Motorcycle Racing Forum

Racing Discussion => Rules and Regs => Topic started by: J Farrell / Speed Tech Motorsp on October 27, 2007, 11:40:36 PM

Title: Combining Races NO MORE!!
Post by: J Farrell / Speed Tech Motorsp on October 27, 2007, 11:40:36 PM
I believe we shouldn't combine races that are not already combined. We had this discussion once before. At Blackhawk for the last round of 07 we did this and it was a much smoother day with less crashes and it made it fun to watch the races.
I could list over 10 reasons to keep it that way. I think it needs to be a rule in CCS that they don't do that.
Title: Re: Combining Races NO MORE!!
Post by: Super Dave on October 28, 2007, 10:39:06 AM
I think you're preaching to the choir, Jason. 
Title: Re: Combining Races NO MORE!!
Post by: Scotty Ryan on October 28, 2007, 11:37:03 AM
I agree with both of you - But I also think that it gets dangerous/confusing if you have a bunch of classes running together.... If we aren't going to worry about the safety aspect or weather or not people at the track can figure out who is in what position or what bike is in what class - Then I say we run just one race a weekend - Run what you Brung - Winner take all - and we don't grid by points - but by tire usage - whoever used the least amount of tires the previous season gets pole.....
Title: Re: Combining Races NO MORE!!
Post by: Woofentino Pugrossi on October 28, 2007, 04:58:41 PM
Uh we DID combine races at the last BHF. Crashes at the last one were minimal due to want as many racers as there usually is and you clowns started to behave out there. :lmao:

Title: Re: Combining Races NO MORE!!
Post by: TommyG on October 29, 2007, 11:00:37 PM
Jason was able to talk Bill out of combining several classes (all the middleweights  and ULGP I believe) during the riders meeting at the last Blackhawk which definitely made for less traffic.  It was nice not lapping someone on the third lap for once!! :thumb:
Title: Re: Combining Races NO MORE!!
Post by: r6_philly on October 30, 2007, 02:35:25 PM
sometimes you have to combine races so the day gets run at all. unfortunately the track rental and insurance is so high that the money they charge for entries doesn't buy you the kind of tracktime you want. unfortunately but it is true.

I don't work for CCS, I am a race director to a smaller racing series, but the same problem persists, and I had to combine races so that all the races can be run in the past. and it won't be the last time.

If entry fees are twice as much then maybe less races can be run and not be combined but then participation would be down and so would the revenue and soon no one will get to race anything...

its obviously not that simple but again unfortunately it is just the way it is due to high cost. need to run more classes and bring in more racers and entries...
Title: Re: Combining Races NO MORE!!
Post by: Super Dave on October 30, 2007, 07:55:39 PM
Quote from: r6_philly on October 30, 2007, 02:35:25 PMneed to run more classes and bring in more racers and entries...
Until some one sits down and figures out a cutting edge way to attract people, or to keep them in for a little longer, then things will change.  Adding more classes hasn't had the results keeping entries high, has it?  Years ago, a racer averaged around four race entries.  Now that's down to close to two. 
Title: Re: Combining Races NO MORE!!
Post by: murf99 on November 09, 2007, 02:26:38 PM
Jason,

I was at the last Blackhawk round for my second CCS weekend.  I was running Middleweight GT, which on Saturday was the class up for discussion.  I couldn't agree more with your statements, and I REALLY appreciate you being so adimant about the point.

I really appreciated not getting in the way of folks 6 sec/lap faster than me.  And I'm sure you fast guys enjoyed not having me as a mobile chicane.  It's a win-win.

If time is a concern, why not remove some time from the first morning practice.  In all the weekends I've either raced in or attended, I've never seen more than 5 bikes on the track for first practice...  The time would be better allocated to uncombining large-grid races, IMO.
Title: Re: Combining Races NO MORE!!
Post by: Court Jester on November 10, 2007, 02:16:35 AM
Quote from: Super Dave on October 30, 2007, 07:55:39 PM
Until some one sits down and figures out a cutting edge way to attract people, or to keep them in for a little longer, then things will change.

the proper work with the media would go a very very very long way. the race organizations are so busy running events and setting up for the next that little to no time is spent promoting. get a group of collage kids going for their masters looking for a class project and you'd be suprised what could happen.
Title: Re: Combining Races NO MORE!!
Post by: xb9racer on November 10, 2007, 09:48:31 AM
Knock the GT races down to 15 minutes.
If I remember correctly, the last race weekend, there were more problems in the Expert races than the AM races.
One of the expert GT races was cut way short.
Title: Re: Combining Races NO MORE!!
Post by: Super Dave on November 10, 2007, 01:30:53 PM
I say eliminate GT races, but that's another story.

GT's are 30 minutes started from the five minute board.  So, by the time you take the green flag, 25 minutes.  If there's red flag down time, the time is still counting down.  If clean up will be extended, well, a restart will take at least five minutes again.  Yeah, they can get cut short.
Title: Re: Combining Races NO MORE!!
Post by: weggieman on November 20, 2007, 01:53:03 PM
Could the lack of track time on a weekend possibly be the result of too damn many classes? Gee that's never been brought up before but race orgs seem to think there needs to be a class for everything and at least three levels of prep for each class.

It's called $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$
Title: Re: Combining Races NO MORE!!
Post by: Woofentino Pugrossi on November 20, 2007, 02:42:20 PM
Quote from: murf99 on November 09, 2007, 02:26:38 PM
If time is a concern, why not remove some time from the first morning practice.  In all the weekends I've either raced in or attended, I've never seen more than 5 bikes on the track for first practice...  The time would be better allocated to uncombining large-grid races, IMO.

:lmao: Unless it was raining for the first practice, theres usually more than 5 bikes.

Eliminate a practice and racers bitch.
Move things around so we can get out before the cut off for race engines, racers bitch.
Have to take 15 min to clean an oiled down track, racers bitch.
Combine a class that for some damn reason has only 5 in EX and 7 in AM, racers bitch.
Raise entry fees, racers bitch.

If it goes to only 1 practice round, well then heres what would happen.
Registration will have to close early, as in probably the time practice starts (8am instead of 9) leading to people getting bent out of shape because they may have got stuck in traffic on the way in.
Some people who may have had a issue with the bike not starting in the morning may not get to practice at all.
Some people will miss it due to waiting at tech.
Some will miss it due to getting tires.
Morning dew not letting people get the full benefit from practice.


Damn. THey bitch because practice isnt long enough, bitch that its too long, bitch because of this, bitch because of that, etc.......
Title: Re: Combining Races NO MORE!!
Post by: weggieman on November 20, 2007, 09:07:22 PM
Yep, racers bitch, it's just part of their makeup. I've bitched and I've listened to the bitching. What's the deal? That is what keeps thid board going. Without the bitching nobody wiould have anything to say!!
Title: Re: Combining Races NO MORE!!
Post by: Burt Munro on November 21, 2007, 01:22:37 PM
Anybody have a good recipe for oyster stuffing?     :whine:
Title: Re: Combining Races NO MORE!!
Post by: backMARKr on November 21, 2007, 01:31:35 PM
Quote from: Woofentino Pugrossi on November 20, 2007, 02:42:20 PM
If it goes to only 1 practice round, well then heres what would happen.
Registration will have to close early, as in probably the time practice starts (8am instead of 9) leading to people getting bent out of shape because they may have got stuck in traffic on the way in.
Some people who may have had a issue with the bike not starting in the morning may not get to practice at all.
Some people will miss it due to waiting at tech.
Some will miss it due to getting tires.
Morning dew not letting people get the full benefit from practice.


Damn. THey bitch because practice isnt long enough, bitch that its too long, bitch because of this, bitch because of that, etc.......


Must be tough being omnipotent.... :err:
Title: Re: Combining Races NO MORE!!
Post by: Woofentino Pugrossi on November 21, 2007, 02:07:12 PM
Quote from: backMARKr on November 21, 2007, 01:31:35 PM
Must be tough being omnipotent.... :err:

Nope.


Just from past experience.