I'm watching the race currently and was just thinking how small of a starting grid that was. I believe that's the only single wave race I've seen for a Daytona 200 race. I wonder if that was because of the extra fast pole time by EBOZ or if it was just low turn-out this year?
Too bad for Ben Bostrom trashing his Honda's transmission (apparently), he might have had a chance at winning it.
the limit this year is 110% because of all the factory guys complained, plus eboz time, made qualifying 1:57 something cut off. There are over 20 that didnt make the grid
did you see the Aaron yates crash? did you headbutt fania or what? that should be fined... If it was me I would let him have it... all of it
Quotethe limit this year is 110% because of all the factory guys complained, plus eboz time, made qualifying 1:57 something cut off. There are over 20 that didnt make the grid
did you see the Aaron yates crash? did you headbutt fania or what? that should be fined... If it was me I would let him have it... all of it
I was unaware of the 110% cut-off, I thought it was still at 112%, that 2% would definately make a big difference.
As bum of a deal as that was for Yates, that response was definately stupid! Yes, in the heat of the moment you can make bad decisions, but it's his job to be a representative of Suzuki. I think he should be reprimanded in some way that makes a difference, not just some stupid slap on the wrist. Maybe don't allow him to race for a certain number of events, I think that would generate results from Suzuki against him.
thats the most unsportsman like conduct for a professional. but then he has laid down on the track and all that crap before. Sh!t happens and you can be angery, but you don't take physical confrontations, not in the view of thousands of people while you are representing your company on TV. I hope AMA does something about this. You can really interprete it as "wishing to cause harm on a fellow competitor". I can't believe that happened. Moaning and b!ithing is onething, what he did is just wrong
Yates should be DQed for the rest of the year for that stupid move and he should have his butt kicked as well. What a complete as#hole. :P
Two words: Assault charges.
Go outside a guy, turn in on top of him, then drop kick and head butt him when you both crash?
Does AMA use a blue flag?
Time for Suzuki to drop Yates and pick up Barnes!!!!
Congrats to Maldin on his win!
Zempke, OMG 2nd place, what a great effort for his 1st Daytona 200 Superbike race!
Miguel, come on just admit it, Zempke beat ya! 3rd is still awesome!
Ducati, no change in history there! ;)
Just proof that they really do watch WWE in Georgia! Not only did Yates commit a truly serious violation of rules and ethics- he looked likea 12 year old hillbilly doing it! A set number of race suspension, hefty fine(given to a good charity) and if I was the Suzuki team manager, I would offer to repair Fania's machine as a goodwill gesture only and to save some face. If this happened in CCS, we would allow charges to be filed and some serious punishment. This kind of behaviour is never to be tolerated in this sport by anyone- pro or first time amateur. We will see just what kind of teeth the AMA has and whether or not they are just concerned with sponsorship and ratings.
On a good... Screw that... fabulous note- SW region local privateer Scott Jensen pulls a 9th!! Congrats Scott! And to think, his bike was one he just bought in boxes two weeks ago!
Did you guys see the conversation they caught with the official and 1 of the people in Fania crew? I overheard someone saying something about filing assult charges!
After Yates runs into Fania and takes both of them out, he kicks Fania in the back, and then head butt's him! That defenitely is screaming for a public apology by Yates, on TV, at an AMA event, on top of any other reprimands he recieves before he can ever race again with the AMA.
the first kick was a stupid move. Then after Fania walked away, he went after him and gave him a head butt. I mean, heat of the moment is one thing, delibrately starting something is another. Props to Fania for not stooping down as low and fight back. I don't know if I would have held back :)
something better be done to yates, that is just way to far. I would just lie down on the ground and complain my back is hurting after yates kicked me :p charges, civil suit, whatever :D
I kind of liked Fania's answer to Yates - the hand gesture back.
If that had been ME he head butted you'd be seeing some serious ground combat.
It looks like the privateer was the real pro this time.
Ya know, its a good thing that Yates wasnt in contention for the lead when Fania was being lapped (second time??)
9 races in the last two seasons with the outcome being determined by lappers...
I do NOT support what Yates did, btw... It was a stupid reaction... But he just saw his win and his multi hundred thousand dollar bonus go up in smoke, and his chance to shut Mat up...
The grid was very small this year, but outside of that yates incident, I only saw, what, 7 guys on the race? The one on TV...
I wanted to give some credit to Jack Pfeifer , Lee Acree, and Ricky Orlando (didnt he crash in the chicane??) Great to see some guys on privateer equipment run hard and only get lapped once in a 200 mile race!
Real bummer for Ben, Eric, Yates, and Most of all for Pegram who coudl have finished as high as 5th I think, if everyone had stayed in it. His bike was down on power but he was making it up in the infield big time. One brake rotor bolt backs out, and his day is done!
And Killer job to the Jakester!
I for one think that the 600ss race was one of the most awesome races of all time! Disalvo was just nutz to swerve into Rog like that!
i was wondering when they announced the change from 112% to 110% ?? K. Hansen didnt make the 110% cut and he was soooo close too. I wonder if he new that when qualifying?
37 riders thats like an ameture MW club race ! Doesnt the race pay back to 45 or 55 something like that ?
Yates should be bared from the next race weekend for that shit!
Quote
Too bad for Ben Bostrom trashing his Honda's transmission (apparently), he might have had a chance at winning it.
did you headbutt fania or what? that should be fined... If it was me I would let him have it... all of it
I think he should be reprimanded in some way that makes a difference, not just some stupid slap on the wrist.
thats the most unsportsman like conduct for a professional.
Sh!t happens and you can be angery, but you don't take physical confrontations, not in the view of thousands of people while you are representing your company on TV.
Two words: Assault charges
I would offer to repair Fania's machine as a goodwill gesture only and to save some face. If this happened in CCS, we would allow charges to be filed and some serious punishment.
Props to Fania for not stooping down as low and fight back. I don't know if I would have held back
something better be done to yates, that is just way to far. I would just lie down on the ground and complain my back is hurting after yates kicked me :p charges, civil suit, whatever
credit to Jack Pfeifer , Lee Acree, and Ricky Orlando (didnt he crash in the chicane??) Great to see some guys on privateer equipment run hard and only get lapped once
Real bummer for Ben, Eric, Yates, and Most of all for Pegram who coudl have finished as high as 5th
HEY, YOU GUYS SAID ALL I WANTED TO SAY...
THANKS... 8)
Quote9 races in the last two seasons with the outcome being determined by lappers...
..
I dont agree with that 200 being determined by a lapper,...
I'm not all that fast, but just the same as in everyday traffic, "rear-ending" someone would be MY fault....
Ike
(just opinion) ;)
QuoteYa know, its a good thing that Yates wasnt in contention for the lead when Fania was being lapped (second time??)
9 races in the last two seasons with the outcome being determined by lappers...
I do NOT support what Yates did, btw... It was a stupid reaction... But he just saw his win and his multi hundred thousand dollar bonus go up in smoke, and his chance to shut Mat up...
The grid was very small this year, but outside of that yates incident, I only saw, what, 7 guys on the race? The one on TV...
Sorry but lappers didnt take Yates out, Yates took himself out with that stupid move around the outside. He had 4th wrapped up and had no chance at the win. What was he thinking? "If I pass this guy anyway possible I might be able to get up front in 4 laps", what a moron. This is what I call, out of control, stupid aggression. His win go up in smoke? He wasnt even close to the front and his tires were shot, he had no chance at the win unless the top 3 took each other out. Did you watch the same race as the rest of us? How come Mat, Jake, and Duhumel didnt have one problem with lappers? Because they were patient, and safely passed them, just what Yates didnt do.
QuoteI dont agree with that 200 being determined by a lapper,...
I'm not all that fast, but just the same as in everyday traffic, "rear-ending" someone would be MY fault....
Ike
(just opinion) ;)
Hey Ike and James, don't bite on this one, he's a real antagonist about lappers and will just keep egg-ing everyone on and on about it like he's done in the past. If you remember, he was the 1 saying that Bostrom wasn't to blame for the 4 bike crash at the AMA Barber event last year.
It's always been clear that it's the responsibility of the passer to pass safely, and just like the Bostrom incident at Barber last year a Pro made a mistake and should take responsibility for it. If a racer lacks the ability to pass other riders, then mabey they need to go back to regional racing and learn to do it!
Yea, I know about Team Unclear, I just couldnt help myself. ;D
interesting, the 200 pays back to 60th place. They had 37 people on the grid. Rick Shaw missed it by .4 or something.
But for FX, Superstock at least, they used the same old 112% cut off time. So they tried to put more people on the grid. I would think they want to do that in Superbike since most people have sink alot of money and time into prepping for the 200. And the final standing had what, 20 some people in the running at the end, not real good size.
and about lappers, if you look at Jack, Lee and Opie and others in the top 10, they are not running blazing times, and they get lapped a few times, its consistency and longevity that does well in the 200. people will get lapped there and passed because of the pit stops. it should not be an issue of who's in the way. They should know how to get by someone without crashinginto them. It is not life and death to win a race, so don't make it that way.
Yates should lose his ride! Is that how you represent your sponsors? Comitting assault on a live, world-wide telecast? Never mind the fact that the incident was entirely Yates's fault. His behavior would have been completely unacceptable even if he'd been the innocent victim.
I am very greatful for the sponsorship that I have recieved. (I choose not to mention my sponsors while discussing this subject.) I try to conduct myself as an employee of my sponsors, be it on, off, or away from the track. Behavior like Yates displayed would certianly get me fired and arrested if I did it at my regular job. Racing a motorcycle and representing Suzuki are Yates's job. He should be fired at the very least.
Now let's see what AMA and Suzuki decide to do...
read:
http://www.cyclenews.com/ShowStory.asp?HeadlineID=5922
apparently according fania sr. american suzuki team is just the same bit of aholes as yates were
Dont be suprised if Yates DOES lose his ride... The incident was in clear violation of his contract....
R_6.. Rick Shaw... That was such a bummer... Did everyone catch the emotional interview with him? I thought they should have given him a provisional start, let him run one lap, just to keep his streak alive... That was the lowlight of the whole week as far as Im concerned...
BTW, did anyopne catch the remarks that Mat said about EB?? What an azzhole... It will be REAL interesting to see what he has to say now...
just goes to show how fucked up the ama is !
BTW.. Yates was running a two stop race, and the other three in front of him were all on three... Yates would have been in P1 after they stopped, if he could hold it was another matter...
The assult charge wont amount to anything, but his contract with Yosh and Suzuki is for sure in jepordy...
QuoteBTW.. Yates was running a two stop race, and the other three in front of him were all on three... Yates would have been in P1 after they stopped, if he could hold it was another matter...
BS. It was on lap 49 of 57. None of the leaders pitted after the incident, he was in 4th and wasn't going to do any better. He took himself out. And he's done the same s h i t of taking riders front tires out in open practice. Where his "multi hundred thousand dollar bonus" wasn't a factor.
Yates is an ass. It's been shown again. He can deny all he wants but he kicked the guy in the BACK while he was getting up. It just shows what little respect he has for other riders.
This is driving me crazy. It would be battery, not assault.
I do not want to hear about "lappers" and how they decide the race. In the 200, a lapper is pretty much anyone that has no quick change set-up. That is 3/4 of the grid! No one is going to sit and watch a 12 rider race where 5 finish. No "lappers"- no 200.
Good races today.
Yates. Uy. I'm a Yates fan - and am pretty disappointed in his actions today. I can understand his frustration - but to carry on in the manner he did, it really wouldn't shock me to lose his ride.
EDIT - from watching the tape, it didn't seem to ME like Yates caused the crash. Myself (and those of us who were watching) felt that the lapper was already headed off the track, like he over-cooked the corner, and that Yates had just made a poor decision to pass on the outside. But now, after reading the article someone posted a link to above, I don't know if that's the case anymore. It seems like there is an awful lot of he-said-she-said going on - Yates is TOTALLY backing down ("I didn't really kick him" - YA YOU DID!!!) But it also seems like a little bit of dramatization from the lapper as well. At any rate - Yates is (and should be) hosed. Not cool of him. Not at all.
E-Boz. Three words: typical Ducati junk. Would have been nice to see Michelin take the win. E-Boz was definitely out-riding everyone on the track IMO. Hopefully Ducati Austin can build a motor that will hold together for the remaining rounds - I'd like to see him and Michelin do well.
Supersport race was pretty sweet though! Got it on Tivo - that'll get plenty of airplay at my house!
Regardless of how many times the lapper was passed, the fact still remains that Yates made a STUPID move. You don't EVER pass a lapper on the outside going INTO a turn. That was about as boneheaded as Scott Russell walking his bike sideways across the grid before being t-boned into retirement.
File this under sh1t you just don't do...
Yates then went on to a second idiot move with the physical altercation afterwards. I can understand the utter anger, disappointment and frustration, but you just plain don't get physical... Have some restraint...
It'll be interesting to see how AMA handles this one.
Another story linkhttp://www.amasuperbike.com/2004/Mar/040307ayt.htm
I can'y say what I think of Yates. This is a "family" forum.
Jim,
It wasnt Ducati junk that caused EB to go out, it was a piece of debris from the track..
He slowed down so much and just came cruising in.. Flat front tire.... The piece he hit also punctured the oil cooler...
I TOTALLY agree that Aaron made a BAD pass, he was off line, but his closing speed was HUGE on the lapper, and he made a split second decision, and the wrong one... Mr Polen said that Aaron came up, was planning on passing out side, the lapped blew the corner, and ran straight into Aaron. Aaron had to turn in, but he had 15-20 ft on the INSIDE of the lapper to make a pass... He also said that Aaron will most likely lose his ride...
Cstem, I disagree.... TV audience will watch a five or 6 rider race, they did today.. But I belive that the KWS guys had quickchange, and Fania was on that team...
Half of me thinks thatthis will just blow over because KWS is a Suzuki support team, and I guess that the KWS guys got thrown out of the Suzuki box at Daytona, and lots of harsh words were exchanged... It might cost Aaron his ride, and it might alos cost KWS their support deal...
Crashign sucks, but its part of our sport...
Doug also pointed out one other lil thing that I missed today.... DiSalvo swung down on Roger Lee, "weaving: to make the others check up and or break the draft.. Rog looked like he was full on the brakes... There may/might, should be some penalty for that as well... Imagine if Rog's bike would have gone down... 6, maybe 8 bikes with it, 170mph, and prolly hit the starter too... Scary thought...
as far as eboz goes, it is not actaully just your typical duc blow I IMO. If what they say, the oil cooler sprung a leak, I can understand. racing from the 11th row last weekend saw my brand new professional paint job destoyed by thousands of little rocks hitting it at speed. I am surprised my radiator didn't sprung a leak. There are 3 cracks on my windscreen, and my tearoff had 5 holes on it, and the shield is pitted behind the tearoff. On top of that, my stainless steel mid pipe had about 20 or so pits from rocks hitting it at speed. The duc oil cooler is mounted low I think, it doesn''t suprise me if it gets hit hard enough to cause a leak. that is a shame though, I guess file that one under "we didn't know it would do that" category. You can be sure they will install something to protect the oil cooler and radiator next time out.
Ok - if that is the case, and they sprung an oil cooler leak, then I'll give Ducati a little more credit (tho I still say they're junk! ;) ) I definitely know there is a lot of crap on the track - lap 18 of the Team Challenge race on Thursday, we were 2nd in GTU I believe (definitely in the top-5)... Dan came in for a rider and fuel change - and we found a freakin' hole in the radiator. That ended our day. Very disappointing to say the least.
I would have expected the Daytona officials to SWEEP the track prior to the AMA races - but I'm guessing they probably didn't. We're just a bunch of rowdy motorcyclists that pick fights in the infield anyways! ;)
I have been to daytona 3 times and this year is by far 10 times worse than anyother time I remembered. well I did run up front as a AM so not so many people throwing stuff at me (:)) but I still think this year is very bad as far as debris and rocks pebbles go. Don't know why. I was cleaning the bike today and got about 100 or more little rock pebbles out of my lowers. Like I ran through a gravel trap. Interesting, something is not right with the track this year.
Team Nuke- when I mean a six rider race- I mean six riders total onthe course- sorry if that wasn't totally clear.
Guess it was a lot less than it looked like...
There wasnt a kick, it looked that way on camera, but we couldnt see his feet, just the bales....
"Video replays of the incident appeared to show Yates attempt to drop-kick Fania before the head-butt, but Fania said, "There was no drop-kicking, no drop kicking involved. All he did was head-butt me, like the jerkoff that he is."
So without that, there isnt much... http://venus.13x.com/roadracingworld/scripts/NewsInsert.asp?insert=8668
Sounds like Fania was pushing it a bit as well...
Aaron was runnign in second, 2.4 seconds behind Mat...
Lets face it guys what Fania should have done was just kick his hillbilly as$. That would really make all these so called pros think twice about going after a privateer after an incident like that. Trust me a a$$ whipping on TV would have straigtned Yates out Quick.
Here is the E mail that I sent to Yoshimura. I stopped short of recommending Jessie Janiche for the position... ;)
I have been riding motorcycles for 35 years, have worked in the industry for 20 years, and have been a CCS club racer for 5 years. I've used and sold plenty of Yoshimura parts during that time.
I'll say this as plainly as I can. Aaron Yates' behavior at the Daytona 200 was damaging to the sport, Yoshimura's reputation and Suzuki's reputation. What Yates did was not the fault of Yoshimura, but what comes next is going to affect how the world views your company.
Yoshimura is an innovative company that makes high-quality parts, but everything you sell is available elsewhere. What Yates did is not the fault of Yoshimura, but what comes next is going to affect how the world views your company. There are many talented riders who could do Yates' job, and I'm sure that any of them would do a better job of representing your company. This is an opportunity for Yoshimura to show the motorcycle world how deeply the company cares about racing.
Personally, I feel that Yoshimura would actually gain positive image points if Yates is fired. On the other hand, I can't see how you would ever want to run another ad that ties his name or face to your company. I definetly know how I feel about this situation. If Yates is not fired, I will pry the Yoshimura tags off all the equipment I've bought from you, and I will never buy or recommend your products to my customers again.
QuoteLets face it guys what Fania should have done was just kick his hillbilly as$. That would really make all these so called pros think twice about going after a privateer after an incident like that. Trust me a a$$ whipping on TV would have straigtned Yates out Quick.
;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D
Thats funny ;D ;D...
I'm a big fan of all these guys. most you guys too, this is a pretty skilled and determined sport, difficult and rewarding...
EBoz is fast.. I like him, AYates is fast, I like him, there are a bunch of guys that can do well with a "ride".... IMO Dennis Rodman has some issues outside of basketball, but I loved what he did for DA BULLS! ...."da bulls"...
I understand the frustration factor mixing with a GREAT dissapointment and a BAAAAAD guess estimate going waaaay unlike you were just too sure it would go for Yates...
but if I were in the other shoe, and was head butted on world wide TV, MY FOOLISH pride would have more than likely caused.... uhm.....(whats good to say here???) .... a fight.... I dont know if I can kick his ...... or not, but I was furious on the couch!!! >:(
he woulda had ta tussle!
I mean, get a grip!!!.. >:( ... If you make a right hand turn into oncoming traffic and come home paralized (I DONT hope that on anyone!), It would be a hard fact, but YOUR fault... dont go trying to sue the trucking company...
DONT BEAT UP A LAPPER BCUZ YOU (in your greatness) RAN INTO EM! ( I'm no specialist on anything that I mention, I just feel free to speak here because I race :) )
GSXRMIKE, (WUSSUP, MAN?)..
I Know about the thread ;) I was "baitin" too...
(it's all good, everything else in life is pretty boring) (I hope thats not just me)
I'm sorry for both the bostroms, bcuz it really looked like either of them couldv pulled it off, and Jake kinda surprised me, but I know he can ride...
HELL, I'm GLAD It's frikgen SEASON time again!!!!
AND, speaking on Daytona again is a chance for me to bid a FAREWELL to Bryan (MightyDuc) as the new season starts and we leave Daytona for the second round.... (Rest In Peace B......)
40
(Alexa, I need some work)
OH, AND ON THE TRACK CONDITION !!! >:(
PUHLEASE!!! >:( I am SOOOO FREAKING sick and tired of these big places and companies Who DEMAND SOOOOOO MUCH of patrons and consumers IN GENERAL! for them (DAYTONA, FORMULA USA, AMA CCS) and cant extend the simplest little LIFESAVING function!!
(again I dont hope anything bad on anyone) but EBOZ couldv been in trouble on that track! as well as those behind him if that oil is released in another area of that track! ( I was surprised to see no other incidents following that!)
And I'm not trying to KICK anyone here on this board, but I've seen tracks (with the "s") .. infact the October Daytona had gravel....
I know who has to be held RESPONSIBLE for that, and ..lets just say "thay wont let us racers out there with a broom" or "without a bike" ???
So next, Racers need to push, or at least mention that "hey, we may race in the rain,But thats nature?" "You know, It'd feel a bit safer if someone could get those bolders at t1 and the logs over in 5..
and then theres sand in 9.... we are trying to go thru there as fast as we can.. on "two" wheels... we're not afraid of falling, bcuz we wouldnt do it anymore, hurts tho...
and in the interest of fareness, I must admit, that in general, tracks are clean, and I'm generally pleased with CCS, It's just that a few times, I've mentioned bad spots fairly early in the weekend, and nothing happened, as if there wasnt enuff time... (rubbed me wrong) (but then again, who am I?)
I hope someone at CCS see's this and puts forth more effort to keep the tracks as clean as possible...
I'll start by saying that I am, and have always been a fan of Aaron Yates. He's down to earth and I like the way he rides. He muscles the bike, sort of like me, but waaay better. Gives me hope. And of course, you have to admit, he's fun to watch.
HOWEVER...................
What I saw today was the worse case of Unsportsmanlike Conduct that I have ever seen in ANY racing, let alone PROFESSIONAL racing. I, like everyone else here, realize the frustration and emotions involved with the race and particularly the accident.
BUT COME ON!!!! You're getting paid to represent major corporations by riding a motorcycle for a living and being the frontman. Is that the image that Suzuki and your other sponsors pay you to convey??
And now for the statements.....
I agree that Fania may be dramatizing the incident a bit. It was pretty intense and very unexpected...for us. Imagine what it was like for Fania. I don't blame him for filing charges. Personnally, I would have had a REAL hard time not throwing down with Homeboy Yates if he pulled that sh!t with me like that. Totally uncalled for.
Now for Yates statement, what's this sh!t he's shoveling about how he went through the motions of drop-kicking Fania but just didn't extend his legs...and only brushed him. Isn't that like Clinton saying that he smoked pot, but he didn't inhale?? First of all, we watched Fania fall back into the tires after receiving Yates' kick. Regardless if it really happened, the perception was there. From then on, no matter what was said between the two riders (since we obviously couldn't hear it) and the fact that Yates was the one to walk back over to Fania after they had started to walk away from each other, Yates appears to have been the aggressor of the whole off-bike incident.
Throw the book at 'em (and I am a real Yates fan :-/)
Quote9 races in the last two seasons with the outcome being determined by lappers...
No ground to stand on there, again.
Fania ain't slow...
The closing speed was fast because Yates had a faster bike, but the mid corner speed was similar, so Yates took them out because of his mistake.
Who fixes Yates bike? Who fixes Fania's?
What does Yates loose? His salary? Does the purse matter to him?
Fania gets a broken bike, less purse money, and no salary...
Do you think that the Honda road race team had a claim on Fania's forks?
Blame should be placed where it is earned...if you run into someone, you could crash...especially if you're gonna go around the outside of a rider that actually has some ground speed.
The Daytona 200 is an endurance race, a pretty lame one usually, and you always go inside a "slower rider" at the entry when ever possible. If you "scare" a slower rider, you'll both get taken out. Didn't see Fania flinch...but Yates certainly did make contact before ever getting passed Fania.
QuoteDoug also pointed out one other lil thing that I missed today.... DiSalvo swung down on Roger Lee, "weaving: to make the others check up and or break the draft.. Rog looked like he was full on the brakes... There may/might, should be some penalty for that as well... Imagine if Rog's bike would have gone down... 6, maybe 8 bikes with it, 170mph, and prolly hit the starter too... Scary thought...
Yeah, but here's the difference. Roger didn't go and punch Disalvo, push, shove, kick when he wasn't looking etc. And when Roger has intereviewed? He didn't even whine, complain, etc. Now that was class!
QuoteGuess it was a lot less than it looked like...
There wasnt a kick, it looked that way on camera, but we couldnt see his feet, just the bales....
BS again. There are TWO camera views. The second clearly shows Yates kicking and knocking Fania over. Speed cut away right before that on the replay but after consideration they showed it with Despain after the race.
QuoteKWS is a Suzuki support team...
KWS Insurance....
This wasn't a KWS bike, as in Kevin Hunt with Shawn Higbee and Danny Eslick.
Hot entry or not, stupid moves happen. I got taken out at the AHRMA races at Daytona on Tuesday...and we're talkin' two very expensive priceless bikes.
But, simple human logic dictates that you don't act like an a$$, eh? Hey, I went and pulled the bike off the guy that ran into me.
AMA Pro Racing has allowed this series to become a programs of "haves" and "have nots". It is a really exclusive club race that caters to a handful of manufacturers teams that almost have no regard for the rules that privateers read. (How logical is it that a quick shifter should be allowed on a production racing class like Supersport?)
In the 600 race, I so wanted Barnes to stick it to everyone. Do you think that during tear down they would look at the Pietro Racing entry the same as they do the new GSXR600's? Anyone who has been around racing long enough recognizes Barney's tallents...and the unevenhandedness of the AMA.
The Daytona 500 only had a handful of drivers on the lead lap, others were "lappers" that are reconized in their own right as good drivers...Nextel Cup Drivers. Why is it that during the Daytona 200 our lappers get so much flack and disrespect? Might be because the cr@ppy support from a majority of the motorcycle industry will never, ever support racing in any manner that will affect any change to actually make any Superbike race worthy of any real spectator appeal.
"Why are the stands so empty at Daytona?" Hey, the TV coverage was crap too, so why would you expect anything less.
So, until Ron and Merril call me, I guess we have to wait for things to be the same as it ever was...
QuoteIsn't that like Clinton saying that he smoked pot, but he didn't inhale??
Throw the book at 'em (and I am a real Yates fan :-/)
And if you wear a condom it wasn't sex, because there was no "intimate contact." Really, this whole thing is overblown. They were both wearing helmets and leathers, so how much could they have hurt each other, right? Sorry Yates. What you did was wrong, and you can't talk your way out of it.
I wish the replay would have shown Kevin Hanson running up in his cop leathers, shooting mace into Yates' helmet eye port, kneeling on his 'throat and cuffing his azz. That might have made "Cops!" Bad boys bad boys...
QuoteDiSalvo swung down on Roger Lee, "weaving: to make the others check up and or break the draft.. Rog looked like he was full on the brakes... There may/might, should be some penalty for that as well... Imagine if Rog's bike would have gone down... 6, maybe 8 bikes with it, 170mph, and prolly hit the starter too... Scary thought...
Ok, first, this is simple physics isn't it?
Anyone falls on a bike and the bike will follow a tangent of the radius that the cornering motorcycle was following.
So, give us a break on the whole impending doom there.
Next, Doug's broken the draft before. It's still allowed in AMA Pro racing, and you're allowed one good weave in CCS/FUSA racing yet too.
Finally, DiSalvo was in front, where a racer has the "right of way"...Yates was behind where he didn't.
As for Rog bein' on the brakes, probably...and he would have done the same to Jason had he been in the same situation. Jason was not racing to back into a parking place, but racing in an attempt to win the AMA Pro Supersport National at Daytona International Raceway.
Jack,
It was Fania who said that Aaron didnt kick him... read the link
http://venus.13x.com/roadracingworld/scripts/NewsInsert.asp?insert=8668
QuoteIn the 600 race, I so wanted Barnes to stick it to everyone. Do you think that during tear down they would look at the Pietro Racing entry the same as they do the new GSXR600's? Anyone who has been around racing long enough recognizes Barney's tallents...and the unevenhandedness of the AMA.
quote]
Me to dave even though barney is a teammate of mine. I wanted him to win to see if he would get torn down some of the factory guys came over and were looking at the bike before the race had started. Barney is a hell of a rider and very talented he can ride anything. I learned alot from him about daytona. Plus hes one of the nicest guys you will meet unlike alot of Pros.
QuoteJack,
It was Fania who said that Aaron didnt kick him... read the link
http://venus.13x.com/roadracingworld/scripts/NewsInsert.asp?insert=8668
I read that too...
Still doesn't excuse the
action of what he did. He did act in a completely unprofessional matter.
He may not have hit him hard with a kick, a flying drop kick, or a head butt...but I do believe that it still rises to the legal defenition of battery.
AND...
To me the biggest thing is that
I[/i] don't need to have anymore reasons why motorcycle racing is stupid, club like, or cr@ppy because of Aaron's actions.
Honestly, I like Aaron. Not a family of wealth. He just was fast, and he got a ride. Doesn't happen like that anymore. Rather than racers traveling in older Dodge Maxi vans, amateur road racers have Showhaulers, Toy Boxes, and tandem axle trailers.
QuoteBarney is a hell of a rider and very talented he can ride anything. I learned alot from him about daytona. Plus hes one of the nicest guys you will meet unlike alot of Pros.
Yes, he can.
Yes, he is a nice guy.
As for a lot of Pros...why is it that we assume that most of the pros are the top factory guys? In reality, they (Mladin, Bostroms, DuHammel, Yates, etc) have almost no relationship to the rest of the paddock...as do their teams. But the AMA caters to their ideas, requests, etc.
QuoteJack,
It was Fania who said that Aaron didnt kick him... read the link
http://venus.13x.com/roadracingworld/scripts/NewsInsert.asp?insert=8668
I know, I did read the link. It's hard to know what is happening when your back is turned to the guy. It's clearly shown on the tape. Yates kicked him. Yes, it turned more into a push kick, but a kick to the back nonetheless.
QuoteI know, I did read the link. It's hard to know what is happening when your back is turned to the guy. It's clearly shown on the tape. Yates kicked him. Yes, it turned more into a push kick, but a kick to the back nonetheless.
Not to mention that Fania was still off-balance when he received the kick. Plus with all of the leathers and back protection, and the fact that the crash impact was still probably tingling through his body, he just didn't feel enough of the kick impact to identify it.
But the tape is crystal....YATES KICKED HIM!!!
And how many times have you crashed, jumped up, run to safety, and then suddenly gone "Oh sh1t, I'm hurt!" What if Fania had been suffering from injuries that were compounded by Yates' attack?
OK, I've simmered for a day so here's my opinion...
The bottom line is this was a racing incident no matter who's fault it was. Dumb crashes happen. When you go on the track, you have to count on it.
BUT,
Grown men do NOT get up, and start kicking at a man who's bell was obviously rung--who could have been seriously hurt. As for Yates not putting effort into it, why did he run at him and throw his shoulder into the head butt?
I don't feel Yates owes Fania a bike. That's racing. I do think Yates owes Fania a helmet. That was not racing. That was 12 year old boy stuff. If that was my husband out there behaving like that, let alone my employee, I'd have a stroke.
Can't blame lappers--wasn't it Yates who took out Eboz at Laguna last year? Why, yes it was.
What kills me is that all of this takes the attention off Mladin who ran a flawless 200. The best rider with the best team won for sure.
Congratulations to Mladin as well as Zemke and Duhamel for a job well done!
Heather
Racing, yes.
What happened after...
Criminal. That's it, right? Battery seems to be the term. Certainly, Fania even had the right to pound him based on the rule of law for self defense. After kicks and head butts, Fania had reason to believe that the alleged perpetrator would continue to commit the act. And the tape clearly shows it.
As a racing incident, clearly, we don't have to rise to the level of criminal for sanctions from the AMA to be levied. They have the hand to do as they please, or to ignore the incident.
The punishment should be swift and certain to Yates. It must be harsh enough for his own specific deterence so that he may actually learn that it's not his own personal sand box that he's in charge of.
Additionally, the punishment should be severe enough that general deterence would be served in that no one else would want to do this.
I believe that a public appology is necessary.
I believe that he should serve a suspension from racing, at least one race. That would be an outstanding warning to moronic teams that put up with rider BS too.
He should loose his points for the event.
He should be required to dontate his Daytona money to a shelter for violence.
He should be force into anger management training.
Do you think NASCAR would have put up with it? They come down pretty hard on this kind of BS.
Dave, on top of all that, I'd look to see a fine in the neighborhood of $20-50k.
Heather, you are correct! The fracas did take attention from Mladin who (much to my chagrin) won again. What it points out is not simply that Matt ran a flawless race, but that the WHOLE PACKAGE stayed together longer than the rest.
The plan of 3 fast pit stops versus 2, to keep laptimes FAST really paid off. Hats off to the whole Mladin crew & team for an extremely well run race...
The public apology is up--to those he disappointed.
http://www.superbikeplanet.com/2004/Mar/t040308a.htm
others may view differently, but that sound half-assed and is not really a real apology. He is not admitting any wrong doing, only apologizing to the fans, and not acknoledging that he actaully did anything... I guess someone made him to say something, but couldn't quite make him say what he needs to say
Some of these letters to RRW are pretty funny...
http://venus.13x.com/roadracingworld/scripts/NewsInsert.asp?insert=8670
Dafan - I agree with you. That wasn't much of an apology.
Dawn :)
There was an episode of NYPD Blue where Sipowitz and Simone were interrogating a murder suspect. His MO was on five robberies, and the last one had left the victem dead. Witnesses had tied him to the other crimes.
The dectives told the perp that he was fingered and going down, but said that if he confessed on video tape and showed remorse, the jury would go easy on him. One by one, they got him to confess to the first four crimes, and then each time let him show remorse. Finally, they got him to confess to the murder. The detectives got up to leave, and the perp asked, "Hey, what about the part where I show remorse?" Sipowitz glared at him and said, "Go ahead. Tell them all how SORRY you are."
Funny that I should have remembered that old show as I read Yates' apology...
QuoteAnd how many times have you crashed, jumped up, run to safety, and then suddenly gone "Oh sh1t, I'm hurt!"
I don't know, but I do have a great video of you crashing and then jumping up saying "I'm OK!" ;)
For those of you caling thi a witch hunt...They just lit about 25,000 little fires under his ass.
He effed up...no doubt about it.
Who caused the crash is immaterial, if you don't wanna crash...don't race.
I don't think any outside authorities need to be involved as long as the various management folks involved DO THEIR JOB.
Suzuki stepped up....now will the AMA?
Next question....does the punishment fit the crime?
Is 25k enough?
Does Fania deserve a fine for his gestures? (Funny as they were)
QuoteI don't know, but I do have a great video of you crashing and then jumping up saying "I'm OK!" ;)
LOL!!!
I think I still have that clip saved somewhere.
Dawn ;)
QuoteWho caused the crash is immaterial, if you don't wanna crash...don't race.
I don't think any outside authorities need to be involved as long as the various management folks involved DO THEIR JOB.
Suzuki stepped up....now will the AMA?
Next question....does the punishment fit the crime?
Is 25k enough?
Does Fania deserve a fine for his gestures? (Funny as they were)
I'll agree, the cause is immaterial.
Sticks and stones though...Yates, as Rambo put it, drew first blood. At least it was childish, but in actuality, it is probably battery.
Certainly, the sactioning organization that ran the Daytona 200 has a decent history of looking the other way for certain riders. With a board made up of the leaders of manufacturers of motorcycles and other various products, when problems occur with their teams or riders, the problems are swept away.
And, for that reason, I'm in agreement with what Fania is doing.
If the organization did its job...with any kind of consistency, maybe one would just put it up to racing. But with their history...
Certainly, words and jestures will never harm Yates. I'm not sure if he had the capacity at the time to recognize the fact that most of us cheered Fania on for his response to a body blow and head butt with the universal sign for J@ck off.
I don't think that the fine needs to be much.
But a suspension of the rider...no points, no competition, no opportunity for riding bonuses, no opportunity for the riders individual sponsors to get exposure, no opportunity for Suzuki to get manufacturers points, etc...
Those sanctions have an ever lasting effect that will taint Yates. Before anyone would ever sign a rider of his caliber to a $45k to $130k contract to wear a helmet...
Hey, he wouldn't get that kind of money if he couldn't race an event or two...
Now, the question is...well, I know the answer...
CCS/FUSA wouldn't put up with that kind of BS.
There have been some riders that have been left banned from FUSA competition because of their stupid actions. I'm all for it too.
QuoteI don't know, but I do have a great video of you crashing and then jumping up saying "I'm OK!" ;)
Oh, you had to bring THAT up! Be expecting a drop kick and a head butt next time we meet! ;)
QuoteNow, the question is...well, I know the answer...
CCS/FUSA wouldn't put up with that kind of BS.
There have been some riders that have been left banned from FUSA competition because of their stupid actions. I'm all for it too.
I don't know about in FL... henry is all but set me on fire with me agreeing with Fania in the other thread. Then he roasted me for asking about the "wheelie rule" before