to ride in the Ex class you should.  its your season, its your decision, but you asked for opinions...

good luck next year! 

[r1owner]

yup, if you dont get away with the front runners in the EX class you arent gonna catch em.  Its a WHOLE differnt world when youre racing against guys that have been doing this for years.  In a tight battle small mistakes cost you a postion, big mistakes cost you 5...

Rsimm... Do whatever you feel is right.  Me personally, I didnt think it was right for me to stay back and kick ass in the AM class.  I could have made my season WAY cheaper yeah... but to me it just didnt seem right to take that money away from the true AM's.  Your situation is different, you didnt recieve the points to get the bump.  IMO if you think you are ready to ride in the Ex class you should.  its your season, its your decision, but you asked for opinions...

good luck next year! 

You're going to have to retake learning curves to race again!

[tstruyk]

yeah well youre old 

[red900]

Just replying to starting not being much priority, i started every race i entered at the ROC from the last row, yep the last row..i won 2 of them and finished 2nd in another..my starts where very crucial..i was roughly in 5th place entering the first horseshoe..starting is a priority in racing..to me thats half the battle..carry on

Did anyone happen to catch a view of Doug Polen starting at Daytona in the Superbike grid on 06?   Rumor has it, he registered at the track, started in the back row, and did not even launch.  He left like he was on a sunday ride to the donut shop....  Geoff May, as well as other Pro's were in the mix.  Doug was the last guy going into turn one, and the first guy coming across the line on lap one.   I always felt a good start could get you out in front but it wont keep you there...  I am going to Freddie next month, I wonder if he is going to teach starting?

 

[Spooner427]

I have been reading this forum for a while but have yet to chime in but here goes.

This year I made enough points to go up to expert by like 40 or something so not by a great number. My best finish was a 5th place (I run a 6r) and fastest time was a 1:16.5 at BHF. I thought about asking to be held back but this year(2007) I preregistered and ran with guys closer to the front and improved by 4 seconds from my last years best time(also new bike) but then I thought I could try and improve more and have a fast year as an AM but we ALWAYS get sandbaggers that should be in EX but run AM just because they can't hang with the EX guys. I would rather get beat by every EX,some that have many sponsor and money into thier bike, then one sandbagging AM any day. I will ride home thinking man those MF's are fast but I am sure they all started slow like me instead of DON'T THE OFFICIAL SEE THIS GUY SHOULD BE IN EXPERTS!!!!!!!!
Not trying to be a prick but you sound like another sandbagging AM. I race for the enjoyment of competing and am more then happy just being able to say I run with the Experts.

[fatboy122]

Did anyone happen to catch a view of Doug Polen starting at Daytona in the Superbike grid on 06?   Rumor has it, he registered at the track, started in the back row, and did not even launch.  He left like he was on a sunday ride to the donut shop....  Geoff May, as well as other Pro's were in the mix.  Doug was the last guy going into turn one, and the first guy coming across the line on lap one.   I always felt a good start could get you out in front but it wont keep you there...  I am going to Freddie next month, I wonder if he is going to teach starting?

 

Polen did this at daytona but im wondering if he wouldve had the same result as you mentioned at a real race track..Also, not everyone is Doug Polen..

[ccs207]

Damn, i thought i was gonna be able to sand bag as an amateur one more year until i saw the bump list got cut short. Stopped at the T's. I didn't have enough points to go Expert but it was the number of years of holding an AM license. My first year did 2 race weekends. 2nd year, no races, broke my collar bone 1st lap of 1st race of the season. Last year i did race 5 weekends. My times are getting down and I've improved a tremendous amount, but need work on my passing. With 2 kids in daycare i was really hoping to sandbag that pirelli contingency for one more year, it would have been helpful. At the same time, if you want to get faster, you have to rider with someone above your level and learn from them. I'm sure i'll finish mid pack by the end of the season and have fun battling it out with the other guys i've formed relationships with in the AMs. Either way, just have fun and do what you think is right....i guess that's why i'm not protesting to stay an Amateur.

[LilJayRR]

You do relize the question is not to petition to stay a amature, but to ask to be moved up to expert right?

Unless most of the posts have gotton away from the real topic and off to the sandbagging discusion. Which judging by the times etc. he cant be sandbagging that much...

Just my .02 on the off topic discusion.

[RSimmons]

You do relize the question is not to petition to stay a amature, but to ask to be moved up to expert right?

Unless most of the posts have gotton away from the real topic and off to the sandbagging discusion. Which judging by the times etc. he cant be sandbagging that much...

Just my .02 on the off topic discusion.

Thank you. I didn't think I would be really sandbagging. I don't have a single win on my record, and only got on the box at Road America.

Thanks to all that responded. I've mulled it over a bit and decided I'll stay where the points say I should: in AM. I'm sure they're will be some good competition in AM, I can think of a few guys that I'll likely be battling with. And actually having a shot at some contingency will keep racing within the budget.

IF it turns out that I end up being 'that guy," I'll petition to move up when/if that happens. I'm not that fast, so I doubt it will be the case.


This thread also had me thinking about an alternate way of classifying riders. What about a 110% rule (number is arbitrary) If a given rider is turning, on average, 110% of the fastest lap, he/she is an expert.
There seems to be a number of advantages to this scheme:
Fast guys coming out of the trackday circuit are placed where they belong in a timely fashion.

less closing speed differentials within AM/EX fields

A larger field of more closely matched competitors for better racing, both for spectators and racers. As it stands, it seems there's overlap. The faster AM are running times that are faster than the slower EXs, thereby spreading the field in both classes. The cutoff percentage could be adjusted to maintain relatively equal numbers of riders in AM and EX to ensure better populated grids.

No incentive to 'sandbag' at the end of the season to avoid 400pt. cutoff (I've seen it done) No racer in his right mind would come out and intentionally ride slow and defeat the purpose of racing. But some racers will not enter races towards the end of the season to preserve yellow plate status.

Allows not-quite-EX-fast riders not be forced into EX by virtue of simply entering races. This would reduce the occurences of the "slow AM>Fast AM>slow EX>still slow EX>quit racing cycle" that is often mentioned.

It would be easy to implement. All this data is currently taken and can be quickly and efficiently managed with something as a simple as an MS Excel macro. I suspect it would lead to more people entering more races, both by reducing the sandbag incentive and making for better/fairer competition. The racers benefit and CCS as a business entity benefits.

[Sobottka]

how do you go 10% faster than the fastest lap? (or 110% of the fastesrt lap?)

[r1owner]

how do you go 10% faster than the fastest lap? (or 110% of the fastesrt lap?)

1 word..... TRACKDAYS :)