what is used for the points total to bump up to expert? total points from every class that you've run or the overall selective combined points for your region?
example: my Mid-atlantic overall points are less
than 750 and my Mid-atlantic class points are over 750.
Well according to the 2004 PRINTED rule book...
(Page 11) Section 2.2.4, chapter A, sub section 4. Any amature rider who scores 750 points in a 12 month period.
Says nothing about "selective classes".
Selective points are only used to determine overall points championships and do not use some of the 'specialty' classes in there totals.
Total overall points in 1 region is what CCS goes by, no matter what classes. Notice also that as Rob posted this is in a 12 month period of time, not just 1 season. If you raced at all in '03 then some of those points could be included as well. Making the jump to expert isn't as tramatic as most people expect and will most likely make you a better racer. But if you feel your not up to that then you can protest your advancement to expert if moved automatically due to points. This can only be done once in a career, but is an option. All you would have to do (after finding out you were getting advanced) is to write a short letter describing why you should stay amateur for 1 more season and send it to the main CCS office. :)
thanks for the info!
You better start typing your letter. ;D
Ya think so? ::)
This was my first year, I raced three classes with a total of over 1400 points. Is writing a letter a waste of time, or should I just put on white plates. I did not win a class championship.
QuoteThis was my first year, I raced three classes with a total of over 1400 points. Is writing a letter a waste of time, or should I just put on white plates. I did not win a class championship.
It's not necessarily a waste of time. However, if your performance index indicates it, you may be bumped to expert anyways.
Dawn
I went ahead and sent a letter to kevin about using my one peition to stay amature next year. It was my first season and my total points where somewhere around 1600, but my performance index was a dismall 642.
I had originally planned on going expert in a LW class but, I haven't been able to get a newer race bike for next season so it looks like I'll be on my old 2000 ZX6R. If I have to go expert that's fine and dandy, I just wanted to know what my options where.
Think I'll be granted another year Amature, or should I quit moaning about being on an older slower bike and run in the Expert MW class anyway?
:-/
QuoteThink I'll be granted another year Amature, or should I quit moaning about being on an older slower bike and run in the Expert MW class anyway?
:-/
Yeah, I think you should go ahead and race expert! ;)
How are you Scott?! Drop me an E-mail sometime.
I don't want the YPC title I just want to have a good time doing this next year...
642 is not necessarily dismal. Depends on what classes you're running in. In middleweight, that's a big class.
With that many points and decent results, I'd not be afraid to move up. That's how you get faster. Plus, consider if you raced with another organization....say WSMC. You'd be expert by the 3rd weekend!!!!
FYI--petition letters need to come to me, not Kevin. Also, your letter must be sent in with your license renewal (not before), and those should be coming out in the next couple of weeks.
Tiffany, if we're bumping up, can we call and reserve our race number for the expert class?
Your number is yours, whether you're an amateur or an expert. We assign numbers once per region, so as long as you get your renewal in on time, you'll keep your number. The cut-off this year should be January 1st, but we'll let you know if that's changed.
Thanks Tiffany!!!
I only have 708 total points and I am petitioning to go expert next year. I can not imagine any justification for sandbagging with yellow plates next year if you were able to get 1400 and 1600 points last year. ???
My opinion, if you want to be a real racer, race with the fast guys wearing white plates.
George
You want a cookie George?
QuoteI only have 708 total points and I am petitioning to go expert next year. I can not imagine any justification for sandbagging with yellow plates next year if you were able to get 1400 and 1600 points last year. ???
My opinion, if you want to be a real racer, race with the fast guys wearing white plates.
George
Why did you only get 700 points? What did you race?
George raced less than 1/2 the weekends on an older (I won't say ratty, but it isn't pretty) 929, so he could only race in 3 classes. But, he is a safe and compentant rider (and pretty fast).
Some of us with pressing jobs have trouble getting out for more than 3-4 weekends in a year.
I'm with George, if you want to get better, you got a ride with the good guys.
Thank you sir.
Just wait until I put on DOT race tires rather than the street tires I raced on this year. While I will be on the same "ratty" 929 next year, its gone on a diet (about 10 lbs of street gear already removed since the last race at VIR) and I am getting rid of the heavy and restrictive exhaust pipe this winter.
With the short season due to Summit Point problems and the class limitations, I actually feel reasonably good about my points. I am comfortable that I can get into the mid-pack of experts next year. I will feel more successful placing mid-pack in expert than I would winning an amature race.
George
I was just curious because the CCS minimum necessary to become an expert is pretty minimum. Personally I would MUCH rather run at the front of the novice group than the back of the expert group unless it had lost it's challenge (front meaning top 3). I don't think I would petition to go up though unless I had, for some reason, only hit a couple races and handed all the novices their asses. In that case I wouldn't have enough points but would obviously be sandbagging staying back. Otherwise I don't agree with people petitioning to go expert. To each their own though. I will be running middle pack expert next year myself, dreaming of the old novice glory. :-/
QuoteI will be running middle pack expert next year myself, dreaming of the old novice glory. :-/
Grade school glory, High school challenge.
You may be suprised how well you do when you go expert. I was a front running amateur in '97 that was also thinking I would get my butt handed to me the next season in the Expert ranks. The '98 season rolls around and I immediately am finishing top 5 at the 1st event, I couldn't believe it! That streak continued until the Road America event that season that was combined with NASB (this was the national series before FUSA). I was running 4th in the no longer existing Unlimited Superbike class against racers who I would read about in the motorcycle publications, I was amazed that I was doing so well. But I had made a bad choice not to replace the heavily worn front tire on my bike and unded up high-siding in turn 14 as I was passing for 3rd. I got injured and had quite a bit of bike damage ($ wise) from the gravel trap so I ended up missing 1/2 the season and lost the edge that I previously had.
First year Expert enthusiasm can do wonders if you already have the major skills. You'll probably find that the Experts are more focused, smooth, and predictable in their lines. Having multiple rabbits to chase will also do wonders in making you faster, kind of the mentality 'if they can do it, so can I'.
Food for thought Mike...Thanks. I wasn't exactly a front runner though, my average place was somewhere around 5th :-/
OK, can we wrap this up then?
Do I have to do anything?
CCS will send me a renewal packet?
They will determine a bump or not?
What if my points don't require an auto
bump but I want to go anyway?
Will the schedules be out before the
renewal deadline?
Mike_
QuoteOK, can we wrap this up then?
Do I have to do anything?
CCS will send me a renewal packet?
They will determine a bump or not?
What if my points don't require an auto
bump but I want to go anyway?
Will the schedules be out before the
renewal deadline?
Mike_
CCS will automatically send you a renewal packet which will say if you are bumped to Expert on the licensing form. (disclaimer: each year a few random racers never recieve their renewals for whatever reason, so if after you read here that everyone has recieved their packet, and you haven't, just call CCS and ask)
When you get your renewal, and if it still says Amateur, then you would have to petition to go Expert if so desired. A recommondation by a CCS official(s), someone in a position like SuperDave, or from other Experts would help your cause if your looking to upgrade.
I believe the schedules are going to be out soon, they may possibly be included in with your renewal packet. If not then we should hopefully see the schedule soon after recieving the renewal packet. :)
I'm kinda in the same boat! i don't know what to do. this was my first year racing. i finished 2nd in middleweight supersport points and 5th in middleweight superbike points in the midatlantic region. i was trying to decide on what to do. i've talked to several people about it, some say move up to expert and some say stay amature. so somebody help me out
QuotePersonally I would MUCH rather run at the front of the novice group than the back of the expert group unless it had lost it's challenge (front meaning top 3). I don't think I would petition to go up though unless I had, for some reason, only hit a couple races and handed all the novices their asses. In that case I wouldn't have enough points but would obviously be sandbagging staying back. Otherwise I don't agree with people petitioning to go expert. To each their own though. I will be running middle pack expert next year myself, dreaming of the old novice glory. :-/
I agree. At BHF, the front running AM's were within a second or two at most of the front running experts!
If you're in mid pack, then I don't think you should be moved up to expert. I'd rather run mid pack AM then dead last expert.
It all comes back to Super Dave's suggestion of a third class.
QuoteI agree. At BHF, the front running AM's were within a second or two at most of the front running experts!
If you're in mid pack, then I don't think you should be moved up to expert. I'd rather run mid pack AM then dead last expert.
It all comes back to Super Dave's suggestion of a third class.
Well, keep in mind that going expert is automatically good for ~2 seconds a lap. I don't know how... it just is. You will learn SO MUCH MORE. I had a win and a bunch of top-3s earlier this year as an Am. Ran a few Team Challenge events and couldn't BELIEVE the difference running against the experts. Smoother, cleaner, more predictable. I wound up bumping myself up halfway through the season and am SUPER glad I did. I immediately went faster and started learning again.
It's not as scary as you think it will be, trust me.
QuoteWell, keep in mind that going expert is automatically good for ~2 seconds a lap. I don't know how... it just is. You will learn SO MUCH MORE. I had a win and a bunch of top-3s earlier this year as an Am. Ran a few Team Challenge events and couldn't BELIEVE the difference running against the experts. Smoother, cleaner, more predictable. I wound up bumping myself up halfway through the season and am SUPER glad I did. I immediately went faster and started learning again.
It's not as scary as you think it will be, trust me.
Don't you remember how much faster you were going when you passed me on the outside of the long left hander at BHF during school! ;)
I'm still pretty much that slow! ;D
QuoteI'm kinda in the same boat! i don't know what to do. this was my first year racing. i finished 2nd in middleweight supersport points and 5th in middleweight superbike points in the midatlantic region. i was trying to decide on what to do. i've talked to several people about it, some say move up to expert and some say stay amature. so somebody help me out
If this is Adam you better go expert!!! Don't sandbag... we'll both go out there with white plates and shred some kick ass lap times next year!!
ps: if you stay amateur so will I and you know what THAT means ;D
Scott
scott how the hell are ya buddy?? man i dunno bout the expert deal, i don't believe i could hang bud. it'd be nice but i dunno......hey give me a call sometime and let me know how the ROC went. see ya
QuoteI'm kinda in the same boat! i don't know what to do. this was my first year racing. i finished 2nd in middleweight supersport points and 5th in middleweight superbike points in the midatlantic region. i was trying to decide on what to do. i've talked to several people about it, some say move up to expert and some say stay amature. so somebody help me out
Adam, Move up! Don't be a tea bagger...I mean sand bagger! You won't get much faster running with the squids. Move on up with the crazies. It will be some time before we start getting poduims (and contengency) again but it's the most logical route of progression.
Donald
shew shit. yeah i guess you guys are right. i need to bump but i dunno. if i would have did as good as you guys (donald & scott) i wouldn't 'have any trouble deciding. wonder how much faster i'll actually get having my a$$ handed to me in the white plate group?