Electronic Scoring at CCS Regionals

[Jeff]

Minimal increase in entry fees seems reasonable to me and got my vote.

The rental fee of $25 per event seems insane since most people run 3+ events per weekend.  (or did you mean weekend?)

I thought there was another race org who made electronic scoring mandatory and charged riders $100/year for rental.  CRA???

This would definitely be a plus for CCS though as scoring takes too long and can be subjective.  Plus, there might be the possibility that results could be posted on the CCS site in a timely manner.

The results thus-far are coming up on the website pretty quickly, but there have been many errors (2001 results mixed with 2002) and the overall calculations have not been made since the first race.

[coeff]

What a shame. I really enjoy racing. Unfortunately my discretionary funds only allow me to run 3 to 4 races a season on an old pile. Coupled with another required piece of equipment that is exposed and easily damaged.............maybe I'll have to stick to Pridmore schools and forego the racing.
Particularly since the very first ever CCS trackday cost me over a grand when a moron racer needed to win his practice session so bad he torpedoed me in a corner that folks just don't pass in, hence I didn't even make the remaining race weekend. Top that off with having to replace a $300 transponder.........
Sigh.........

[Eric Kelcher]

Here is the response we recieved from the FUSA scoring team, as we are using them at the remaining CMRA events and our racers had similar questions regarding durabilty. oops this is an AMB system; the DBcom system I know is not as durable as what Judy indicates the AMB is unsure what type is being considered. We have been using the Db com for a number of years for our endurance series and they have proved fairly robust and only about 1-2 a year are damaged, but very few have been destroyed in the 6 plus years we have used tehm

                            The transponders are very durable. It is almost impossible to break them. They are water and in most
                            cases fire proof. They do not need to
                            be placed in any special bag because of weather conditions.

                            We did have a situation at Daytona this spring where a rider crashed and his transponder was left on the
                            track. Generally this is no problem but
                            whoever found it decided to do some R&D work. They removed the cases and found they could not see
                            the board and battery. They then
                            left the transponder in the scoring building at turn 1. In that case if we knew who took it apart they would
                            have been asked to pay for recasing
                            which is about $50.

                            The cases do get scuffed or cracked on occasion. We do not have them recased unless they are damaged
                            to the point they cannot be put back
                            in the charging cases or the tabs on one end or the other are broken off.

                            We have not had any destroyed to the point of having to replace them. As an example a "Main Tainer" ran
                            over one at a Dirt Track race. It
                            cracked the cases slightly. We put the same transponder right back on the bike it came off of. Just a note,
                            the reason it came off the bike to
                            begin with is that the rider did not have the extra zip tie on that is necessary in Dirt Track.

                            It's rare that a transponder is lost. The corner and saftey workers generally do a great job of finding them
                            if they come off when the bikes
                            crash. In the event that they can't find it we will send out a search party to recover it. At the FUSA
                            national races they get sent in with the
                            crash truck.

                            Sometimes we have riders who leave with them still attached to their bikes. We contact those riders and
                            have them ship them back to us. Our
                            name and address is on them.

                            To replace a transponder is $300. To recase it if the tabs are broken off is $50. If the battery has to be
                            replaced because the charging points
                            are destroyed it is $80.

                            We have never had to replace a transponder because it was destroyed.

                            We have 3-5 at the most recased every year.

                            Only one battery has been replaced in three years because the charging points were damaged.

                            I hope this answers your questions. Your riders are more than welcome to email or call me anytime.

                            Judy Horn
                            Mirage scoring/timing

If any of you want to come play this year the CMRA is supsidizing the transponder cost and the events are being run at standard CCS rates for the rest of the season.

[Sean_Alexander]

As someone who runs 7 - 10 classes per race weekend, 12+ weekends per year, I'd definately appreciate the option of buying.  Increasing the fees $5.00 per class, would cost me a minimum of $420 each year.  Renting would cost me a minimum of $300 each year.  A one time $300 purchase option (for me at least) would be by far the most cost effective.

[ceesthadees]

I voted to buy your own transponder, but would also like for others to be able rent that only participate in a few events a year.

[Leon_Eddins]

My first responce would be to say thats a great idea,My second thought is that we all complain about the cost now and just tell someone that to race they must buy a 300.00 transponder to be scored.People get-a-grip.

Leon

[Jeff]

So it's simple.  Have the option of buying your own transponder or paying for it in the increased entry fee.

It'd be a simple box on the entry form which indicates "I have my own transponder" and the entry folks could easily calculate the difference.

It wouldn't be that difficult to sustain a 'dual' option.

[RightRacing328]

It seems to me that if CCS converts to electronic scoring then it would take less human effort/resources to handle the scoring tasks.  Therefore the way I see it, the cost should be offset by less hourly wage staff on hand to man a particular event.  If someone got serious and did a cost benefit analysis we may see an opportunity to drop the staff significantly and who knows maybe even reduce the entry fees?   ;D

Kirk J. Right
Right Racing
Charlotte, NC
CCS # 328

[dhr123]

I also voted to buy my own, but I already own mine since I used to race with GLRRA.  I bought mine for 80 bucks used.  I am sure people can find them out there cheaper than 300.  Or maybe do a bulk buy and get a discount.

Saba

[alexey]

Back in the day (2 years ago) before moving to CA, I raced LRRS.  They required transponders for practices and races.  I thought it was a good idea.  I rented them and was always afraid of destroying one in a crash, but having read the note from Judy Horn, I think it's a pretty minimal risk.  Racing is expensive in general, as a lot of people have already said, and a one-time $300 fee or increasing registration fees a bit is really not that bad.

[skydiver19]

Prior to this past weekend at Summit, I felt like the manual scoring system was fine--I'd never had any problems with the system, so I wasn't interested in paying a penny more for a transpoder.  As a result of a red flag very late in the GT Lights race, however, the results for the race didn't get posted until the end of the day, and they were wrong.  Whole portions of the field were incorrectly ahead of others, a lapped rider was in the top-3, and a top 3 rider was back in 12th.  So the results were protested.  The revised version wasn't put up until the following day, and they were again wrong, this time affecting me personally as well as the guy who actually won the race.  So they were protested again.  An hour later, the results were again revised, with the real winner getting his win, me getting my correct position, but the guy behind me now displaced to an incorrect position.  At this point it was advised that due to the confusion of the red flag and significant lap traffic, the 3rd version was set in stone and no further changes would be made.  Basically, the absence of electronic scoring cost everyone headaches, the officials and scorers most of all, and one racer some money (and a bigger plaque.)

This isn't a knock on the scorers--I wouldn't/couldn't do that job.  I can barely keep track of one bike when spectating let alone the whole field, in lap traffic, then throw in a red flag.  I understand the officials were up into the late hours trying to sort out the results and know they did the best they could.  Now that this has affected me directly, I'm all in favor of switching to electronic scoring (by the next event  ;D)  and have voted accordingly.  Personally, I'd rather buy my own transponder as the long-term expense over a full season or two will be less than a flat increase to each of the entry fees.  I hope this will be an option--the fees are hand written on the entry form, so it's obvious they're manually calculated. Transponder owners pay one way, renters another.  

Blue skys!!