BMW HP2 in LW??

[Burt Munro]

    Similarly, I don't expect a whole bunch of BMW's to show up.  Nate's been on them for a good while now, and I am still waiting for someone to do one up for the midwest.

If my R1100S turns up missing I think my first call might be to Eagle, WI!

[Super Dave]

There was a GS at my house on Sunday.

[PJ]

It's not without precedent to disallow certain bikes that would upset the competitive balance in a class despite the fact that they are legal for the class rules on paper...

For example:

No SuperMonos in Lightweight SuperSport.

No XBRRs or 749s in CCS Thunderbike.

[Ducmarc]

no one complains about a $30,000 bimota but it's legal just because nate can wheel one around has not made light weight a BMW fest.

[xseal]

The issue here is not changing the nature of the LW class, but keeping it.  F2 is a different question, taking a bike that's been around 15 years and trying to change the rules to waive it in.

My issue is keeping the LW class a reasonable playing field.  No question air cooled bikes get a displacement advantage, but how much? That's the question. In my mind, the limits may now need tinkering b/c of technology changes, something like:
- 1200cc for pushrod 2 valve heads
- 1100cc for overhead cam 2 valve heads
- 1000cc for overhead cam 4 valve heads.

Before, there just weren't any 4 valve/overhead cam 1170cc twins. Now there is, and the question is ... is that a LW bike?  The point of my post was CCS should think about it and make an explicit decision, b/c it looks more like a hole in the rules than an intentional rulemaking intended to let 1200cc 4 valve twins compete in the LW class -- which is in contrast with the intentional rulemaking excluding liquid cooled 4 cylinders over 400cc.

[Super Dave]

The point of my post was CCS should think about it and make an explicit decision, b/c it looks more like a hole in the rules than an intentional rulemaking intended to let 1200cc 4 valve twins compete in the LW class -- which is in contrast with the intentional rulemaking excluding liquid cooled 4 cylinders over 400cc.

Do you mean 600cc's?

[George_Linhart]

I completely agree that the issue that comes into play here is the valvetrain configuration.  It is very difficult to get any of the 2 valve heads to breath enough for kind of serious power that the BMW claims.  The Ducati (desmo) motors do breath better than the Buel (pushrod) motors so I can see giving Buel a bit of additional displacement.  Since the BMW (4 valve configuration) flows so much better than either of the other air cooled designs there should be some additional displacement concession there vs. the Ducati.

I guess the problem is that (to my knowledge) BMW doesn't make a 1000cc ohc 4 valve motor - just one in 1170cc so what you are effectively doing is outright eliminating the BMW from the LW class.

Not that I expect to see any out on the grids anytime soon in the MW region even if it was LW legal...

George

[123user]

All of these issues are really not that significant.  Constantly changing rules to ensure fairness is just dumb.  As one writer said, this is club racing- I have another reply to that,  It just doesn't matter that much! No one complains about Cagiva's LWSS legal bike, after the 1000ss its probably the next best.  The suspension is amazing.  The complaining is always about HP, never about standard suspension components.

For me, the one aspect that sets the LW classes apart from the rest are the people.  Very few in LW are "out for blood", or drink themselves into a stuper on Saturday night.  If you haven't looked around lately... its an older crowd too!  Racers that have something to prove will metriculate to the middleweight (and above) classes.  This is the primary reason why it just doesn't matter. 

Racing is supposed to be fun, but for many LW guys is more about building the bike than riding the bike.  Upping the ante, so to speak, just gives many of us better winter projects!  I like winning too, but I take more pride in building a bike that a great rider could win on.  Bring on the competition!

[Ducmarc]

you maybe right a fast rider isn't going to be in lightwt it's going to either be an old and slow or a cheap guy on the new bike( of course it's not the cheap guy) .so it's still one of us.

[123user]

Don't get the wrong impression.  I certainly don't mean the "older crowd" to insinuate "less talent" Arguably, the most talented rider in Midwest region is over 50, and most of the top finishers in all LW classes are over 40.    But I like your analysis of the situation, it appears that many of the highly involved racers in LW don't change much year-to-year.

I've also noted that many of the regulars in the LW classes have professional background. There are a lot of Engineers (or similar) around.  Many of these guys take pride in building a bike and are less inclined to purchase the new hotness.

Does anyone really think that the BMW would be faster at Blackhawk or Gingerman?  Club racers have nothing to fear.

[roadracer162]

exactly, this is club racing, that is why a $30,000 motorcycle shouldn't be lgal in lightweight.

I think that there are many that will spend that. There is a Duc 1000DS in the Florida region that reportedly cost upwards of $40K and then sold at a discounted $27K just becuase the racer was going to cars. It is one fast bike and with Woods on board tore up the track. With the most current owner it doesn't do as well in finishes but it still is fast.

I will stick with my old slow FZR. Bought for $1500, upgrades of $4500. Works well for me in Thunderbike and LW F40. But then again I am slow too.

Mark

[dylanfan53]

Arguably, the most talented rider in Midwest region is over 50,

Thank you... 

Surely he was talking about me Eeky, no?