Can someone who's thrifty and keeps track give me some #s on season costs?
Looking for individual items total for the season, or per event.
Food,
Gas for towing vehicle
Bike parts
Etc
I'm trying to see what a full season will cost.
Assume I already have the bike and gear.
I'm thinking this for 14 weekends (including daytona:
Here's what i got so far:
Oil/Filters 300
Gas for bike and vehicle 1330
Food 1050 --- dont eat out much/at all
Spares 700
Canopy 250
Generator + warmers ---Dont have those: 1300 (honda EU2000)
Entries and gate fees: 3780
trailer (small, probably just a single rail trailer.) 350
Tires (10 sets for SV): 3400
Xtra daytona $ (room, etc) $500
Any one got some comparisions? What did I miss?
FWIW, the total so far is about 13K. I hope I can get some top 10s and get some tire $, etc, but I want to budget it all in and have it all covered.
Any of my numbers off either way? I'm pretty thrifty, and will save money where i can.
Obviously, what you want is a championship. Toss in the 3 or so races that will allow you to cover the complete GL, GP and MW seasons. Things will go really bad at least once in your summer, and by running all three regions you hedge your bets that one bad weekend won't take you out of contention in everything.
Eight championships later, my magic number for a 16 race season is 20K, and that doesn't buy as many tires as I'd like to have. Mongo was right when he said that I could just buy the trophies and save a bunch of money, but that wouldn't be as much fun...
Talk to Dawn Buxton. She keeps meticulous records, where I just keep a running total and destroy the paperwork before my wife sees it! :o
Nate:
I sent you my Excel file of racing expenses. The only thing that is not included on there is food. This is because we would be eating anyways whether it was at home or the track. The other thing to consider is our motor home gets 7 miles to the gallon, your vehicle may do better.
Dawn :)
Nate, get a nice extended length Astro Van. Won't need the trailer, gets decent mileage, and they are stone cold reliable. Keep your stuff clean and dry before it gets to the track. You can camp in it. Have the business buy it and depreciate it too. You'll have to find storage space for a trailer...in addition to maintaining and road side repair of that small of a trailer.
Buy a cheaper generator, used if you can find one. $400? Again, you can depreciate that. Same with the bike if your business buys it.
Tires, you can do two to three fronts per rear in Michein's on an SV. I can on a 600.
Entry fees are always going to go up.
Regardless, you're in the ball park.
Thanx guys! Dawn, looks like my #s were fairly close then. I appreciate the records.
Dave: I guess I feel like I would like to have power at night, so I would want the quiet generator, but now that I think of it, what would I use it for?
K3: Dunno if a championship is what I'm after. Adding 3 more weekends might be a stretch, too. But, we'll see. It's a long ways away. (Not next year, no bike, for 1) Dunno if I'll even be able to do a full season. $13K is a lotta money, especially when I have to buy a bike and transport vehicle. I would like to do a full season as many years as possible.
Good point about the Astro van, Dave. No way I'm getting an old ford van. I seem to hear lots of problems with those.
I'll have to talk to an accountant to make sure I do things properly as far as having the business buy the bike.
2-3 fronts PER rear? Or did you mean 2-3 rears per front? I'm not sure which tires I'll use. Michelins will probably be the least expensive over time, and if I have warmers, that won't be an issue for me anymore. (Save for 'stones maybe)
Also SD: What are vendor fees like? What kind of range? That may help make racing look like "Business trips" if I ever get audited.
Well, back to dreaming about having enough money to afford racing for a full season. ;D
Seriously, I appreciate the input. Would suck to think that I could do a full season only to find I was 3K short, etc.
Tack on more for Daytona--typical weekend for me runs about $500.
Daytona cost me over 2 grand (and I didn't stay at a hotel either!!)
2 grand!? :o
K.
Well, I have a dream. I was hoping to someday just be able to run a full season. Dunno if I'll have the $ to do that soon. At least I know what it'll take.
it cost me about $800 a weekend ...
but you are on the mark with your numbers.. gates fees are not there though.., $20-30 per weeknd each person......
where are you planning to race ?? should not need a generator., most tracks have power ?!?!?
I got a little 4x8 trailer from Harbor Freight for $219. The prices change all the time. Now it's $240-270.
Made it all the way to Florida from Wisconsin with no problems. And it is the only one I have seen that folds up for storage.
Get the bigger 12" wheels, and order at least one spare. The rim has an odd size center hole so you can't just go to Fleet farm and get a rim.
For either price it's a smoking deal. Put on some plywood sides and it will hold a lot of stuff.
Why do you need power at night? You may not even need much power throughout the day if you are not racing much. Last year I bought all of that stuff and hardly used it three rounds into the season.
Since you're on a budget, find someone else's pit to hang around. Secondly, lights at night in the summer attract bugs. Consider purchasing electrical for the weekend. If you split it with someone, it may only cost you $10-15/ weekend. Only MAM and parts of Gingerman didn't have electrical.
Basically find someone you know is going to be at every round, and try to partner up with them while you are at the track. Socially it will be more fun, and if you have problems, you might have someone that you can always ask for assistance.
The Gate fees are included in the Entries. Maybe I need to add more, though.
Generator: Don't wanna hassle with getting power if I can avoid it. I got power one weekend, and the plug got messed up about 3 times. If my warmers were on during that time, it wouldve been not too good. It seemed to me like it added a lot of hassle.
We'll see how the budget goes, IF i can even come close to affording a full season once I get a new SV. If there's room for a small, inexpensive generator, I'll get one. If not, I'll bum/split power.
QuoteGood point about the Astro van, Dave. No way I'm getting an old ford van. I seem to hear lots of problems with those.
Also SD: What are vendor fees like? What kind of range? That may help make racing look like "Business trips" if I ever get audited.
I pay a vendor fee of $150 at Blackhawk. I won't be selling Power Mist there anymore. It costs me more to be a vendor than I make. Doesn't make sense.
Ford Vans?
Ok, I'm on my fourth one now since 1989. I had a '79 with a 351W...put like 89k on it and traded it on my '89 in 1991 (351W). Had that one until 2000. Put 44k just doing my racing program in 1993. I sold it to a friend in 2000 with 218k miles. He has it and it has over 356k on it now. Don't know what kind of problems you'd have. Had a 1993(351W) from 2000 until 2002, then I got the big E350 superduty diesel...1996. I'm probably done for a while.
All my previous ones were E150s...no real problems. What would be considered a problem?
i'd encourage seeing an accountant too. Its a shame that all this money is spent, yet it goes unnoticed to many that some, or all, costs can be deducted for tax purposes. I just arranged what i call a "tax avoidance" scheme that is expected to save me nearly 25% of all costs incurred during a race season. Of course, to many, spending a dollar to save 25 cents makes little sense. But since these costs are going to be incurred nonetheless, i'd consider doing what i have and consult an accountant about your options. There are risks in doing what i have, but i have properly assessed them and am willing to roll the dice anyways. In the end, the biz i created has little oppy to ever show a profit, but its my intent to produce income in the form of local biz contributions and perhaps more. I run the riskthat, after several yrs of losses, the scheme is shut down and labeled as nothing more than a "hobby loss". And by the way, i just finished creating an excel doc of my own, and $13K was about what i spent since competing in my first event in Apr. Competed at every event since then, normally 4 races each. But not included in my tab is the cost of a wreck, and since i escaped the entire season w/out incident, i fear i'm do for a big nasty. Please know that there are hidden costs that even the most experienced of racer often overlooks. I sure did, yet i'm hardly an experienced racer. Best of luck.
PS. I am not a tax expert nor do i condone doing something w/out knowing all the risks first. Please consult an expert for advice. Many would be willing to provide such advice at no cost.
Well, we did 23 events in 03' this is ruff but its close to what was spent.
Each Weekend
$200 fuel for f250 and gen.
$50 fuel for 2 aprilias (we would prob use more if there were actualy practice sessions)
$75 food for 3 for 2.5 days
$250 set of tires
$85-$200 entry fees
$650+-
QuoteTack on more for Daytona--typical weekend for me runs about $500.
Daytona cost me over 2 grand (and I didn't stay at a hotel either!!)
Daytona costed me 2k + too. And hotel was only $300. Don't ask what, but money just flew out of my pocket. and only used 2 sets of tires.
I'll simplify it for you, Nate.
YOU'LL SPEND EVERYTHING IN YOUR WALLET AND THEN SOME!!!!
But racing is oh so much fine. I'm enjoying my crack addiction.
I've got a good set of used tire warmers if you're interested.
Whose this Knup guy, anyway.
Shhhhh, don't tell anyone. I'm on Knuppies computer before we fly to Vegas tommorrow. Anybody know of any good porn sites I could leave behind as bookmarks for Deb when she gets on the computer?
Kevin Hanson
Safety First Racing
I would answer that last question but I never did read what I agreed to to join and I wouldn't want to get kicked off.
Jeff
pinkworld
Thanx for the info, guys!
Dave: seen some blowing main seals at 80K. My grandfather had an early 80s E150, IIRC, (Dunno exacts on it right now) and it was problems from day 1. He put 80,000 miles on the thing, and tons of problems. Replacing body sides in sheets at least 3 times, getting stuck a lot, etc. And he's got a pretty good idea of how to maintain a vehicle.
Known of some others with problems, etc. Seems like they tend to rust a lot more than some of the other vans.
Seems like the chevy vans are just more reliable compared to the fords when they get old, from what I've seen. But, thats' based only on what I've seen, which isnt everyone. And I will be doing much more research before I decide against anything when I get to the buying a vehicle point in time. Is there going to be any disadvantage to driving a van day to day compared to a truck?
I already have my business going, so it's just a matter of properly accounting for certain expenses so they can be deducted. Just need to confirm that I'm doing it correctly, and legally safely.
QuoteWhose this Knup guy, anyway.
Shhhhh, don't tell anyone. I'm on Knuppies computer before we fly to Vegas tommorrow. Anybody know of any good porn sites I could leave behind as bookmarks for Deb when she gets on the computer?
Kevin Hanson
Safety First Racing
Hmmm, we were talking one time and I though I could have a bigger racing budget with my own site...
I came up with a name and isn't that the most impotant...
BigLandingStrips.com
Nate, never had a main seal go out on my Fords, and the 351W has been around for a long, long time.
With extraordinary age, there are things that do happen. Valve covers can leak. On van's, the right side cover is really hard to get at with FI engines.
Oil pans can deteriorate, and then they weep a bit when you shut off the engine. You can spend a lot of $$ replacing the gaskets, but really the oil pans need to be replaced. $$ too, but it will probably stop the problem. Really, it's cheaper to just put the little bit of oil in it that it needs.
Rust? I think that in the late 80's, Ford started galvanizing the truck bodies. My '89 still doesn't have rust on it...and it never was rust proofed or undercoated.
Half ton vans can wear out axles. Usually at 120 to 150k. There is a bearing kit you can use to keep from replacing the axles, but it's a waste of time. Replace the axles. I think this only happens on E150's that get hard use. My 1993 had 185k on it when Mike Riebe bought mine, and it didn't leak.
Early electronic overdrive transmissions can be suspect. Afterthat, I don't think it's a problem.
Chevy? My experience was an early 90's work truck that we used at a golf car place that I worked at when I moved to Wisconsin. Three motors in 90k. Stupid. All vehicles can $uck, I think. Most full size vans have one potential problem....the V8's in them are good motors, but because of emission stuff, they are low compression motors. So, they are thermally inefficient. Not as good of gas mileage as you would expect, but they should last for nearly forever.
Astro Vans...hey, I'm not a Chevy fan, but those things are good. Mileage should be at 20 or so. When I was working with Dale Quarterley, he was running his RC30 around in one, and occasionally he'd pull a 14foot tandem axle trailer with it.
My costs & my sponsors costs in 2002 were in the $20k range.
In 2003, I bought a new bike and new trailer, so with prep of both, I was at that before I even hit the track. 03 was at LEAST $30k.
Again, this factors in ALL costs. Such as travel, food, gate, etc.
A weekend averages $2k for me... I'd hate to see what it runs someone who is on a #1,2,or 3 bike...
Here was my write up of 02 when I ran a FULL season.
Consumables & interesting facts of 2002:
Miles traveled 6770
Vacation days used 17
Laps Ridden 1675
Bike miles 4187
Gallons of Race Gas 232
Tires 17
Gallons of Silkolene Racelube 8
Pints of Silkolene ProRace 2000 Brake Fluid 1
EBC HH-KIT Brake Pads 8
Transmissions 1
Clutches 1
Clutch Covers 1
Windscreens 3
Clutch Levers 2
Brake Levers 3
Clip-on Handlebar tubes 6
Gas tanks 1
Rearsets 2
16 oz bottles of water 432
Hospital visits 2
Races Planned 37
Races Entered 39
Team Challenges 1
Races Run 36
Crashes (race & practice) 3
DNF races (did not finish) 2
DNS races (did not start) 3
Top 10 finishes 28
Podium Finishes 4
Trophies 13
You forgot to list your take home purse.
QuoteYou forgot to list your take home purse.
I bought my purse at a garage sale for $.15, so I didn't include it. It's a lovely mauve color which goes well with my undergarments. 8)
My take for the year was around $500...
QuoteTack on more for Daytona--typical weekend for me runs about $500.
Daytona cost me over 2 grand (and I didn't stay at a hotel either!!)
2 grand..wish i spent only that much. I only entered 2 races but between hammer school, running team challenge by myself for track time, 4 nights at a hotel...$3,500 roundabout... :( (no, the borrowed bike never hit the ground)
racing on high banks.. priceless :)