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1991 and older bikes

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the_weggie_man

Re: 1991 and older bikes
« Reply #24 on: November 29, 2002, 01:02:37 pm »
Hey casper, take it easy man.

#1, I don't ride an SV and Ed Key does not ride my old one.  Also I'd like to see the 110 hp SV, it would have to be a ticking time bomb.

My point is bikes get old and you can't have a class for everything so you need to update or live with it.

My reference to guys not riding up to their bikes potential was not directed to you. It was for the guys that think they need a new bike to go faster, therefor buying new bikes every year and dumping their old ones relatively cheap. You gotta love 'em cause the rest of us can update without paying the big bucks. Got it?

Oh, one more thing, for Dawn.  Jesse Janisch's bike is stock except for a pipe and jet kit, no other engine work at all. Not even a fresh top end to start out. Something like 72 hp.  They bought it as a light crasher for $1,500 did the suspension, body work, threw on tires and went to the track. No dyno time, no suspension set up until his 2nd or 3rd weekend out.  He just plain rides the freakin' wheels off it.
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Dawn

Re: 1991 and older bikes
« Reply #25 on: November 29, 2002, 01:15:06 pm »
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Oh, one more thing, for Dawn.  Jesse Janisch's bike is stock except for a pipe and jet kit, no other engine work at all. Not even a fresh top end to start out. Something like 72 hp.  They bought it as a light crasher for $1,500 did the suspension, body work, threw on tires and went to the track. No dyno time, no suspension set up until his 2nd or 3rd weekend out.  He just plain rides the freakin' wheels off it.


Yeah I know, but when Jesse started racing, Paul really started to feel old...

15 years old vs 36 years old
130 lbs vs 230 lbs
a feeling of invicibility vs "I gotta' go to work on Monday"

Someday when Jesse is racing with the "big boys" Paul will be able to say...  "yeah I raced with him and he kicked my butt even then"

Dawn   ;)
« Last Edit: November 29, 2002, 01:16:11 pm by Dawn »
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Super Dave

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Re: 1991 and older bikes
« Reply #26 on: November 29, 2002, 01:26:04 pm »
Yes, Jesse is special.  I'll leave it at that.  

Superbike rules have certain perameters.  But if we talk about the sheer performance of a motorcycle, they just fit into a certain area.  So, I did a 13 on my stock GSXR600 (pipe that was broken that day, shock, forkwork, bodywork, braided lines, Barnett Clutch springs, Power Mist TO137 that weekend - all my secrets are out, big deal).  Several years prior I was doing 16's on an F2.  It was a full supersport motor making 94HP.  Fastest times on 600's then were 15's, unless someone can say someone did a 15 that year.  

Now, Ed Key and Mike Reibe both did high 17's this year.  I think Ed's supersport bike makes 73HP.  That's still a ways back from the 16's and 15's of the supersport F2's.  And I would have to say that Ed and Mike are probably doing a very good job, going about as fast as they can go.

So, if your F2 is not going those speeds, we've got some real issues on why.  First, you do weigh a bit more than I do, the last time I saw you.  That is a huge thing for acceleration.  Next, the suspension set up.  It might be just not working right.  HP is really last.  My GSXR600 dyno-ed at 104 in 2001 doing a 13.  That is not special where I had an advantage.  

I see good ideas on both sides for why and why not.  But if you can lean me a bit more on the why, I think we'd all see reason to support you in this.
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Super Dave

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CaSpEr_Dude

Re: 1991 and older bikes
« Reply #27 on: November 29, 2002, 01:26:45 pm »
1st  Dawn at what point did I try using bad lingo in my post and second at what point did you start to hate me that s fine if you do but give a guy a reason !
ok waggie What set me off is the old grape vine bs
I was trying to get older bike in at the lw super bike and lw gp class because they are very compete but every one read as I was trying to get them in with the all lw class NO NO NO k3s bike is much faster than my f2 and eds bike is way faster than mine and edgar dorn and jesse and so on these bikes and riders are all comptetive with me and my bike and same with  other f2 riders  such as Owen he had a hell or a time with the sv and he is skinny unlike me and his weight is down there !
ok about your old sv I may be mistaken but i do think I'm not do you have a sv if not ok what ever
but if you do I get my work done buy some one that knows you guys the ed key group and I was told by these people that you guys got 110 out of an sv ok what ever if not cool but it  is true the hp might not be there with a sv but the torque is witch make that little sv go a whole lot faster than my in line 4 you can not disagree there!! so inconclusion I was tick because you guy where not read all the posting befor you started writing your opions everyone can have but make sure you know what was said pryor
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roadracer797

Re: 1991 and older bikes
« Reply #28 on: November 29, 2002, 01:35:34 pm »
Casper
As someone else who has an older bike I'm totally with you and if these other peoplr can't understand then piss on them, we are just trying to run in a class where our bikes would be competitive. Oh heck just put the casper jinx on them all
Craig
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Dawn

Re: 1991 and older bikes
« Reply #29 on: November 29, 2002, 01:40:17 pm »
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1st  Dawn at what point did I try using bad lingo in my post and second at what point did you start to hate me that s fine if you do but give a guy a reason !



Casper...  I don't hate you.  Where did you come up with that?   ???

Bad lingo...  

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ok guys if you are going to coment then READ the whole damb post cause


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Mark styles can kiss most of our ass


Dawn   :)
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Super Dave

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Re: 1991 and older bikes
« Reply #30 on: November 29, 2002, 02:18:51 pm »
Ok, old bikes.  

I ride a lot older bikes.  And the basic problems always apply to older bike.  One, everyone forgets to get the geometry correct and suspension right.  That is the key.  The SV is common, so the guys that are really running them fast have them working correctly so that they can go in faster, maintain that speed, and then get out quickly.

Eventually, money and time permitting, I'll put my 500 Kaw triple on the track.  It's a 1975.  I fully expect to do 18's on it, when I get the geometry correct, and the engine at the correct state of tune.  It still won't have the HP of Superbike SV's or Supersport f2's.  

As for SV's making 110!  Haven't hear it.  I have heard of 97 to 100HP.  And they blow up.
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Super Dave

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Dawn

Re: 1991 and older bikes
« Reply #31 on: November 29, 2002, 02:22:08 pm »
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As for SV's making 110!  Haven't hear it.  I have heard of 97 to 100HP.  And they blow up.


Didn't Edgar go through three motors this year? or was it only two?

Dawn
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CaSpEr_Dude

Re: 1991 and older bikes
« Reply #32 on: November 29, 2002, 07:41:34 pm »
well dawn as far as the bad lingo gose I hope you do not let your son go very far from your pit cuz damb and they other word that you thought was bad
that I said that is nothing compared to what is being said all weekend at the track in many diff. pits enough of that .
Edgar only went through one motor this year that I know of and it was down in daytona and he said that was because he had the jetting wrong.
Dave I heard of this 110 sv through some guys that do work with a company that I deal with and It could have been bs but seeing what these guys do with bikes I could believe it .
And I agree getting a bike set up is half the battle
with that  being said there are very few of us that are that good at that  type of thing but I did have my set up by Ed with track side  !! ok it is as good as it is going to get Until I loose weight wich is what I am in the process of doing but still the older bike can only do so much so in the rule book for the older bike in those two class that I and other would like to run It could limit the things you can do to the older 600 such as supersport legal only in the superbike and gp lw classes.You and I know the bike is only as good as the rider right Dave you can have that 600 set up perf. but if the rider can't ride the bike won't win!
I road an sv at Black hawk Dave and it was set up for a female rider that was alot lighter than me about 200lbs. not only Did I beat edgar Dorn but I ran my fast lap to this date there ! why is that ?you can ask mark style wife if you like she was timming me on that day and did not even know till she told me .I mean if the geometry is what it takes than whats up with that .You said you would hope to be in the 18 with a 500 well you would prob.beat me cuz that is my best time with the sv and 19 and low 20  with my f2 so there you have it dave you looking for somthing for you to lean you on our said you said it your self thanks
Kenny owen ran an f2 in the hw sportsman and he was fast but not any faster than Mark ,Edgar Or jessie and he was on a f2 rebie kicks my (butt) is that better Dawn!! I hope so he's on an sv ok what more can I say about this make a class for the older bike like sdiver said 3000 class great than that would make us happy as well somthing that will go toward our over all . Not like the sportsman races that don't count this stuff about it not being fair to the lw bike in those two classes they are called super bike and gp that means you can bulid them, right than do so it seem to me that the guys that are fitting me so hard are the one that don't want to put money into ther bike to make them go faster !!!! right!!!! but in the same note you guys are telling to go and buy a newer bike if I want to compete what's the diff. OH ya you wont be spending the money. To race a superbike that means built better and faster spend the money .
But know you want to run your stock sv or what ever in those two class right and not have to spend the money !! and hope to win well Edgar spent the money and can't race the other light weight class
but yet he was able to bring home 5 champ. this year and what like a 3 rd over all ! at black hawk
he didn't complain cuz

he modified it to make it faster
faster thatn a f2 .those running in the SUPERBIKE AND GP CLASS.
Dave  Alexander I see your point but do you run those Bike in the superbike and gplw classses if so how do you do !  in them!!
And Full Moon racing you are generalizing that all f2 are 90 some hrs power that is not the case a stock f2 pipe and jet 87 hrs power and that is with a fresh rebuild! Dave I do not know where you get your dyno done but man it could really help sell bikes with those reading . AND dAVE IF YOU ARE TRYING TO SELL ME ON YOUR CLASSES IT WORK ILL take some NEXT YEAR!!!!
LOL ;D ;D ;D
« Last Edit: November 29, 2002, 07:56:14 pm by CaSpEr_Dude »
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CaSpEr_Dude

Re: 1991 and older bikes
« Reply #33 on: November 29, 2002, 07:59:10 pm »
Oh YA
I also read on here that an ex500 holds the number one plate in one of the other regions so is it really the Bike !!!!! or rider
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EX#996

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Re: 1991 and older bikes
« Reply #34 on: November 30, 2002, 03:34:49 am »
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well dawn as far as the bad lingo gose I hope you do not let your son go very far from your pit cuz damb and they other word that you thought was bad

Kenny owen ran an f2 in the hw sportsman and he was fast but not any faster than Mark ,Edgar Or jessie and he was on a f2 rebie kicks my (butt) is that better Dawn!!


Casper:

We have a daughter - and at the track if someone is swearing a blue streak she knows just to walk away.  Here, however, the words are in print and they don't go away unless the person that posts them removes them.  At the track, I don't hear all the profanity like a read on these BBS's.  

Sorry Casper if you thought I was singling you out, it wasn't intended that way.  It is frustrating for me to go to the other boards and be subjected to reading all that 'crap'.  A person may say to me "Well, just don't read it," but I enjoy this sport as much as anyone else out here.  

To answer your question - yes - butt is better.

If anyone thinks that I am just being a wench, just be thankful you don't have to live with me.   ;)

Dawn   :)

(are you still mad at me, Casper?)   ???
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Paul and Dawn Buxton

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Super Dave

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Re: 1991 and older bikes
« Reply #35 on: November 30, 2002, 04:11:18 am »
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Oh YA
I also read on here that an ex500 holds the number one plate in one of the other regions so is it really the Bike !!!!! or rider



Well, the rider is responsible for riding.  So, yeah, the rider a bit factor.  If you went faster on an SV, then I see a problem with the F2.  Ed's a nice guy and all.  Did he ride your bike?  They how can he know what it's doing.  Sometimes, I have to go ride my students bikes.  The bike will do things that directly affect how you are riding it.  It gives you feed back that you use to determine how fast to go.  The bike tells you, "This is all the faster you can go, or I'm gonna throw you down in five..."  That's my job sometimes;  interpreting what the bike is saying, helping you understand that language, trying to get that fixed.  I can be simple.  I've you've got an aftermarket shock on the back, you've probably got all you need.  

We did the same things with K3.  Actually, I never got on his bike.  I could just see it at the school.  I made him do a couple of minor changes that I though might make it work better.  BANG, it clicked.  He knew how to ride decently, most of us do, but getting the translation out of the bike so that you ride faster so that you think you won't die....

I'm here to help.  
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Super Dave