Poll
Question:
Which track would you prefer for the ROC on October 15-17, 2010
Option 1: Heartland Park-Topeka
votes: 97
Option 2: Hometead-Miami Speedway
votes: 64
This poll is for our information only, it is not a guarantee that the event will be held at the track that scores best in the poll. The poll ends on May 27th.
As you know by now, the Daytona International Speedway is being repaved so we have to move the ROC for this year. The two tracks we use that have the weekend open are Heartland Park Topeka and Homestead Miami Speedway. While there are advantages to both facilities there are also disadvantages to each, so as far as that part of the equation goes, it is up to you to figure out which gets your vote. This poll is not the final say on the location of the event, but it will give us a better feel for which facility to proceed in negotiations with.
For reference, I've calculated some approximate driving distances for each region. For Riders from the Mid-Atlantic, Atlantic and Northeast, the distance is almost identical, roughly 1290 miles. Midwest riders it's 1450 miles to Homestead and 600 to Heartland Park. Riders in Florida, Heartland Park is roughly 1500 miles from South Florida. Southwest riders see the most dramatic difference, Homestead is 2400 miles and Heartland Park is 1300. Great Plains riders have the reverse of the Florida distances, less than 300 to Heartland Park and 1500 to Homestead.
Please vote based on your likelyhood to attend the event. If you know you are not going to attend regardless of location, please do taint the results by voting.
Thank you for your support of CCS Racing.
wow.. tough call in some ways. I should be biased to race Homestead since it is only 5 hrs. away, but the chance to ride a track i have never ridden?? Gotta hold my vote for a bit to think about it!!
heartland park.
im a floridian but child support is a bitch. since im stationed in missouri topeka will be my best bet to run.
If it's @ Topeka, I'll definately attend. Homestead and even Daytona would not be a consideration. Daytona was fun (once) but I've got no real desire to go back particularly since it's become more of a Nascar configuration since I last raced there.
TOPEKA!
It is difficult for me to understand having the national championship race at one of the most extreme South East locations in the country. At least HPT is roughly in the center of the country.
I get that Daytona is a tradition, but if that venue is off the table something in the middle of the country makes sense.
If at HPT I will definitley be there.
George
NJMP
I agree, wholeheartedly, with HPT. Excellent track- great facilities, etc. I would love to one day race @ Daytona, but the distance is too extreme. +1 for giving those of us in the middle of the nation a chance to host CCS' Race of Champions!
I'd rather do Barber than those 2.
Quote from: Macon663 on May 18, 2010, 10:03:56 AM
I'd rather do Barber than those 2.
.. your not doing it right.. 8)
Quote from: Macon663 on May 18, 2010, 10:03:56 AM
I'd rather do Barber than those 2.
You know- I agree with this. However, given that Homestead and HPT are the only two with the dates open, I chose HPT.
I think the ROC should be somewhere like Barber, or Road Atlanta consistantly. If all regions are invited to come out and race one another, then it only makes sense to host such an event at the most geographically nuetral of tracks.
I may get a negative karma or two for this, but to me- anually hosting the ROC in the same, most extreme location (geographically speaking of course) location makes the "Race of Champions" more like the "Race of Those Who Showed Up".
Fire away with the negativism, but I honestly feel the ROC should be held on middle ground for all regions. Or, to be equally fair- have the ROC change each year, allowing each region to host it.
Just ideas....
been discussed before.
Barber.. tiny and slow. Fun yes.. but the track is too small for huge grids is what the consensus is. And, you never get out of 4th gear. And now ya got me "doing it wrong" :ahhh:
Choice A) Homestead
Choice B) Topeka
take "where it should be" to another thread?? :blahblah:
out if either those tend to be the final option
Quote from: MELK-MAN on May 18, 2010, 12:25:34 PM
been discussed before.
Barber.. tiny and slow. Fun yes.. but the track is too small for huge grids is what the consensus is. And, you never get out of 4th gear. And now ya got me "doing it wrong" :ahhh:
Choice A) Homestead
Choice B) Topeka
take "where it should be" to another thread?? :blahblah:
Laguna Seca...lol
.. isn't there a rule forbidding CCS staff instigating s--t Steve?? LOL.. :biggrin:
Quote from: MELK-MAN on May 18, 2010, 01:01:38 PM
.. isn't there a rule forbidding CCS staff instigating s--t Steve?? LOL.. :biggrin:
Obviously there isn't such a rule! :cheers:
Voted...I would be in for HPT and OUT for Homestead
Quote from: MELK-MAN on May 18, 2010, 01:01:38 PM
.. isn't there a rule forbidding CCS staff instigating s--t Steve?? LOL.. :biggrin:
Nope! :biggrin:
Homestead is a blast along with the use of garages.
Weather is oustanding in October compaired to Topeka,
Topeka
http://www.wunderground.com/history/airport/KTOP/2009/10/15/DailyHistory.html?
Homestead
http://www.wunderground.com/history/airport/KHST/2009/10/15/DailyHistory.html?
I agree with Ken, warm weather, and awesome garages at Homestead!! Its gonna be very cold up there in Topeka in October!
With Homestead you have free electricity and plenty of room for pit garages... and no stinking canopies...
Never been to HPT always enjoy running a new track for sure. But two things I despise are the cold (yes 45 degrees is cold for me- Floridian) and driving over 3000 miles! That's over $1300 in diesel. I choose solely based on the cost of fuel, drive time and weather.
Nothing against my Northern race brothers. I know nothing about HPT, my decision is not based on their facility or track layout. If I did have the time and means to go I would certainly race where ever the event would be held. So for all you Kansans if it turns out to be Homestead I understand if you are upset, just as I will be if it is HPT.
I feel sorry for Kevin because either way it turns out he will get the hate mail. So I make this promise to Kevin " I promise not to complain if the ROC is held at Homestead."
And just because I am grasping at everything to get the votes our way, our lovely pit ladies in Miami are a sight all their own. Dark tan women, short skirts. nough said. Great hotels right down the street from the track as well.
topeka has Baby Dolls... nuff said! :cheers:
Let's see...... Hurricanes or Tornadoes????
I'll go with Baby Dolls for $500 Alex.
Quote from: KenW on May 18, 2010, 10:57:46 PMAnd just because I am grasping at everything to get the votes our way, our lovely pit ladies in Miami are a sight all their own. Dark tan women, short skirts. nough said. Great hotels right down the street from the track as well.
(just to be fair)
Doesn't the Miami area also have one of the highest crime rates in the entire country as well?
I voted HPT.
But just to stir the pot, how about VIR, Carolina, Roebling Road, Nashville or ... :biggrin:
I have been going to Homestead for almost 5 yrs w/o any issues as it relates to crime.
As far as your "baby dolls", they will be bundled up as it will be in the 50's. Our lovely young ladies will be in shorts and well tanned.
If the weather was better, Topeka would not sound that bad but it is going to be COLD.
Quote from: CounterSteerer on May 18, 2010, 09:21:42 PM
That's over $1300 in diesel. I choose solely based on the cost of fuel, drive time
Welcome to the world the rest of us live in and have had to deal with for years....
I was really looking forward to going back to daytona again this year.. I love that place. Miami.. I will not Make the trip, sorry. I will try and get next year off for daytona again.
Now hpt.. Holy crap... I would only need three days of vacation to daytonas 10!!!! If it's at hpt I will be at a few more track days to get that place sorted better!
We have been going to the Daytona opener and ROC steady for 3 years but will not drive all the way to the bottom of FL if it is there this year.
HPT!!!! I want to ride with the BIG BOYS/GIRLS! Show how amazingly slow I am!
Quote from: KenW on May 19, 2010, 06:36:44 AMAs far as your "baby dolls", they will be bundled up as it will be in the 50's. Our lovely young ladies will be in shorts and well tanned.
Baby Dolls is a.......hmmmmm.......let's say establishment........just down the road from Heartland Park. And the girls there will be displaying even more of their tanned selves. :biggrin:
50F? that could suck.. 60 would not be bad. Where do we vote for the temp?
I typically can still ride in St. Louis midway through December. October is absolutely beautiful in the midwest in October. Usually around 70 or so during the day. Come one, florida folks- we race at Road America in April...look at HPT as a new experience for you! LOL
I had Daytona ROC on my schedule and in my budget for 2010. Homestead....not so much. But HPT for me is a no brainer. Hell yeah!!
Quote from: MELK-MAN on May 19, 2010, 10:27:21 AM
50F? that could suck.. 60 would not be bad. Where do we vote for the temp?
Road America in April... we don't do it anymore, but I can remember many races where you could barely bend your fingers around the handlebars to hold on.. for just one lap!
Topeka, shouldn't be any worse then Daytona was last fall.
Come to the true center of the United States.. not the so called center elsewhere...
Quote from: MELK-MAN on May 19, 2010, 10:27:21 AM
50F? that could suck.. 60 would not be bad. Where do we vote for the temp?
Come on up Greg. Put you gloves on your warmers and you'll be fine.
First beer at Baby Dolls on me!
If you were already planning on racing in Daytona this year how is driving an additional 300 miles to Homestead going to break you? I am sure the hotels are cheaper and the cost to run the event at Homestead is cheaper than Daytona so I will assume entry fees, parking RV fees, pit pass etc.... will be cheaper. This should offset the cost of the additional 300 miles.
temp during the day is high 60s, low 70s in oct at heartland. i dunno where you sallies are getting this 50* BS. anything over 75 is too hot for a day at the track, anyway ;)
i love how everyone is hanging on to their preferred location by a thread. lol
weather.com
Quote from: Greeny on May 19, 2010, 01:38:05 PM
temp during the day is high 60s, low 70s in oct at heartland. i dunno where you sallies are getting this 50* BS. anything over 75 is too hot for a day at the track, anyway ;)
i love how everyone is hanging on to their preferred location by a thread. lol
I'd rather race in the 60's than the 90's any day.
The averages from NOAA.com
Average Highs and Lows for Topeka in October
Date Average
High
(deg F) Average
Low
(deg F)
1st 75 50
2nd 75 49
3rd 74 49
4th 74 48
5th 74 48
6th 73 48
7th 73 47
8th 72 47
9th 72 46
10th 72 46
11th 71 45
12th 71 45
13th 70 45
14th 70 44
15th 70 44
16th 69 44
17th 69 43
18th 68 43
19th 68 42
20th 67 42
21st 67 42
22nd 67 41
23rd 66 41
24th 66 40
25th 65 40
26th 65 40
27th 64 39
28th 64 39
29th 63 39
30th 63 38
31st 62 38
Quote from: CounterSteerer on May 19, 2010, 12:59:55 PM
If you were already planning on racing in Daytona this year how is driving an additional 300 miles to Homestead going to break you? I am sure the hotels are cheaper and the cost to run the event at Homestead is cheaper than Daytona so I will assume entry fees, parking RV fees, pit pass etc.... will be cheaper. This should offset the cost of the additional 300 miles.
Basically your answer is that you can't justify the cost of travelling but you expect that we should have no problem to go to a lesser venue and travel an additional 300 miles just to convenience you? While I don't get excited about Daytona I get that it is a tradition and this venue is considered a special draw for the ROC. Since this venue is off the table, why is having the race somewhere centrally located (though not as logistically easy for the Floridians) such a bad thing?
VIR, Barber, NJMP, Road Atlanta and Mid-Ohio are not an option (although all would be a worthwile if somehow the dates could work). What is getting me pissed is the sense of entitlement from those who have it easy when we do race at the traditional venue. How is it always OK for everyone to have to travel to Florida every other year so that the one year that Daytona isn't an option than the only other choice has to be what is convenient for you????
I am not running for a championship so at the end of the day it doesn't matter much to me. If it is at HPT I will go, otherwise, you Florida locals can have it.
George
heartland park topeka!
Quote from: SnacktimeKC on May 19, 2010, 02:34:46 PM
I'd rather race in the 60's than the 90's any day.
The averages from NOAA.com
Average Highs and Lows for Topeka in October
Date Average
High
(deg F) Average
Low
(deg F)
1st 75 50
2nd 75 49
3rd 74 49
4th 74 48
5th 74 48
6th 73 48
7th 73 47
8th 72 47
9th 72 46
10th 72 46
11th 71 45
12th 71 45
13th 70 45
14th 70 44
15th 70 44
16th 69 44
17th 69 43
18th 68 43
19th 68 42
20th 67 42
21st 67 42
22nd 67 41
23rd 66 41
24th 66 40
25th 65 40
26th 65 40
27th 64 39
28th 64 39
29th 63 39
30th 63 38
31st 62 38
werd.
looks like perfect riding weather to me! a little space heater in your trailer at night will do the trick.
Quote from: skiandclimb on May 18, 2010, 12:08:50 PM
I may get a negative karma or two for this, but to me- anually hosting the ROC in the same, most extreme location (geographically speaking of course) location makes the "Race of Champions" more like the "Race of Those Who Showed Up".
Very true. I am voting for Homestead. My logic is that at this late date, most people have already made arrangements and those who were planning to attend Daytona will still attend an event at Homestead, since it's only a couple hundred miles difference.
The ROC is always the "race of who showed up", and it will be no different in Topeka. Most of the people from the South / Southeast / East coast will NOT drive 2000 miles to Topeka.
I'm not saying that it will be a smaller event, just different folks.
And there's nothing wrong with that.
explore different dates and make it VIR
I already voted HPT, more equal for all, still 20 hrs for me
Quote from: George_Linhart on May 19, 2010, 02:45:23 PM
Basically your answer is that you can't justify the cost of travelling but you expect that we should have no problem to go to a lesser venue and travel an additional 300 miles just to convenience you? While I don't get excited about Daytona I get that it is a tradition and this venue is considered a special draw for the ROC. Since this venue is off the table, why is having the race somewhere centrally located (though not as logistically easy for the Floridians) such a bad thing?
VIR, Barber, NJMP, Road Atlanta and Mid-Ohio are not an option (although all would be a worthwile if somehow the dates could work). What is getting me pissed is the sense of entitlement from those who have it easy when we do race at the traditional venue. How is it always OK for everyone to have to travel to Florida every other year so that the one year that Daytona isn't an option than the only other choice has to be what is convenient for you????
I am not running for a championship so at the end of the day it doesn't matter much to me. If it is at HPT I will go, otherwise, you Florida locals can have it.
George
I think his point was that if you were already planning to go to Daytona, the extra couple hundred miles should be negligible. I tend to agree with him.
Wether or not to SCHEDULE the ROC at a different location is a completely different issue. If CCS thinks it's best to have the ROC at a different location, they should schedule it there at the beginning of the season and see what happens. I personally don't think the event will be as popular, for a variety of reasons. Again, separate subject.
The ROC was SCHEDULED for Daytona this year, logically if that venue is unavailable, it should be placed at the closest geographical alternate. 200 miles is pretty close. 2000 is not. I get the feeling that most people who are saying they will only go if the ROC is held in Topeka weren't going to go anyway, so if the race is in Homestead, not much will change.
No matter what, some people are going to be unhappy.
I can name several people off the top of my head that were planning on the 24 hour drive to Daytona (as we have many times) but will not go to Homestead. We were going for Daytona not just another track. But you're right, either way people are going to be unhappy.
Quote from: GSXR RACER MIKE on May 19, 2010, 10:21:01 AM
Baby Dolls is a.......hmmmmm.......let's say establishment........just down the road from Heartland Park. And the girls there will be displaying even more of their tanned selves. :biggrin:
We are actually working on getting poles placed in the garages for additional "entertainment". I know, it is a stretch but ya got to dream.
I wonder what CCS' demographics look like? If there is a majority on the East Coast it would make more sense to have it in the East and vice versa. If it evenly spread throughout the country HPT sounds like a fair deal. 22 hours for me is a deal breaker when it comes to HPT. Heck even 14 hours to Homestead is a long way but fiscally more better gooder.
It's almost exactly 1300 miles from Daytona to Heartland Park according to Mapquest, and apx 250 miles from Daytona to Miami. The 9 (or is it 10?) times I've raced at Daytona I've towed my 26 foot trailer the 1235 miles down there every time, several of those times alone.
For those of you who have never driven that far (or even alot farther) there are options. There's bound to be other racers who want to go but either can't afford it or can't miss that much work or vice versa. What I've done several times is transport other racers bike(s) and equipment for them, sometimes just taking all there stuff with me at the last event before the ROC. Then those racers fly in to Daytona or another regional airport, sometimes I pick them up at the airport next to the track or they rent a car themselves. What I generally did was charged a fee for any bikes I transported to help cover the fuel cost, more money if they had 2 bikes or alot of equipment - I've also worked it out before so the fly-in racers cover the cost of our hotel room as part (or all) of covering the transport fee. When at the track the racers who I transported their stuff for would either pit out of my trailer, with another racer, or even get their own garage. While it was true that I had to miss 4 extra days of work in order to make the drive, I had 4 weeks vacation available to me every year from my job so I didn't mind the time off or the drive. If I got really creative I could have handled up to 9 bikes in my trailer, the most I ever transported was 7. By doing this the costs of going to a distance event is dramatically reduced by allowing some of the racers to miss less work and split the costs of getting all the equipment to and from the event.
Heartland Park is located right next to Forbes Field (airport) and only 45 minutes or so from Kansas City if someone really wanted to fly into there and rent a car. :thumb:
I would think there would be a broader draw if location is KS. Most of the MW/GP would come out. along with a few FL folks. Those that had planned the trek and mileage is comparable will still attend. You'll get a larger draw from further west. I dont see from an 'event' standpoint how topeka could miss out. Whats the percentage of riders from outside FL that attended the ROC in the past? I would bet if in KS the % of outer region riders would grow... We'd pick up OK, CO, MN and more.
First off, I hate Daytona and always have. I don't find it a fun track to ride. It was better utilizing the shorter course, but still sucked in my opinion.
Homestead is a fun track, about as much fun and technical as you can have for a "roval." Way better than the stupid Cal Speedway track.
Heartland Park is fun and technical, but facilities fall behind Homestead (limited garages, power, etc)
The only thing Daytona offered in my eyes was some exclusivity. What I mean is that a rider only could see Daytona once or twice the whole year. Didn't give much of a home field advantage.
A lot of people are offering up their favorite tracks, but in the spirit of the "Race of Champions" shouldn't it be on a track that the majority of racers don't get much time on - to kind of level the playing field?
Quote from: George_Linhart on May 19, 2010, 02:45:23 PM
Basically your answer is that you can't justify the cost of travelling but you expect that we should have no problem to go to a lesser venue and travel an additional 300 miles just to convenience you? While I don't get excited about Daytona I get that it is a tradition and this venue is considered a special draw for the ROC. Since this venue is off the table, why is having the race somewhere centrally located (though not as logistically easy for the Floridians) such a bad thing?
VIR, Barber, NJMP, Road Atlanta and Mid-Ohio are not an option (although all would be a worthwile if somehow the dates could work). What is getting me pissed is the sense of entitlement from those who have it easy when we do race at the traditional venue. How is it always OK for everyone to have to travel to Florida every other year so that the one year that Daytona isn't an option than the only other choice has to be what is convenient for you????
I am not running for a championship so at the end of the day it doesn't matter much to me. If it is at HPT I will go, otherwise, you Florida locals can have it.
George
George basically Gino230 response was my point.
Please don't put words in my mouth. I have no problem telling people my opinion. I never said or implied that I or anyone else is entitled to anything in any of my post. I have said it before I am very fortunate to live in an area where I have these venues close to my home.
So of course I am going to vote for a venue that is not a 3000 mile trip for me. Just like you are choosing the same. I have driven this distance to race plenty of times, it sucks. I feel sorry for anyone who has to make the drive. My hat goes off to anyone that is willing, has the means and dedication to travel long distances to race.
So to be clear;
In my opinion I wish it were at Daytona there is no track in the world like it. (I am not saying it is the best.)
I vote for Homestead because it is convenient for me and is a great facility.
Quote from: George_Linhart on May 19, 2010, 02:45:23 PM
I am not running for a championship so at the end of the day it doesn't matter much to me. If it is at HPT I will go, otherwise, you Florida locals can have it.
Nothing against you but if it doesn't matter to you don't get all upset and don't vote. Also, there are locals at every track I have raced.
Walt 221- If it turns out to be Homestead you are only allowed to race the drag bike.
HOMESTEAD !!!!!!
if times were good I would say lets travel but now that there is no sponsorship $$ im saying homestead.
I have raced both tracks and in my opinion Heartland Park is a much more fun course than homestead. The facilities at homestead are nicer, but im not racing on the facilities. Its about the same distance travel wise for me either way so thats not an issue. I would still much rather have it at Daytona. I love that place!
I might even come out of retirement if its at HPT
Will the dates remand the same, even though the races are not being held at Daytona?
this supposed to be the race of the year,but either track is just another race homestead is closer but the walls and little run off are my issue . and you have to watch your shit like a hawk. never been to HPt but but seems like it is a track you go to to get points at like CMP. not travel 1200 miles for a championship. judging from the turnout last year we could all fit in jennings with only one race there this year and a little closer for the northerners that's where i'd go. but the So. FL boys even complain about that. (execpt Greg, its tattooed on the back of his head) hell it saves me money now i don't have to build a new daytona motor this year. i can let it all sit in the corner till march. when i think about what track i'd drive 1200 miles to for a cup i think about VIR barber mid ohio road america road atlanta maybe new jersey and a leg strecher laguna seca but homestead or some place in kansas . come on only the locals will show up for either race and outside attendance will suck.
LOL.. i have only been to Jennings a few times Mark!!
Homestead , Would be the best place for ROC because of the weather not Topeka yes it is far for a lot of people but so is Daytona . It is very nice down here in OCT . So my vote would be Homestead .
almost 2-1 in favor of Topeka...
greg i know you are the all time lap count record holder there especially since markie brown retired
Well at least the AMA came to HPT last year. More than Jennings or Homestead will ever see. Granted the track promoted it - not- and attendance sucked. But it's not some crap layout in a farmers field (see MAM).
I was in a gas station close to forbes field and the track buying ice for my cooler at one of the ccs rounds last year. There was a small poster in the window "Tornado Nationals buy your tickets here" (AMA races), I asked the clerks if they were selling many and they did not know anything about it. They were more excited about the stock car races the next weekend. Promotion is everything but they did not do it well.
With that said I vote for Topeka, it will give the GP region one more race this season!
To freakin far for me. Id be out for either destination.
vote for miami atleast i got family there that I can visit
Daytona is waaaaay too far but we will race the 2010 ROC if it goes to Topeka! :cheers:
Let's do the race at Laguna or Miller....(those are tracks), my vote Homestead, I have raced both and Topeka, like mr Mladin, Pietri, The Hacker, and other riders that didnt race the AMA round said , its dangerous..... So my vote is Homestead, I think those guys that have won "some" champioships in The AMA now what their are talking about.
I am with Santiago (and others) on this one....Homestead. It is safer than the last ROC there and the weather is nice in October. Just my opinion.
Looks like CCS may get some serious crossover with an HPT event:
http://forums.mra-racing.org/viewtopic.php?t=10982
I wonder if Topeka would pick up some riders from CRA and CMRA that wouldn't normally travel to Florida?
I smell some last minute ballet box stuffing from the south.
Quote from: Tornado Bait on May 27, 2010, 10:48:50 AM
I smell some last minute ballet box stuffing from the south.
Hanging Chad?
Sniff sniff- hmmm....agreed!
Quote from: SnacktimeKC on May 27, 2010, 11:10:30 AM
Hanging Chad?
You want to hang Chad? What did he do??? :ass:
Quote from: Tornado Bait on May 27, 2010, 10:48:50 AM
I smell some last minute ballet box stuffing from the south.
LOL.. look for a rise in new user names! I don't know weather to laugh or cry. Love a different track but DAMN is that gonna be a drive, and probably gonna be cold. Just tell em to put off repaving Daytona and just have the ROC there.. !
Quote from: MELK-MAN on May 27, 2010, 01:45:47 PM
but DAMN is that gonna be a drive
Pretty sure thats what the rest of the free world has said about Daytona for the past two decades! lol
For what its worth, Melka- I'll buy you a beer @ HPT, bro!
Must be some Chicago politicians that moved to Florida........ vote early and vote often!
Quote from: Tornado Bait on May 27, 2010, 10:48:50 AM
I smell some last minute ballet box stuffing from the south.
Your sense of "smell" seems to have let you down and caused you to make a "last minute" misrepresentation! The "south" accepts your apology!
Looks like I had better stock up on cold weather gear. Last years ROC and hell this year's round, were cold enough. What is it going to be like in Kansas?
Is there such thing as an ice delay?
Are snow mobiles considered pit pikes?
Are dogs allowed if they are attached to a sled?
Does Dunlop make a triple compound, wet/dry/ ice?
Are we allowed to attach outriggers to our fairings?
Do we put salt down on the track?
:biggrin: :biggrin:
We've trick-or-treated in 80 degrees before here in Kansas City (just east of HPT). Wouldn't stock up on that Cold Gear just yet. You could be pleasantly surprised :thumb:
I wouldn't assume it's going to be at HPT just yet. I'm sure this poll is one of many considerations in the final decision....and it was fairly close. We shall see.
I'd personally like to race HPT if wasn't so much $$ in fuel and cold. I thought the track was better than the reviews from the AMA guys.
Quote from: KenW on May 27, 2010, 08:14:00 PMWhat is it going to be like in Kansas? Is there such thing as an ice delay? Do we put salt down on the track?
Back in the 90's our season starting events for the Midwest were in late March at Heartland Park, I can remember going out for 1st practice sessions at a couple of those events when it was in the 30's - but it generally got up to a balmy 50* or even 60* by afternoon.
As far as ice delays goes - YES! Heartland Park use to have the road course for the bikes blend out onto the Drag Strip a short distance out from their starting line, the combination of moisture, VHT, and tire compounds on the drag strip was like ice when cold and I do remember delays in the morning because of it. Back then you could actually be spinning your tire 1/2 way down the front straight because of how slick it was, but that's no longer an issue since they modified the road course just for bikes.
The 1st event at Blackhawk Farms in early April of 1997 had a snow storm hit which caused a hell of a delay. On Saturday it was in the high 20's / low 30's and snowing, they had plowed the track but couldn't get it clear enough to race on so they told us over the PA to bring our bikes to tech so everyone would be ready to go the next day. I remember riding my bike over to tech with about an inch of snow covering the windshield and a smiley face drawn in it. I pulled into tech and Larry looked at it and said "You guys are nuts!" The next morning it was in the mid 30's but the track still had snow and ice on it so they let us take our cars and trucks out on the track and do laps to get the moisture off the track, the temps quickly got up to around 40* and the track got to be raceable after a couple hours. I think we got 1 practice session and then ran both days worth of races by doing 4 lap races all day. I remember that event well because in my last race I was forced off the track at the kink just before the carousel as I was making a pass around the outside for 1st place, I ended up going off the track on the inside of the carousel. Normally that wouldn't have been a huge deal but at this event there was 4" of snow covering everything, I went a ways thru the snow at speed before hitting a dip and loosing the front end. Not too many people can say they've crashed in 4" of snow while road racing a sportbike! :biggrin:
Ahhhhh the memories! :thumb:
Quote from: skiandclimb on May 27, 2010, 03:13:01 PM
Pretty sure thats what the rest of the free world has said about Daytona for the past two decades! lol
For what its worth, Melka- I'll buy you a beer @ HPT, bro!
that sounds good!
Quote from: Burt Munro on May 27, 2010, 06:32:46 PM
Must be some Chicago politicians that moved to Florida........ vote early and vote often!
LOL.. you must be from Cook County?? !! :biggrin:
HPT
You're too late Hector! :biggrin:
Homestead!
I will take Hurricanes you see coming a week ahead of time than tornadoes any day. Oh yea. and it's 30 minutes from my house but that is not even a factor.. I swear.
Yay Topeka!
funny thing is it was wamer up here last year than it was down in daytona during that period
Homestead Miami
Quote from: gonecrazy on May 31, 2010, 09:30:20 PM
funny thing is it was wamer up here last year than it was down in daytona during that period
You're not going to let facts influence this decision are you?
Mid-O!
VIR
so if it's HTP what layout would be used? was looking on there web site and they show four. the film of gateway looked interesting also. wish i could see some of HTP. any links on Utube?
Should be the full coarse as usuall.
Quote from: Ducmarc on June 16, 2010, 11:02:13 PM
so if it's HTP what layout would be used? was looking on there web site and they show four. the film of gateway looked interesting also. wish i could see some of HTP. any links on Utube?
A definite NO on Gateway unless you really like walls.
Topeka full course is a fun and technical track. Same as the AMA used last year - should be easy to find footage!
George
If its at Heartland I'm in.
Homestead I'm out.
All these years of racing at Daytona.... I think we can have maybe just one race in central US. The weather looks like it will be pretty good. 60's is perfect weather. Hell even high 50's is pretty good racing weather. Just think of all the extra HP we'll have!
It would be about time we race at a real road coarse for once for the ROC.
Quote from: J Farrell / Speed Tech Motorsp on June 17, 2010, 09:49:47 PM
It would be about time we race at a real road coarse for once for the ROC.
Amen...
Quote from: Ducmarc on June 16, 2010, 11:02:13 PM
so if it's HTP what layout would be used? was looking on there web site and they show four. the film of gateway looked interesting also. wish i could see some of HTP. any links on Utube?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_qUuRJdCRTM
we like walls down here homestead and pbir have a wall all the way around them
Barber?
if our penance is driving road america in the middle of the season like july or august. its to hot to race down here now anyway
Breaking news! it's gonna be at Homestead. Many of us are here at VIR this weekend and Phil let it be know the venue WILL be Homestead..
Quote from: MELK-MAN on June 19, 2010, 10:12:05 PM
Breaking news! it's gonna be at Homestead. Many of us are here at VIR this weekend and Phil let it be know the venue WILL be Homestead..
Go figure....thanks for the "poll", CCS. Great job pissing on everyone's wheaties.
I won't be attending. I bet dime to dollar alot of other riders won't either. Again, good job with the "poll". Sheesh, the FIRST effin year it could possibly be somewhere OTHER than the extreme corner of the US, and guess what.....they made it even farther.
PAR FOR THE COURSE :wtf:
gotta agree w/ mr. skiandclimb...
:(
It would be interesting to find out why it turned out to be Homestead - Guess CCS may have projected attendance differently than the poll, concerns about snow @ Topeka (yeah right) or simply cost. I suspect that Homestead is cheaper than Topeka.
If CCS organized trailers from the midwest city (chicago-milwaukee-madison and kc/st. louis) with cheap group airfares down.....
well, at least now I know I can plan a new vacation now.
As much as I like to give Kuhn shit when he complains about something....gotta agree with him on this one.
I ain't driving to the end of the earth. Maybe next year...
Maybe there should be an East and a West Championship where everyone can at least attend one of them. A national champ could be derived from a totaling of pints between the East and West. Someone that really wants the National could race both to guarantee good placement.
I would think that from a business angle it would be prudent to hold a race such as this based on projections of profit. Who would want to lose money on such an endeavor. Typically in the Florida grids at Homestead participation is pretty high. I am not sure how it compares to other places such as VIR. It seems more relavent to make that final race at VIR the ROC.
Mark
Well, it's officially official- http://www.roadracingworld.com/news/article/?next=yes&article=40883 (http://www.roadracingworld.com/news/article/?next=yes&article=40883)
Funny- the article is dated for June 21st- tomorrow.
Kevin Elliot said in the article, "We wanted to have a similar venue to the Daytona experience." Really? Last i checked, Homestead was not Daytona, didn't have Daytona's layout, its history, etc. etc. Actually, from what I've heard/seen, Homestead isn't that great of a track at all. So, Mr. Elliot, how is this a similar venue? Or is the end result based on the desire for you to kick it in the sun at the end of the year? Bikinis and Pina coladas and such? Kinda feels like it. Funny, in the article, there was NO mention of HPT even being an alternative choice. Was it really ever even a possibility?
A future suggestion- don't put up a poll, asking people their opinion, then flush said opinion down the shitter. I wonder how much our opinions TRULY matter to CCS.......2/3's majority would take the prize in any other matter. Guess not here, eh?
Jaded? Yup- a touch. But I know I'm not alone.
Well, the best thing I can say to anyone going is, good luck, ride safe and have fun. Enjoy your Championship.
Might as well just call it the Florida Region championship. -Snack
Quote from: SV88 on June 20, 2010, 08:46:43 AM
It would be interesting to find out why it turned out to be Homestead - Guess CCS may have projected attendance differently than the poll, concerns about snow @ Topeka (yeah right) or simply cost. I suspect that Homestead is cheaper than Topeka.
Well, DIS has been an integral part of CCS since its beginning in 1984. I believe that DIS owns Homestead.
Quote from: Speedballer347 on June 20, 2010, 02:34:23 PM
I ain't driving to the end of the earth. Maybe next year...
Dude you wont even drive to Topeka! LOL
thats some pretty pathetic shit right there. :jerkoff:
i havent raced all season yet and was thinking about just doing the ROC and no other races
and either way its along ride and i am kinda sick of Daytona. so we will see what happens
You've got to be phucking kidding me!!! It's a little late for an April fools joke. And if this isn't a joke its just plain mean. Looks like I'll be finishing out my CCS season with CMRA.
Ahh yes ....."We wanna know what you guys think." (wink, wink) ..... The riders have spoken! ..... "tuff sh*t" they say...... big suprise.
Who pays the bills here? :wtf:
I was excited about the possibility of racing in my first ROC....not excited anymore because there is no way I'm making that trip.
I really am sorry to see the way this turned out...maybe someone will give us an explanation on why the majority winner was not chosen.
too bad, for me in NJ theres maybe 20mi difference in the drive. was looking foreward to heartland park but lost alot interest in riding another flat infield oval track
Homested infield is not flat.I have been racing with CCS since 85 and racing since the 70s and have raced at most tracks in the US .Homested is a fun technical track with elavation changes in the infield,a great facility and is a great choice for a Championship Race.
See everyone in Miami in October! I'll bring my bathing suit and some pina colada mix! :)
Quote from: Tornado Bait on June 20, 2010, 10:28:27 PM
You've got to be phucking kidding me!!! It's a little late for an April fools joke. And if this isn't a joke its just plain mean. Looks like I'll be finishing out my CCS season with CMRA.
I'm with you. Save me some pit space.
Quote from: Firecat on June 21, 2010, 01:24:55 AM
I was excited about the possibility of racing in my first ROC....not excited anymore because there is no way I'm making that trip.
I really am sorry to see the way this turned out...maybe someone will give us an explanation on why the majority winner was not chosen.
CCS typically has over 3000 licensed riders. Only 161 people bothered to vote .. not really the majority of anything.
Quote from: TrophyGal on June 21, 2010, 11:41:26 AM
CCS typically has over 3000 licensed riders. Only 161 people bothered to vote .. not really the majority of anything.
Try again, if everyone that voted followed the instructions for the poll......
'Please vote based on your likelyhood to attend the event. If you know you are not going to attend regardless of location, please do taint the results by voting.'
How many racers actaully attend ROC?
Quote from: tstruyk on June 20, 2010, 07:01:46 PM
Dude you wont even drive to Topeka! LOL
True story, LOL :lmao:
Just to be fair, here's quotes from the original post that started this topic....
Quote from: CCS on May 17, 2010, 04:36:16 PM
This poll is for our information only, it is not a guarantee that the event will be held at the track that scores best in the poll............This poll is not the final say on the location of the event, but it will give us a better feel for which facility to proceed in negotiations with............Please vote based on your likelyhood to attend the event. If you know you are not going to attend regardless of location, please do taint the results by voting.
I personally won't be racing the ROC this season so I didn't vote due to the last statement quoted above, yet I am one of the 3000 licensed racers with CCS - the 161 votes in the poll is probably one hell of alot closer to the actual number of racers that may attend. Though the final results definitely showed a majority winner, they also weren't a landslide victory for HP (for example 80 or 90%). Don't get me wrong either, I also would have voted for Heartland Park if I was planning on racing the ROC this season.
I would be willing to bet that the poll results were probably also good leverage in negotiating an even better facility rental price with Daytona Motorsports Group about using Homestead for the ROC - Just my opinion! :thumb:
The ROC usually has 750 to 1500 entries.Most CCS racers dont read this forum and did not know about the poll.
I think we would have had bigger grids had it been at HPT. Not only would we have had us CCS guys there, but since the ROC has always been an open format I think we would have drawn from CMRA, CRA, MRA and possibly a few WERA folks. Next time, don't have a poll if it's going mean nothing. -John Deuser
Quote from: racer880 on June 21, 2010, 03:35:27 PM
The ROC usually has 750 to 1500 entries.
Used to have more. I think just about 2000 in 2000. And insurance has gone up dramatically, thus, reducing the ability to rent the track for as many days as ROC ,and even the spring Daytona races, have been reduced.
Agreed that not everyone is on the forum, but it is still away to gauge possible interest in other opportunities.
The decision is made. Doesn't matter why so load up a trailer with some buddies, split the gas, camp at the track, eat out of a cooler and road trip to Miami to race motorcycles.
If not stay home and pick weeds or mow your lawn.
as a slow learner i made sure to attend the ROC last year to ensure that i had some laps at Daytona in preparation for a full season's attempt at a top 3 finish this year at the ROC in my chosen class. the likelihood of me making an earlier run at Homestead this year at this late date is nil so i will be attending and will do the best that i can. i was actually hoping for a non CCS track to be selected that was more central to all the racers with Road Atlanta being my preference but it is what it is and we all will have to do the best that we can. how many laps do you have at Homestead Greg? would you be willing to lead me around for 1/2 a session?
tim
Quote from: Firecat on June 21, 2010, 01:24:55 AM
I was excited about the possibility of racing in my first ROC....not excited anymore because there is no way I'm making that trip.
I really am sorry to see the way this turned out...maybe someone will give us an explanation on why the majority winner was not chosen.
Try this one! If Topeka was owned by ISC (Daytona) and Homestead was not, the ROC would have been in Topeka!
HD
Quote from: Orange Kr8,RC51 minus 43 on June 21, 2010, 04:11:38 PM
The decision is made. Doesn't matter why so load up a trailer with some buddies, split the gas, camp at the track, eat out of a cooler and road trip to Miami to race motorcycles.
If not stay home and pick weeds or mow your lawn.
Or race with CMRA at Texas World 2 weeks later
Quote from: Andi on June 21, 2010, 06:25:18 PM
Or race with CMRA at Texas World 2 weeks later
Except there's no National Championship trophies at Texas World!
HD
Topeka KS for the Pleazr please!
Quote from: Super Dave on June 20, 2010, 06:49:25 PM
Well, DIS has been an integral part of CCS since its beginning in 1984. I believe that DIS owns Homestead.
Yup.. this has something to do with it..
Quote from: LilJayRR on June 21, 2010, 12:32:38 PM
Try again, if everyone that voted followed the instructions for the poll......
'Please vote based on your likelyhood to attend the event. If you know you are not going to attend regardless of location, please do taint the results by voting.'
How many racers actaully attend ROC?
Many racers that DO attenct ROC do NOT even know there is a CCS website forum. So it's a bit unfair to say what you did..
Quote from: hdpromos on June 21, 2010, 06:17:27 PM
Try this one! If Topeka was owned by ISC (Daytona) and Homestead was not, the ROC would have been in Topeka!
HD
Agreed!
Apparently, they had talked at one time.
Quote from: hdpromos on June 21, 2010, 07:23:20 PM
Except there's no National Championship trophies at Texas World!
HD
It is a hell of a lot harder to win a race against the CMRA fast guys, so I never bothered with ROC. If trophies mean something to you, go to Florida. If you want to see how you really stack up against the best club racers in the country, go to Texas World or any other CMRA event for that matter. For anybody that is going to hate-kiss my ass! The fast CCS/ASRA guys have been to Texas and lost!
Quote from: Jack_Brock on June 21, 2010, 09:37:51 PM
It is a hell of a lot harder to win a race against the CMRA fast guys, so I never bothered with ROC. If trophies mean something to you, go to Florida. If you want to see how you really stack up against the best club racers in the country, go to Texas World or any other CMRA event for that matter. For anybody that is going to hate-kiss my ass! The fast CCS/ASRA guys have been to Texas and lost!
You obviously don't know what you speak of, as you have never even been to a ROC. I guess you heard it from a good source, huh? I've never heard any of my friends at CMRA talk like that, so you must be a "poser"!
HD
I was actually looking forward to a possibility of racing the CCS / ROC for once since 1995 if it was at Heartland.
Looks like I won't be attending.
Honestly that sucks with it being at Homestead.
Heartland would have been great......
Quote from: hdpromos on June 21, 2010, 10:02:23 PM
You obviously don't know what you speak of, as you have never even been to a ROC. I guess you heard it from a good source, huh? I've never heard any of my friends at CMRA talk like that, so you must be a "poser"!
HD
I have no dog in this fight.....but Jack is definitely not a poser.
Quote from: racer880 on June 21, 2010, 03:35:27 PMThe ROC usually has 750 to 1500 entries.
ENTRIES is the key word in that statement!
How many racers does that actually mean?
It's certainly not 1500 racers!
Since I started racing in 1996 I've never been to a riders meeting that had 500 racers attending it - even the 2000+ entry Road America event. Some racers will only run 1 or 2 classes at the ROC, a lot will run 3 to 6 classes, and others will run 7 to 10+ classes - but if you average out the total entries by the number of racers it would probably turn out each racer ran something like 5 classes (5 entries). So if you take that suggested 1500 entries and divided it by 5 entries per racer average, that's 300 racers - respectively with 750 entries that would probably average out to about 150 Racers.
So as I mentioned before:Quote from: GSXR RACER MIKE on June 21, 2010, 02:53:44 PM....the 161 votes in the poll is probably one hell of alot closer to the actual number of racers that may attend.
Quote from: hdpromos on June 21, 2010, 10:02:23 PM
You obviously don't know what you speak of, as you have never even been to a ROC. I guess you heard it from a good source, huh? I've never heard any of my friends at CMRA talk like that, so you must be a "poser"!
HD
Poser? Interesting. Good source? Yeah, its called results and I've found them every year in RRW. I've raced a lot of the guys in the results as well as the people with CMRA. I am not currently a CMRA member, so my previous post is only my opinion and just that. I've won quite a few novice and expert races with CCS and 1 novice race with CMRA. Guess which one I am most proud of? Why? Because there was a large grid with good competition which is something CCS typically doesn't have, even at the ROC in a number of classes. I know of races where 2 or 3 guys started the race and one is a national champion, really? I'll admit I'm not a CCS fan which is due to my experiences over the years, but I don't feel that is affecting my judgement on which clubs have the best competition, The recent crop of sucessful Pro riders appears to have mostly come from WERA, CMRA, and a few other orgs, but not CCS, am I missing something? Lastly, Henry, aren't you the CCS Florida boss, any bias there?
Quote from: hdpromos on June 21, 2010, 07:23:20 PM
Except there's no National Championship trophies at Texas World!
HD
The poser is going to be the guy who brags about getting a national championship at homestead. SE championship, sure but it ain't going to be "national" this year. To Jack's point, I'd be more than happy to wager $100.00 to the RRW action fund that the winners from Homestead couldn't podium at Texas World. -Snack
You guys are nuts thinkin the winners from Homestead couldn't podium at Texas. Who is fast at Texas? I think Ty Howard and those guys right? They are fast as hell....but so is Jeff Wood, Eric Wood, Michael Barnes, and Pietri.....all regulars at Homestead. There will be plenty of fast guys from other regions coming to Homestead as well.
I'm not discounting guys in Texas.....cause I don't sit around talking shit about people I haven't seen race....maybe you should try it....just sayin.
Quote from: Jack_Brock on June 21, 2010, 11:40:38 PM
I am not currently a CMRA member, so my previous post is only my opinion and just that. I'll admit I'm not a CCS fan which is due to my experiences over the years, but I don't feel that is affecting my judgement on which clubs have the best competition,
So do you have a CCS license and do you still compete with CCS even though you are not a fan? If the answer is no then why are you in this conversation? If you are a CCS racer then you have the right to your opinion but it doesn't mean you are correct-valid argument but not necessarily correct.
I don't bash other organizations regions or racers because this is club racing and there are fast guys and girls everywhere. What I do know is there have been some very fast dudes that have raced all the organizations, I would guess to test all comers within a race. I hope to one day venture out of my neighborhood and race with other folks just to see how I stack up, but it is still good competition for me.
Texas World is a nice track,did a few AMA Nationals back in the 80s and early 90s.There are good riders all over the country,however the ROC is in Homsted which is a great facility for a Championship race.Florida is a great region because it draws a national and International field .Fast riders from North and South America show up. Alot of riders look forward to comming to florida in the winter.Homested is actually a better track for this race than Daytona because it is a riders track rather than a horsepower track and is much easier on equipment.It is going to be a great event see you there.
I think I had a few too many beers last night :biggrin:
I really like the guys I've met racing with CCS(the MW and GP guys in particular) and there is definitely some talent. I've just experienced way too much stupid from the organization over the years and it has left a bad taste. I'm not alone and I think this is a reason why some people travel further to race with other orgs or don't race. The fall out is the grids aren't as full as they probably should be. This poll is just another case in point. The point has been made, but I'll hit it again. Daytona is obviously the tradition, but since it has too be somewhere else, why not go with a more centralized track so the rest of the country will show up?
Quote from: Jack_Brock on June 21, 2010, 11:40:38 PM
I'll admit I'm not a CCS fan which is due to my experiences over the years, but I don't feel that is affecting my judgement on which clubs have the best competition, The recent crop of sucessful Pro riders appears to have mostly come from WERA, CMRA, and a few other orgs, but not CCS, am I missing something? Lastly, Henry, aren't you the CCS Florida boss, any bias there?
I think your judgement is very suspect when it comes to your criticizm of CCS. And lastly, I am very biased when it comes to CCS, as I strongly support the organization and the way it is run. That is why I have been affiliated with them since 1987 and I'm proud of it!
HD
Quote from: SnacktimeKC on June 22, 2010, 12:14:47 AM
The poser is going to be the guy who brags about getting a national championship at homestead. SE championship, sure but it ain't going to be "national" this year. To Jack's point, I'd be more than happy to wager $100.00 to the RRW action fund that the winners from Homestead couldn't podium at Texas World. -Snack
I've taken $100. bills from "suckers" like you before! So I'll be more than happy to take a $100. from you too! :cheers:
HD
Homestead is a world class facility, it will be a great ROC.
I'm sure Topeka is great, but If you think the ROC would be bigger at Topeka, call Kevin Elliot and try to get him to schedule next year's race there.
We all know most of the members on the forum are from outside the SE region, nobody even knew there was a poll until someone mentioned it on the Jennings Forum, which is where most of the SE riders post, a week before the poll closed.
Again, I think if you WERE planning to attend ROC at Daytona and make the XXX mile drive to South Florida, I don't think an extra 2 hours is going to cause you not to go to the ROC at all- you'll save the extra gas money in cheaper hotels alone! Plus, no shennanigans from the HOG riders!
Yeah Yeah, we know, your region is the fastest and that's where all the REAL riders are. All I've got to say is this:
Barrett Long finished top 10 in back-to-back AMA Superbike races this year at Road Atlanta.....who was in the top 10 from your club?
I'm sure Homestead will be a fine event but you can't blame us for being a little jaded. We played by the rules, voted, won the vote (decisively), and got shafted.
There are a lot of people in the MW and GP regions that share Jacks sentiment. It's gotten a lot better since Kevin took over from clear channel but it's decisions like this that leave us scratching our heads feeling jaded again. When we do make the trip to CMRA events the staff and Texas regulars are always thankful for us making the trip etc.
Quote from: Gino230 on June 22, 2010, 04:14:59 PM
Barrett Long finished top 10 in back-to-back AMA Superbike races this year at Road Atlanta.....who was in the top 10 from your club?
You really don't want to make this argument with CMRA folks. Because names like Schwantz, Edwards, Spies, Eslick, Wesby, McDonald, etc tend to come up.
Yet another reason to be disappointed the ROC is not in Topeka, we would have had a chance to see what club did what. -Snack
Quote from: SnacktimeKC on June 22, 2010, 05:11:39 PM
I'm sure Homestead will be a fine event but you can't blame us for being a little jaded. We played by the rules, voted, won the vote (decisively), and got shafted.
There are a lot of people in the MW and GP regions that share Jacks sentiment. It's gotten a lot better since Kevin took over from clear channel but it's decisions like this that leave us scratching our heads feeling jaded again. When we do make the trip to CMRA events the staff and Texas regulars are always thankful for us making the trip etc.
You really don't want to make this argument with CMRA folks. Because names like Schwantz, Edwards, Spies, Eslick, Wesby, McDonald, etc tend to come up.
Yet another reason to be disappointed the ROC is not in Topeka, we would have had a chance to see what club did what. -Snack
So Snacktime you "played by the rules", I guess you just want to ignore what Kevin said when he put the poll up? You say things are better since Kevin took over and then you ridicule him for a business decision that no matter which way he went, it was going to make some people mad. You share Jack's sentiment, even though he has never been to a ROC! :ass: And you tell us how thankful the CMRA staff is to their riders! Well that's just great, as I know many of the CMRA staff and they are good people. But so are the CCS staff and their appreciation for the riders that compete in their series. You come on here and make it appear that CCS racers are not appreciated by the staff that works their events! :wtf:
You talk about the stars that have come out of CMRA. And that cannot be denied. But the same can be said for the many that have come through the CCS ranks. However, Gino was talking about current CMRA and CCS riders. And that is a different story.
I think we can all understand that you are upset that the ROC is not going to be in your area. If it had gone the other way, the riders from regions closer to Homestead would not be happy with that decision either. So why don't you and your CMRA buddies come down to Homestead for the ROC and back up all the talk. If you don't want to do that than why don't you stop bashing CCS and crying "sour grapes"? :whine:
HD
.. What he said..
but some may have overlooked the fact the results of the poll would for sure determine the venue. That was stated right away. Also, in talking with some CCS staff and those that are familiar with KS weather, it could be nice or it could just as likely be friggin COLD. If it even so much as looked like it would be miserable weather many more riders would likely not show. Between keeping DIS folks happy running the event and one of the DIS group tracks, as well as the only other choice KS, it was just the more prudent decision (at least that is my opinion). The poll could very well influence FUTURE ROC events as some have pointed out.
No way that either decision would have made everyone happy.
on another note: is there any camping at the Homestead track? similar to Daytona? i read the Homestead Track info that no paddock camping and that they have RV slots but i don't want to pay for that and sleep in a tent.
thx,
tim
Quote from: hdpromos on June 22, 2010, 06:18:09 PM
So Snacktime you "played by the rules", I guess you just want to ignore what Kevin said when he put the poll up? You say things are better since Kevin took over and then you ridicule him for a business decision that no matter which way he went, it was going to make some people mad. You share Jack's sentiment, even though he has never been to a ROC! :ass: And you tell us how thankful the CMRA staff is to their riders! Well that's just great, as I know many of the CMRA staff and they are good people. But so are the CCS staff and their appreciation for the riders that compete in their series. You come on here and make it appear that CCS racers are not appreciated by the staff that works their events! :wtf:
You talk about the stars that have come out of CMRA. And that cannot be denied. But the same can be said for the many that have come through the CCS ranks. However, Gino was talking about current CMRA and CCS riders. And that is a different story.
I think we can all understand that you are upset that the ROC is not going to be in your area. If it had gone the other way, the riders from regions closer to Homestead would not be happy with that decision either. So why don't you and your CMRA buddies come down to Homestead for the ROC and back up all the talk. If you don't want to do that than why don't you stop bashing CCS and crying "sour grapes"? :whine:
HD
Better yet, why dont you and the sunshine boys quit sticking a stick in it, STHU and have your Havana Invitational Regional Championship. The rest of the country (i.e. paying CCS customers) you continue to piss off by unneccesarily stirring the pot, (CCS HQ has got to appreciate that) could really give a shiot. We'll turn the page and vote with our dollars.
Tim, I've seen many camp outside the gates but I am not sure how to go about that. I would suggest calling Henry DeGouw and maybe he can help with that info.
Quote from: sasrocks on June 22, 2010, 07:06:39 PM
Better yet, why dont you and the sunshine boys quit sticking a stick in it, STHU and have your Havana Invitational Regional Championship.
So why does it have to get racist now? I'm not Hispanic and I wasn't born here, but instead I chose to become a US citizen. I am damn proud to have made that decision.
Mark
Well now Mr. Sasrocks, looks to me like you not only need to go back to school to brush up on your english but I think you could use an advanced class in manners! You seem to be lacking miserably in both! :spank:
HD
HP,
Yes we did play by the rules and won the vote. What might have helped in many of the GP and MW riders eyes, would have been a little bit more info? If there would have been a statement that CCS got the track for free, wanted to stay in good with the NASCAR folks, were too concerned about the weather etc. that might have helped. But, on the surface it seemed CCS asked us riders for input, then made a decision that was contrary to said input.
In regards to my statement that CMRA officials thanking us for making long trips and racing with them I can only tell you this. In the maybe 6-8 events that I raced with them they made a point to thank me 3 times. In the five years I've raced with CCS it's never happened. To include many trips to RA, Barber, and Daytona. Again, many of the MW and GP racers I know share my opinion. That said, I have confidence that it will get better and Kevin is addressing the problem.
CMRA has the world championships, AMA championships, let alone many of the AMA horizon awards. They don't need to prove anything to anybody. So, as I said I'll be a Texas World with my $100.00 for RRW air fence fund on the line, and between you and me I'll bet you a cold beer. -Snack
so are the garages going to be free like a regular weekend or are we going to have to pay? one of the reasons to go to homestead might be spectator attendance. there is probably 5 millon people within 50 miles of the track and that might be low. on regular weekend casual attendance seems to always be higher there than in the other fla tracks including daytona. i was actually thinking about going to HTP.since homestead is about 7 hrs from the house. but homestead does have some advantages if its promoted right , spectators, hotels, garages,cuban food one of the best hospitals in the country, and the fla keys 20 min's away. bring your fishing rod. now i'm not saying topeaka dosen't have these things but i'm sure they took some of them in consideration. i personally wanted atlanta or VIR
Quote from: SnacktimeKC on June 22, 2010, 08:52:29 PM
HP,
Yes we did play by the rules and won the vote. What might have helped in many of the GP and MW riders eyes, would have been a little bit more info? If there would have been a statement that CCS got the track for free, wanted to stay in good with the NASCAR folks, were too concerned about the weather etc. that might have helped. But, on the surface it seemed CCS asked us riders for input, then made a decision that was contrary to said input.
In regards to my statement that CMRA officials thanking us for making long trips and racing with them I can only tell you this. In the maybe 6-8 events that I raced with them they made a point to thank me 3 times. In the five years I've raced with CCS it's never happened. To include many trips to RA, Barber, and Daytona. Again, many of the MW and GP racers I know share my opinion. That said, I have confidence that it will get better and Kevin is addressing the problem.
CMRA has the world championships, AMA championships, let alone many of the AMA horizon awards. They don't need to prove anything to anybody. So, as I said I'll be a Texas World with my $100.00 for RRW air fence fund on the line, and between you and me I'll bet you a cold beer. -Snack
You still don't get it! :banghead: Right from the start, Kevin said the poll would not necessarily be the final word in the selection! And all that silly stuff about info on "free track rental" and "staying in good with the NASCAR folks"! What are you on "crack" or something? :err: You'd never hear about that kinda stuff even if it was true. As far as the love you get from CMRA officials for attending their races. If you come to the ROC at Homestead, I'll make sure your treated to some South Florida CCS hospitality! With regards to your World and AMA Champions, who said they had to prove anything? But why don't you see how many of them will compete in club racing now? Because that's what we're talking about "now", CCS and CMRA riders! I'll be at Homestead with my $100. bill and looking forward to taking yours. If you show up, I might even buy you a beer!
HD
Quote from: hdpromos on June 22, 2010, 09:37:11 PM
You still don't get it! :banghead: Right from the start, Kevin said the poll would not necessarily be the final word in the selection! And all that silly stuff about info on "free track rental" and "staying in good with the NASCAR folks"! What are you on "crack" or something? :err: You'd never hear about that kinda stuff even if it was true. As far as the love you get from CMRA officials for attending their races. If you come to the ROC at Homestead, I'll make sure your treated to some South Florida CCS hospitality! With regards to your World and AMA Champions, who said they had to prove anything? But why don't you see how many of them will compete in club racing now? Because that's what we're talking about "now", CCS and CMRA riders! I'll be at Homestead with my $100. bill and looking forward to taking yours. If you show up, I might even buy you a beer!
HD
Oh I get it, and I didn't mean for that to be silly stuff I was just throwing it out there as examples. (it's Tuesday I only do crack on the weekends) I just think a little more info as to why the decision was made would have made it a little easier for for us to accept. Did the vote mean anything at all?
Sorry, not going to make Homestead. But I'll take a rain check and probably see you in the spring at a newly repaved Daytona. -Snack
What all you SE guys seem to be missing is that this is a ONE time thing. The ROC will be back at Daytona next year and the year after that and the year after that.....
What would have been nice is to have had the ONE off year some where else. I understand that the poll was not binding, I also understand that CCS missed an opportunity to do the members not on the east coast a favor just this ONE time.
I'm with Hawk, Snack and sasrocks on this one.
FWIW, I've always heard good things about CCS Florida and Henry. Also, if you win a ROC race against Robert or Jeff-You deserve a National Championship trophy. As far as CCS in other parts, I've had issues.
The first big issue was I think 2005(not sure if that was Kevin or Clear channel), I attended a race and in the riders meeting, Larry Denning(the Jensen of years past) brought up that the temporary location of the finish line(on a corner with a rise) was not safe and asked for it to be moved back some distance to the straight. The race director laughed it off and told us to go home if we didn't feel safe racing motorcycles. In my first race of the day, I had a guy hit me at about 130mph trying to beat me to the line for 4th place I think. He didn't get ahead of me, but it sent me off track and I still thank God everytime I think of it that I didn't get seriously injured or killed. I approached the race director and got more of the same that we got in the riders meeting, so I loaded up and went home.
The other issues I think both happened in 2007. The first of these was an ASRA race at Topeka. There was a car in the racing line after I crested Alpha at full stick and I damn near hit it as it was only going 30mph or so. There were no flags and there were no lights on the car which was an Infiniti. I was later told by Kevins second in command that the Infiniti was a doctor attending the race as a spectator who decided that a downed rider was not being attended to quick enough so he jumped in his car and drove on course. Red flag, right? Wrong! The race continued and for most of the laps the Infiniti, an Ambulance, and a Crash truck were parked on the track surface on the exit of the corner that leads onto the back straight with a staitionary yellow. After these two experiences, I really started to feel this kind of stuff was par for the course with CCS, and if that wasn't enough, then there was the Travis Marshall fiasco. For those that don't know, Travis was a racer that held an Expert license with CMRA when he applied and was granted a Novice license with CCS. He went on to win one of the coveted National Championship trophies as a novice and a lot of people were upset when nothing was done about the situation. The fact that Travis started CCS South at about the same time went over like a turd in a punch bowl. For those that haven't heard of CCS south, it was gone about as quick as it started.
Anyway, pardon me for being jaded. When I saw they were considering HPT for ROC, I really thought it was great that the rest of the Country might get a break for a change. If you guys don't get that, you just aren't listening. As far as CMRA-I don't consider it my club as less than 20% of the races I've done have been with them. Have they had talented guys? Yes, and they always do. Who recently? Eslick, Westby, West, Dominguez and some guy named Spies. It hasn't been that many years ago Eslick and Haner showed up at Hallett when they were pros, and I don't think either one got a top 5! Henry, I'm guessing you have a financial interest in CCS Florida, so I don't expect you to concede anything here so I am out on this discussion. Good luck to you and ROC at Homestead.
Jack I believe that if you called Kevin, the two of you could mend the fences. He is a "straight shooter", knows this business and is very honest.
As for me, I own CCS/Florida and sanction with CCS. I have no financial interest in the ROC no matter where it is. I preferred Homestead to Topeka or anywhere else, as it is closest for the Florida Region riders. I go to the ROC as a fan not a promoter and I'm there to count the Florida wins, anything else doesn't count!
HD
Quote from: hdpromos on June 23, 2010, 10:55:46 AM
As for me, I own CCS/Florida and sanction with CCS. I have no financial interest in the ROC no matter where it is. I preferred Homestead to Topeka or anywhere else, as it is closest for the Florida Region riders. I go to the ROC as a fan not a promoter and I'm there to count the Florida wins, anything else doesn't count!
Henry - I call BULL $HIT on this one. Even if you don't get a portion of the Gate at ROC, you have a distinct financial interest in the ROC being held n Florida. 1) Holding the ROC in Florida motivates the local riders to continue to show up at local races in order to secure as favorable of a grid position for the ROC (which it just so happens is at a local racetrack so you get more % participation than any other CCS affiliate.) 2) You also stand gain windfall profits for any non-local riders who may decide to make the trip to Homestead ahead of the ROC in order to get track time in order to have a fair chance to compete on that track which is well know to locals.
Lets just be honest and adults about it. I'd appreciate it if you would do me a favor back down on your lectures to the non-southeast racers when you clearly have a very distinct agenda here which may or may not align with the interests of the majority of stakeholders in the discussion.
End of the day, we all just have to realize that it was Kevin's decision to make based upon a variety of factors; however, it was clearly and solely his decision to make. Do I believe that there is some truth here that Kevin used the threat of going to HPT as an alternate venue in order to get a favorable agreement on Homestead? Yes. While that may or may not have really been a factor in his decision to start the pole - if it was part of the reason, I think it was a wise business move and I applaud the negotiation tactic.
As a racer I respect the risks that Kevin has taken on in buying and running this business and I am not about to second guess his decision as owner. I had a vote in the poll, but as stated, it was informal and non binding so I really didn't have a vote in the decision. While I don't like or agree with everything done in and around CCS (particularly this decision) I personally do have an economic vote though how I spend my money and I can assure you that my $$$ won't be going to Homestead.
Big picture, if I were to decide (like Jack - who is a very fast racer by the way) that I don't like CCS or how it is run as a racing organization, I can just make other choices. I could decide to race WERA, I could decide to race CMRA or some other series or I could just decide to retire. This is the reality, across all of the 1500 licensed racers, that Kevin needs to think about as the owner of CCS.
George
Quote from: George_Linhart on June 23, 2010, 01:24:56 PM
Henry - I call BULL $HIT on this one. Even if you don't get a portion of the Gate at ROC, you have a distinct financial interest in the ROC being held n Florida. 1) Holding the ROC in Florida motivates the local riders to continue to show up at local races in order to secure as favorable of a grid position for the ROC (which it just so happens is at a local racetrack so you get more % participation than any other CCS affiliate.) 2) You also stand gain windfall profits for any non-local riders who may decide to make the trip to Homestead ahead of the ROC in order to get track time in order to have a fair chance to compete on that track which is well know to locals.
Lets just be honest and adults about it. I'd appreciate it if you would do me a favor back down on your lectures to the non-southeast racers when you clearly have a very distinct agenda here which may or may not align with the interests of the majority of stakeholders in the discussion.
End of the day, we all just have to realize that it was Kevin's decision to make based upon a variety of factors; however, it was clearly and solely his decision to make. Do I believe that there is some truth here that Kevin used the threat of going to HPT as an alternate venue in order to get a favorable agreement on Homestead? Yes. While that may or may not have really been a factor in his decision to start the pole - if it was part of the reason, I think it was a wise business move and I applaud the negotiation tactic.
As a racer I respect the risks that Kevin has taken on in buying and running this business and I am not about to second guess his decision as owner. I had a vote in the poll, but as stated, it was informal and non binding so I really didn't have a vote in the decision. While I don't like or agree with everything done in and around CCS (particularly this decision) I personally do have an economic vote though how I spend my money and I can assure you that my $$$ won't be going to Homestead.
Big picture, if I were to decide (like Jack - who is a very fast racer by the way) that I don't like CCS or how it is run as a racing organization, I can just make other choices. I could decide to race WERA, I could decide to race CMRA or some other series or I could just decide to retire. This is the reality, across all of the 1500 licensed racers, that Kevin needs to think about as the owner of CCS.
George
George, you sir are full of it! :jerkoff: I have no "distinct financial interest" in a ROC at Homestead! All the BS :blahblah: you rolled out to prove that it helps me in any way financially is just that, BS. The 2004 ROC at Homestead did not increase our grids before or after the event and it will not be affected by this one either. As far as "lectures" and the "big picture", you need a good "lecturing" because you obviously don't know what the hell the "big picture" is! :spank:
HD
Quote from: hdpromos on June 23, 2010, 03:14:18 PM
As far as "lectures" and the "big picture", you need a good "lecturing" because you obviously don't know what the hell the "big picture" is! :spank:
HD
Why don't you enlighten us?
Quote from: funsizeracing on June 23, 2010, 04:14:19 PM
Why don't you enlighten us?
I already have! Go back and read it. If you still don't get it, I can't help you! :banghead:
HD
Quote from: hdpromos on June 23, 2010, 04:43:28 PM
I already have! Go back and read it. If you still don't get it, I can't help you! :banghead:
HD
keep going man, you're on a roll!! winning over hearts and minds every time you open your mouth.
Quote from: hdpromos on June 23, 2010, 04:43:28 PM
I already have! Go back and read it. If you still don't get it, I can't help you! :banghead:
HD
All I've seen is you telling everyone they are wrong but not actually provide any rational arguments to back up your statements. Perhaps I missed them when I was sidetracked by your snarky and snide tone you took with others simply because you didn't like what they said.
Quote from: funsizeracing on June 23, 2010, 05:00:02 PM
All I've seen is you telling everyone they are wrong but not actually provide any rational arguments to back up your statements. Perhaps I missed them when I was sidetracked by your snarky and snide tone you took with others simply because you didn't like what they said.
I gave "rational" answers, you just can't handle the truth! I guess you just "missed them" when you got "sidetracked"! :cheers:
HD
Could you please point them out?
One other question. Did you order the code red?
Quote from: funsizeracing on June 23, 2010, 05:45:16 PM
One other question. Did you order the code red?
Hilarious.
Quote from: funsizeracing on June 23, 2010, 05:45:16 PM
Could you please point them out?
One other question. Did you order the code red?
post of the year
One other question. Did you order the code red?
[/quote]
Oh my, I think you got me with that one! :rollseyes: It's been fun conversing with you guys but I gotta get ready for a race this weekend. Good luck with your racing where ever that is. And I am serious about that!
HD
Quote from: sasrocks on June 22, 2010, 07:06:39 PM
Better yet, why dont you and the sunshine boys quit sticking a stick in it, STHU and have your Havana Invitational Regional Championship. The rest of the country (i.e. paying CCS customers) you continue to piss off by unneccesarily stirring the pot, (CCS HQ has got to appreciate that) could really give a shiot. We'll turn the page and vote with our dollars.
wow.. So the ROC comes down to TWO possible venues, one in the sun with a better possibilty of paying racers/spectators (Homestead draws a GOOD gate) or.. Potential for sleet and snow (maybe good weather). Kevin E. has likely been hanging on this season, even not going to Barber (i suspect due to the huge rental fee yet SMALL grid size last couple years). So, if I were a betting man with MY COMPANY on the line, what would i do? GO with the good odds, that include keeping DIS happy.
Had it gone to KS, i suspect anyone West of the MISS river would have been having a laugh on FL riders? How does any of this complaining back and forth HELP RACING! Especially at a time when the plug could be pulled on racing org. at any time when they can't be making much money.. Everyone should just give it a friggin rest..
oh.. And i voted for KS. No bullshit. I like homestead, but would have used it as an excuse to learn a new track.
oh well, looks like it's the national southeast championship as usual. i would love to know what factors were more decisive than a 60/40 vote in favor for HPT.
Quote from: Greeny on June 23, 2010, 09:36:23 PM
oh well, looks like it's the national southeast championship as usual. i would love to know what factors were more decisive than a 60/40 vote in favor for HPT.
.. clearly stated in the post just above yours (by me) and a number of other times.
1) Money - more riders/spectators likely to show
2) weather - likely to be GREAT in FL, potential for shit storm in KS
3) keeping DIS happy
OK Greg,
Well I think the poster you are pointing out the facts to has it right then, if he doesn't like Daytona then he needs to vote with his dollars. You have confirmed this with the statement that, more riders are likely to show. You have in essense told those who would like to see the ROC in Topeka to stay home.
I seem to recall qualifing in a torential downpour last fall, must have been a figment of my imagination. Let's see, Miami annual rainfall 55" Topeka 35", Weather is a roll of the dice anywhere.
As I mentioned earlier this is a ONE time change of venue, just how upset do you really think DIS is going to get if the event goes to another venue that they don't own for this year ONLY? Just would have been a nice jesture to all those racers not in the SE region to have the event at a centrally located track while Daytona was NOT available.
Oh well, have fun at homestead.
Paul,
I can understand your dismay for Topeka not being chosen. If Topeka had been chosen I would not have attended, but I think that you would have attempted to tell me of all the glories of making the trip from Florida to race there. In your eyes it is feasible for me to drive for whatever glory there is in a National Championship. There will always be someone that doesn't agree with the decision. The instructions were pretty clear and by no means is the sole reason for the outcome of the decision. Whatever the reasons it is the business owner's responsibllity to make it work.
I have also thought about the term voting with my money, and then i realized that it was just me that was being affected by not racing and doing something that I love. if there is better racing for you then great.
This year I didn't plan on doing the Daytona ROC but with it at Homestead I have more of a chance because it is more a riders track at least moreso than Daytona. I would love the ROC to be held at different venues each year. VIR, Barber, Miller all have appeal to me. if I knew ahead of time I could make plans to make the trip. I race on a budget and it is very low so distance, time and vacation availability at work makes a difference in planning.
The decision has been made. I hope that you all can look past that and maybe make it for some good old fun. I hope that next year we could have a different track to run the ROC.
Mark
I really don't know what you guys expected............
*Florida
*Voting
*Problems with results
Didn't we go through this once before about 10 years ago????
Quote from: Burt Munro on June 23, 2010, 11:23:08 PM
I really don't know what you guys expected............
*Florida
*Voting
*Problems with results
Didn't we go through this once before about 10 years ago??
"Hello, my name is Rick and I am a professional shit disturber!" :biggrin:
ROC: Race Of Chad? (hanging?) lol
man, im not saying deal with it or stay home. Im just saying why all the bitching? It's in Miami, ya bitch. It's in KS, someone would bitch. That's life. And as far as rainfall, i never even tried to compare rainfall.. BUT since you bring it up, 50F in the rain SUCKS, 80F in the rain is just wet, but you don't risk hypothermia.
Im sure as luck will have it Kansas will be 82F and sunny, and Miami will be 69 and we will get hit with a cat. 4 hurricane, and everyone will have to hear "told ya so" for a month.
Quote from: MELK-MAN on June 24, 2010, 11:15:54 AM
Im sure as luck will have it Kansas will be 82F and sunny, and Miami will be 69 and we will get hit with a cat. 4 hurricane, and everyone will have to hear "told ya so" for a month.
That is a great post! If it works out that way, maybe HPT can have an outlaw race for a little salt on the wound.
:biggrin:..Call it the UUWHNCROC
"Unsanctioned-Unofficial Western Half National Championship ROC".
Quote from: Burt Munro on June 23, 2010, 11:23:08 PM
I really don't know what you guys expected............
*Florida
*Voting
*Problems with results
Didn't we go through this once before about 10 years ago????
Anybody have any voting card chads??? :kicknuts:
Quote from: MELK-MAN on June 24, 2010, 11:15:54 AM
man, im not saying deal with it or stay home. Im just saying why all the bitching? It's in Miami, ya bitch. It's in KS, someone would bitch. That's life. And as far as rainfall, i never even tried to compare rainfall.. BUT since you bring it up, 50F in the rain SUCKS, 80F in the rain is just wet, but you don't risk hypothermia.
Im sure as luck will have it Kansas will be 82F and sunny, and Miami will be 69 and we will get hit with a cat. 4 hurricane, and everyone will have to hear "told ya so" for a month.
Worse yet, an OIL HURRICANE!!!
Greg you make some good points. As a matter of fact we had a hail storm during a team challenge at HPT a couple year ago and it was insane, we race in the cold and rain all the time so that argument isn't going to hold a lot of water (pardon the pun) in this neck of the woods. I'd also argue grid sizes with you too but what's done is done.
Many of us have made the 24 hour + drive to Daytona many many times. As it's been mentioned before it would have been nice for us GP and MW region folks ta have something a little closer just this once.
We were all very excited about the vote, we understood that it wasn't binding but it would have been nice to have a little more official explanation as to why the decision was made from CCS and not just a few dudes on the forums. -Snack
If i was still able to race I would've loved to run Topeka! I wouldn't mind driving 19 hrs to race a different track! Plus steal all the championships and bring them back to Fl! :ass: :biggrin:
Ok, I'll go on record just so you guys can be sure and hold me to it.
WHEN I win the lottery, I am going to "fund" a National at a centrally located track that will be an any club welcome event with qualifying determining starting position. The trophies will suck(maybe an imitation piece of poop on top of a base with the theme being "I'm the Shit!-Nationals"), so if you win hopefully you won't go bragging too much. To offset the trophies, the payouts will be good enough and deep enough to attract riders from all over so the competition will be fierce! No Pros and I decide where the line gets drawn on that(imagine the thread and shit storm on that one :biggrin:).
After that, I'm on to fix the BCS crap with college football :biggrin:
I know I'm dreaming, but it sure sounds good. Now I'm headed downstairs to get less fat!
Quote from: MELK-MAN on June 24, 2010, 11:15:54 AM
man, im not saying deal with it or stay home. Im just saying why all the bitching? It's in Miami, ya bitch. It's in KS, someone would bitch. That's life. And as far as rainfall, i never even tried to compare rainfall.. BUT since you bring it up, 50F in the rain SUCKS, 80F in the rain is just wet, but you don't risk hypothermia.
Im sure as luck will have it Kansas will be 82F and sunny, and Miami will be 69 and we will get hit with a cat. 4 hurricane, and everyone will have to hear "told ya so" for a month.
Greg that is some funny shit right there.... :lmao:
Cmon man....you know you miss central Illinois.....tornados, no trees, Illinois politics....
Quote from: backMARKr on June 24, 2010, 07:12:50 PM
Greg that is some funny shit right there.... :lmao:
Cmon man....you know you miss central Illinois.....tornados, no trees, Illinois politics....
Yea, what is a tornado or 2 to liven up some race speed laps! LOL>
I do kind of miss the miles and miles of corn and bean fields back there. It made for some boring driving when i was there but 22 yrs later i actually do miss that stuff sometimes.
Quote from: MELK-MAN on June 23, 2010, 09:40:17 PM
.. clearly stated in the post just above yours (by me) and a number of other times.
1) Money - more riders/spectators likely to show
2) weather - likely to be GREAT in FL, potential for shit storm in KS
3) keeping DIS happy
oh, i didn't understand you were one of the ccs decision makers.
I understand why the SE folks are happy about the Homestead decision, and I understand why the rest of us are bummed it won't be at HPT.
What I don't understand is how this thread has now gotten to be 14 pages long, and NOBODY from CCS has stepped forward to explain the reasoning behind the decision. C'mon folks, it's damage control time. You've successfully sent this forum into a tizzy with the ROC change, after posting a poll, and have offered absolutely no explanation. There are riders tralking trash to each other, some talking trash about CCS as a whole, some boycotting ROC altogether, and some just pooping on other regions.....none of it is helping the cause- and all of it is pretty much systemic of this thread, and your (CCS') decision.
A reply from CCS staff on this thread would be nice. But seeing as how the information was disseminated in the first place...I won't hold my breath.
Quote from: Greeny on June 25, 2010, 12:17:22 AM
oh, i didn't understand you were one of the ccs decision makers.
You don't seem to be following along.. It had been pointed out more than a few times, yet some were not catching on. I pointed out in what i thought to be a very clear and easy to read format what the main reasons were likely to be. Comprende?
Quote from: Jack_Brock on June 24, 2010, 12:46:30 PM
That is a great post! If it works out that way, maybe HPT can have an outlaw race for a little salt on the wound.
I'm in.
Quote from: MELK-MAN on June 25, 2010, 10:10:54 AM
You don't seem to be following along.. It had been pointed out more than a few times, yet some were not catching on. I pointed out in what i thought to be a very clear and easy to read format what the main reasons were likely to be. Comprende?
well, senor, I wasn't interested in your personal thoughts or assumptions regarding the decision, we can all speculate as to why Homestead was chosen. I simply wanted to know the actual reasons that CCS decided to hold it there despite a pretty decisive vote - from CCS themselves. If you'd prefer my response in a numbered list for clarity, just lemme know.
Quote from: MELK-MAN on June 24, 2010, 09:29:50 PM
Yea, what is a tornado or 2 to liven up some race speed laps! LOL>
Play along with me here..... can you imagine the lap times you could turn if a tornado was to settle in the exact center of the track? 200 mph tailwind all the way around the track!
Might have to make some allowance though for debris on the track.... like porta potties, and corner workers who weren't tied down, and an occasional cow or two. Visibility might be down a touch too.
Good thing they run the track counter-clockwise! :biggrin:
I've been skippin the Daytona ROC cause while it is fun, it isn't a road coarse and you spend 70% of the lap at wide open throttle and only 6 corners.
I understand that its got to suck for the northern guys to drive to Daytona every year. .... BUT, for me.....
I have driven to Kansas,VIR,RRR,Tally and Barber to race guys on their tracks....it will be cool to race the same guys on a track that I ride more often.
We're almost 1/2 way to the length of the 'White or Yellow' thread!
:err:
When all the information was gathered, this poll being one aspect, for the good of CCS and it's riders a decision was made. That decision was Homestead.
What the inner workings of who, what, where, how much, staff, weather, etc, some of which is confidential, was all taken into account then decision was announced when it was made so riders could make plans.
FYI I was not privy to the decision process, nor have I asked what criteria was used to determine location; my answer is soley based on my knowledge of the business. And the biggest reason I don't need the details: I know Kevin will make best decision for the racers and future health of amatuer and semi pro racing.
Quote from: Jack_Brock on June 22, 2010, 11:45:28 PM
The first big issue was I think 2005(not sure if that was Kevin or Clear channel), I attended a race and in the riders meeting, Larry Denning(the Jensen of years past) brought up that the temporary location of the finish line(on a corner with a rise) was not safe and asked for it to be moved back some distance to the straight.
Agreed. I didn't even go to that event, but I saw a map of the layout. Totally ridiculous.
Quote from: Jack_Brock on June 22, 2010, 11:45:28 PMThere were no flags and there were no lights on the car which was an Infiniti. I was later told by Kevins second in command that the Infiniti was a doctor attending the race as a spectator who decided that a downed rider was not being attended to quick enough so he jumped in his car and drove on course.
Actually, I'm betting that was the hopped up Infinity of HPT. Generally, it was driven by someone employed by the track that does a lot of SCCA stuff...and he has little actual recognition that bikes don't slow down like cars.
Eric,
I appreciate you taking the time to post up. Thank you for that. With that said, and I don't want to speak for everyone- just me, but the poll kind of made me feel as though we, the riders, were going to have a say in the ROC location. When the 2/3's majority didn't pan out for HPT, I felt as though we (the riders) were merely used as a pawn.
For me, it comes down to this- I understand CCS is a privately owned company, and is in the business to make money. I get that, as do most people. However, the "poll" (forgive my usage of quotation marks, but I think you know why) if really a true aspect of the decision, angers me a tad, given that the "poll" was done here on the unofficial CCS forum....not on the Jennings forum, or anywhere else, it was done here. Yet, the decision was not announced here..... and for a week, we have been left in the dark on a decision I felt we were supposed to be "part" of-or at least was lead to believe we were a part of. I trust you can understand my wonderment here.
Again, I do thank you for replying, but your answer doesn't really shed any light on the subject. And maybe we don't deserve to know the real reasons, but I feel that an attempt was made by CCS to get the rider's input. As such, there is a natural feeling of being jilted by many, when we were not made privy of the location by CCS staff on the board where the rider's input was implied in the first place. :wtf:
Best regards,
Ski
Quote from: CCS on May 17, 2010, 04:36:16 PM
This poll is for our information only, it is not a guarantee that the event will be held at the track that scores best in the poll.
Fair enough....onto the rest:
Quote from: CCS on May 17, 2010, 04:36:16 PM
The two tracks we use that have the weekend open are Heartland Park Topeka and Homestead Miami Speedway. While there are advantages to both facilities there are also disadvantages to each, so as far as that part of the equation goes, it is up to you to figure out which gets your vote. This poll is not the final say on the location of the event, but it will give us a better feel for which facility to proceed in negotiations with.
OK, the above text, I think, is where most of us likely felt we were an integral part of this process. Especially the highlighted portions.
I am honestly not trying to make a mountain out of a mole-hill on this subject, but come on.....can't you guys at least see the angst???
And, honestly, how did the negotiations go with HPT? I would bet they were stoked to get your call, and probably would have made any concession needed to be the ROC host.
I am not Kevin nor am I speaking for Kevin and as previously posted I have not discussed with him what the reasons are or the full criteria that was considered in this decision.
I am just part time staff. I have no insight to this issue other than being employed full time in years past, and having done regional schedule many years ago.
I apologize, Eric. I should have addressed this to you (BTW, fixed it!)
I really do appreciate you posting up, man. I just think it would be nice if Mr Elliott would have in the first place, you know?
Cheers,
Ski
Quote from: Burt Munro on June 25, 2010, 05:15:58 PM
Play along with me here..... can you imagine the lap times you could turn if a tornado was to settle in the exact center of the track? 200 mph tailwind all the way around the track!
Might have to make some allowance though for debris on the track.... like porta potties, and corner workers who weren't tied down, and an occasional cow or two. Visibility might be down a touch too.
Good thing they run the track counter-clockwise! :biggrin:
My luck would have 200MPH head wind! Now that would suck! :ahhh:
Quote from: vnvbandit on June 27, 2010, 01:12:05 PMMy luck would have 200MPH head wind!
So here's some deep thought for you: Would you be going backwards then? :ahhh:
Quote from: GSXR RACER MIKE on June 27, 2010, 11:17:25 PM
So here's some deep thought for you: Would you be going backwards then? :ahhh:
Yepper, about 60 MPH ::)
Are there points earned for the ROC? Or are the Regional Championships already determined before the ROC?
Quote from: drew231506 on July 07, 2010, 11:12:04 PM
Are there points earned for the ROC? Or are the Regional Championships already determined before the ROC?
Regional championships are all done by the time of the ROC. Grid positions are assinged by regional point standings, winner takes all in each class as National Champion. Finishing position at ROC has no impact on regional standings and other than grid position, regional points have no impact on the crowning of the National Champions.
Quote from: George_Linhart on July 07, 2010, 11:25:52 PM
Regional championships are all done by the time of the ROC. Grid positions are assinged by regional point standings, winner takes all in each class as National Champion. Finishing position at ROC has no impact on regional standings and other than grid position, regional points have no impact on the crowning of the National Champions.
FL region still has a final race in December (at Homestead) to determine the FL overall and class champions, following ROC.. but the rest of the what George said is spot on. No points for regional stuff at ROC. 1 time winner take all NtL champion.
so....................i'm confused. can anyone race in the roc?
Quote from: f3racer on July 09, 2010, 09:35:35 AM
so....................i'm confused. can anyone race in the roc?
Yup, if you've got a valid license you can race.