450GP bike based on MXer

[Jack_Brock]

Where are you?  there are LOTS of SVs here in MA/SE region... 3/4 of the GTL races are stupid SVs.

Competitive on a 125?... I've seen 175lb guys in the top 3.

Good news, I could probably get to 175.

I run the GP region, and once last year, there was a lw expert race where the grid sheet only had 1 bike.  There have been some ok grids, but probably in terms of what you see.  Truly sad because lw is a great class, and so are the people.  There was only one 125 last year, and he only did 1 weekend this year that I know of.

[tzracer]

At 175 you should do fine. Obviously less is better but heavier riders can still do well. One of the USGPRU 250 riders is 6'4" and about 250 pounds and generally runs in the top 4.

Got this from http://www.usgpru.net/faq.php  The quotes are Michael Barnes.

There's also the issue of size. "Although riders over five feet tall will feel cramped and out of place after their first stint on a 125, they shouldn't be discouraged. "Sure the 125's are small," concedes Barnes, who is 5-foot-8 and 130 pounds, "and they weigh somewhere around 160 pounds, but your size doesn't really matter. Look at Moto Liberty's Doug Carmichael: He's got a couple inches and about 30 pounds on me and is just as fast."

I have found racing a 125 to be the most rewarding bike I have ever ridden. To finish well you must ride well, there is no power to save you from your mistakes. It makes you a much better rider.

[RMGSXR124]

Hey! I'm down to 139. Anyone have a 125 for sale?

[resurection]

Although nothing is in stone yet, everything I've been reading is that the class specs will be very narrow. 

The class demo bikes were based off of 4 stroke 450's from Honda, Kawasaki, Yamaha and Suzuki.  One of the requirements discussed was that the donor front end would have to be from the same manufacturer as the frame, motor and swingarm.  How this requirement plays out for other makes like KTM, TM, etc, remains to be seen.

So no, a 500 2 stroke would not fit this class as it's being portrayed. 

Is there a class worthwile?

[Super Dave]

All of them or none of them.  Depends upon your perspective and one's budget.  Kind of like building vintage motorcycles and cars.

[Scotty Ryan]

I feel like I should comment.... I saw the 450 mxer/roadrace bikes being ridden by Schwantz/Elana Meyers and Rolland Sands out at Laguna.... The bikes are hard to tell apart from a 250 at a distance - but man are they LOUD and SLOW.... Not to mention that it took about 30 minutes to get one of the bikes to start.....They are going to have a specific class in WERA for them next season - but that doesn't mean that the AMA is going to addopt them as the new entry level AMA class... I would venture to say that they shouldn't go that route - and after riding a two stroke for the first time this past weekend at Mid Ohio - they should go the 125 route - But then again I really feel that they should just bring back the 250's.... I think it would be less of a jump going from the 250 to a 600 then from a 125 to a 600... Oh and by the way - the 250's are a complete blast to ride.... I can't remember the last time I had that much fun on a bike.... I wouldn't mind riding a 250 more often - and yes, the 2 strokes are smaller and more cramped(I'm 5'11'' and 165lb) - but it just takes a few minutes to get used to ur elbows being past ur knees when your in a tuck.... The nice thing is that it is a real race bike - made specifically for racing - and that they turn without any real effort... Brian is right - it makes you a better rider because you have to learn to carry corner speed and keep your mistakes to a minimum... But I also like Dave's idea about an SV class - talk about cheap and simple... Plus after you get done learning how to race you Street Bike/Race Bike SV - you go to your Street Bike/Race Bike 600 - not go from your Race Bike 125/250 to Street Bike/Race Bike 600.... I can see both sides of the coin tho.....

[Ceej]

[ScubaSteve]

I haven't decided on this.

250's were great, and you could replace pretty much everything about these 450's and put in 250's and it would all sound the same.

In ways, it feels expensive.  An SV based series would be exciting and less expensive and attainable.

Alot of guys have been saying a SV series for years. I would've done it for sure. Doesn't seem to be as many SV guys as a few years ago though

[ecumike]

I think the 125s are a better class than the 250s.  It's the entry point for the up and coming racers.  Look how many kids are riding 125s, and look how many of them are starting to go places..  3 of them in Red Bull Rookie Cup, Herrin and Carter to AMA, and now PJ.. the FIRST AMERICAN to be accepted to MotoGP Academy!

I'll be interesting to see how next year's US RedBull cup races turn out with AMA.

[Burt Munro]

Isn't the real issue here that you have to look toward the future?  2 stroke 125's and 250's are being legislated out of existence!

I don't think many people will argue that 125's are a better place to start.  But how accessible are they and for how long? 

My understanding was that the 450GP class was an attempt to deal with those issues.

[ecumike]

Yes, there is rumor of 450s 'taking over' as the new 125 class... but I think it's still a ways away before Honda/HRC stops producing parts for the 125.  The only thing they have done is raise the price of the pistons, but they've also changed manufacturing processes for it.  Right now they aren't that 'accessible' b/c everyone is grabbing them up and racing them.  :)