I read thru the thread on here on the upgrades, but I do not see why, especially now with transponders that CCS does not implement qualifying for the AM races, mid SS in particular.
I did track days for a couple of years, turned under 1:30 at Summit thought I was fast. Race school, grid....in over my head. crash, crash, crash. I am now 4 seconds slower than when I started this season and have not raced sense my injuries have healed.
Like was said previously - there is more discrepancy in an AM race than a track day. That is not safe for anyone. I know some of my friends have told me to get back out there and no amount of track days or schools can give you grid experience....but if a rider cannot turn a basic race time (under 1:30 at summit/1:50 at VIR or something) on a 600 then I do not think they should be out there.
You know who this hurts most of all? ME!!!! I am on the bubble but for my safety and other riders I am spending mucho dinero in schools and at TD's trying to get my riding together. Then, and only then will truly believe I belong on the grid.
Going to a race school and getting a license only proves that you can go a day without crashing.
Do not get me wrong, I enjoyed every second of being on the grid, being dusted by Hector, thumbing up to the cornerworkers when I made the final lap; but I think qualifying would be a good thing for all concerned.
If you do not qualify have a non qualifying race for those that did not make the cut. At least it would be more competitive (and more fun) for people like me.
Qualifying would be great, but not always practical. However, everybody that is deemed a "safe" rider, fast or slow, should be allowed to race. This is club racing, not the AMA. We often enter turns going 25-35 mph (at least) faster than the slow guys in out LW classes, does that mean they shouldn't be out there? It's just a tough situation that will probably never change. If an AM thinks that the backmarkers are too slow, let them turn expert.
then to refine the idea,for a rider to get out of the beginner class, they must finish 4 weekends PLUS able to turn a average time of within 110-115% of the winning amateur time in the given displacement class. So for a 600 that would be about 1:26-1:30 and VIR would be 1:47 - 1:51. And if we eliminate the fastest AMs to expert, it would be even safer, as lapping would not even happen at VIR in a sprint race.
As for classes. I think there should be a sportsman class, a LW, a MW and HW class for beginners. You can race one class up for a total of 2 races a weekend for the first 4 weekends. That way its easier on the racers, equipment, and keep the speed difference to a minimal.
The beginner class should be just for learning. not for a championship, for race wins, for points. So people will focus on racing basics without the pressure to win real stuff. Thats safer for them and others. If a fast beginner have to race 4 weekends as a beginner no matter what, he will be focused on riding well instead of trying win and collect points toward a championship.
WERA have PN's only they don't seperate the races. We should have the PN's run seperate races to get their feet wet and up to speed. Most of them don't race more than a couple classes a weekend anyway. Without getting spooked by fast AM's and always finishing toward the back(how would they know, or able to register early for a grid spot up front) they may enjoy it more and come back more.
AM classes can stay the same, but EX classes should more mimick the Formula USA classes, maybe with 2 classes per displacement category, and run qualifying just like Nationals do, now that we have the technology. It would be more fun for the experts, and more rewards. And for guys that runs nationals, it would be the same format, I would definitely enjoy it more.
What do you guys think? Maybe I can put it in words with Dave's help and see if we get anywhere with this.
Or how's about this?
(Now this is just a thought, so don't jump all over me...)
But what if we were to separate the classes, not by experience, but by laptimes?
I'll talk about BHF since that's the track I'm the most familiar with. The fast experts at BHF are averaging low 1:13s, high 1:12s, with an occasional 1:11 thrown in (excluding dates when Denning shows up...) There are also experts that are still stuck in the 1:20s.
Amateurs have damn near the same spread. The fast Am's are turning consistent low-mid 1:13s. Slow Ams haven't even cracked 1:20s yet, still running low 1:30s or worse.
So what if we do this? Have two classes: A "fast" class and a "slow" class. They already take lap times in practice, so let's do something with them. Perhaps make the 2nd round of practice a "qualifying" session. Your fastest lap determines whether you're in the "fast" group or the "slow" group.
To keep guys from cherrypicking, and purposely going slow in qualifying to stay in the "slow" group, we'd also look at things like finishes and race lap times, to determine if the person really is scamming.
I would also agree with doing an in-between, "medium-fast" group, to separate out those who are running high teens and low 20s, from those who are running high 20s and above. We can do it, there's plenty of time, if we eliminate half of these classes we have. What's the difference between Middleweight Supersport and Middleweight Sportbike? A few minor rules? Why not just incorporate the $$ payout and weight limit with SS? And what about all those other funky classes? Thunderbike, LW Sportsman, etc?
I bet we can clean things up a LOT if we were to just stick to 8 basic classes:
LWSS/SB
MWSS/SB
HWSS/SB
ULSS/SB
Figure with 8 classes, that would leave plenty of time to either A) have more practice, B) run qualifying sessions, C) have in-between, "junior" classes, or D) make every weekend a twin-sprint or double heat event. Or, have several of the above.
In fact, we could almost just combine UL and HW, since the 750s are being phased out, and most guys are going to 1000s. Or have a HWSS which would be a supersport, unlimited CC, and then do a ULSB which would be an unlimited mods, unlimited cc. That knocks it down to 6 classes for a weekend. I don't understand why we create classes for bikes... I would think that it should be the other way around - buy a bike that is competitive in the class. Don't show up at the track with an '89 Hurricane and expect there to be a class for it, ya know?
Just my opinion...
Quoteand no amount of track days or schools can give you grid experience....
Super Dave's VRS school
One full session of race starts with grid and all. It was INVALUABLE TO ME. !!
cheap plug hehe.
QuoteI bet we can clean things up a LOT if we were to just stick to 8 basic classes:
LWSS/SB
MWSS/SB
HWSS/SB
ULSS/SB
Okay...I'm not legal for ANY of those classes. Only GT and GP classes, and Supertwins. Where do the purpose built race bikes race then?
QuoteSo what if we do this? Have two classes: A "fast" class and a "slow" class.
Speedway racing has something like this.
A, B and C riders. A being the fastest and C being the newest. I dont know how they classify the groups beyond that.
WERA has the PN guys, but they run in the same races. Only difference is they get gridded last i believe. I think its 2 weekends before thier considered novices.
Or we could stop racing on these rinky dink race tracks that are barely wide enough for a car and only race on brand new pristene 45' wide tracks like Barber. Oh wait, there were still a lot of crashes there too !!
GRidding by qualifing is good, but u will still end up with lappers.
CCS allready runs a hectic schedule adding seperate races wont help.
Keep the ideas coming tho. Maybe we can convince CCS to try gridding by times for next year. They run FUSA that way dont they ?
Whoa!
I am NOT saying gridding by times per se. WERA's grids by points are even more miserable than anything. Do not do that! Once you are in the back you are stuck in the back. You have to make crazy amounts of passes so you can get points for decent next race grid spot.
In CCS AM if you can run a 28 at Summit and get a good grid spot and decent start you are solid. If you can run a 26 and a bad spot you are screwed.
I doubt there is enough time or man power for CCS to realistically set grids up by times, based on practice session times (or a qualifying session). I think that you limit the qualifying to a 15 minutes session for first year racers only or something during the AM practice. They have to qualify at each track, all year. If they are not meeting the times (say you base it 110-115% of the median time - not average, but the actual guy who ends up in the middle of the pack) by the end of their first season they will be qualifying again for those tracks.
That eliminates the silly-o Hectors running 1:02s at VIR or whatever and sub 1 minute at Summit from messing up the curve as much.
QuoteI would also agree with doing an in-between, "medium-fast" group, to separate out those who are running high teens and low 20s, from those who are running high 20s and above.
I don't understand why we create classes for bikes... I would think that it should be the other way around - buy a bike that is competitive in the class. Don't show up at the track with an '89 Hurricane and expect there to be a class for it, ya know?
Just my opinion...
First point, that would be me. I want to go faster. I am getting faster. But it's slow going. I shouldn't be an amateur any more, but I kinda get in the way of the fast experts. I'd love a middle ground class. It would inspire me to go faster and win, therefore "graduating" me into the fastest group.
Second point. Not everyone can afford a new bike. Do you throw away your new bike next year when it isn't new any more and there's nowhere to competitively race it? How about the 2-stroke and thumper guys? Should we tell them to leave? You have some
GREAT ideas, but they still need a bit of polish to be solutions. Let's keep this dialog rolling. This topic is relevant and interesting.
QuoteOkay...I'm not legal for ANY of those classes. Only GT and GP classes, and Supertwins. Where do the purpose built race bikes race then?
Ditto.. as soon as I get my 125.
Plus... let's all remember here guys... this is CLUB racing, it's supposed to be a chance to let everyone race, no matter what you're running.. Hell.. if you (including me) complain that the traveling to the tracks is far.. well what if you had to travel that same distance, but only for like 1 or 2 races... FUCH that. I'm not gonna drive 10 hours to barber for 1 or 2 race... that's almost a waste.
I think we should NOT ditch any of the classes that we currently run. (at least not the ones I run in :) )
QuoteSecond point. Not everyone can afford a new bike. Do you throw away your new bike next year when it isn't new any more and there's nowhere to competitively race it? How about the 2-stroke and thumper guys? Should we tell them to leave? You have some GREAT ideas, but they still need a bit of polish to be solutions. Let's keep this dialog rolling. This topic is relevant and interesting.
Uy. Ok now to be careful about wording my response, as I know there are some sensitive people here.
Here is where I'm coming from: Local-level AMA motocross has a similar structure to what someone mentioned above - they have A B and C classes, based on speed/ability. You have 2 classes for each level - 125 and 250. Obviously, the guy that strolls out there on a 1988 CR125 isn't going to do as well as the guy who just bought a 2004 CR125. He just doesn't have the technology to keep up. Do they create a new, special class, so that a handful of guys who can't afford brand new bikes can also have a chance at winning? No. Well, sort of. They have a "vintage" class - which is pretty much an "anything goes so long as it's old" class. Which means you've got guys racing antique Bultacos right next to mid-80s 500cc MX bikes, all in the same race. Could we do something like that for CCS and roadracing? Sure, why not. But my point is - the guys that wanted to win, and really wanted to do well, eventually had to step up and buy a new machine to do it. I was in that boat when I used to race MX - I had an older bike, couldn't really afford to get a new bike. I had to make do with what I had - and did fairly well on it. I eventually reached a point where I figured I should either buy a new bike, or quit. Racing at the time wasn't important enough for me to blow $6k on a new dirt bike, so I relegated myself to doing track days, etc.
I figure it like this: racing, in general, isn't cheap. Motorcycle roadracing is one of the most expensive forms of motorcycle racing. The equipment, entry fees, maintenance, etc. You know this coming into it. If you want to come out, and win, then it's going to cost money. If you want to come out, win, but do it on a mint-condition 1988 Hurricane 600, it's not going to happen. If you can't afford to buy a newer bike, then all that means is that you can't afford to race at the level you want to race at. Plain and simple.
Does that mean that guys on the thumpers, 2-strokes, and what not should be turned away? Not at all. Just be aware that your 1982 Ducati twin isn't going to be able to hang all that well with my GSX-R750. If you want to be competitive, you'll have to step up and get some updated machinery.
QuoteDitto.. as soon as I get my 125.
Plus... let's all remember here guys... this is CLUB racing, it's supposed to be a chance to let everyone race, no matter what you're running.. Hell.. if you (including me) complain that the traveling to the tracks is far.. well what if you had to travel that same distance, but only for like 1 or 2 races... FUCH that. I'm not gonna drive 10 hours to barber for 1 or 2 race... that's almost a waste.
I think we should NOT ditch any of the classes that we currently run. (at least not the ones I run in :) )
I guess I should also state that I would then expect the existing LW/MW/HW classes rules to be expanded slightly, such that we didn't totally exclude a range of bikes. Base it more or less on cc's or something.
I'm not trying to say that I want certain bikes banned or anything - just cut down on the # of classes. Stop with all of these specialized classes where only a handful of bikes qualify or even enter. Just eliminate the class altogether and stick 'em in another class.
QuoteI guess I should also state that I would then expect the existing LW/MW/HW classes rules to be expanded slightly, such that we didn't totally exclude a range of bikes. Base it more or less on cc's or something.
I'm not trying to say that I want certain bikes banned or anything - just cut down on the # of classes. Stop with all of these specialized classes where only a handful of bikes qualify or even enter. Just eliminate the class altogether and stick 'em in another class.
A'ight, as long as we don't skimp out the LW classes, that's cool :P
I am not sure qualifying times from practice is a good idea. Practice can be crazy enough without people trying to get in a fast lap.
1) separate by times only??? ok.. watch this. You wanna win an AM championship so you pad your qualifying lap times a few seconds each qualifying session to make sure you stay AM in fear of being bumped.
2) as many pointed out, this is club racing. We dont get TV coverage. Hey, i just wanted a step up from a local track day! And if i can win a few races.. COOL! I deserve it for my 1st year as a racer. Ill have my butt handed to me next year but for NOW.. i wanna make like the sun and SHINE!! :)
My $0.02,
I think CCS, WERA, etc. are generally in a no win situation. Any changes are sure to pi$$ somebody off.
For instance, to have more classifications of RIDERS, they would have to eliminate some classifications of BIKES. And, of course the reverse is true. Either way, about half of the riders are gonna howl.
I do not think the organizers have enough manpower or time to grid the races on the day of the race. Besides, I have been to a lot of races, therefore a lot of race practice sessions, and have seen a lot of stupid things. I cannot even imagine the carnage if practice times were used for gridding. Scary! :o
So, CCS and WERA probably have to use a pre-set grid, just to be able to handle so many races. CCS uses entry date, WERA uses points. Neither is perfect.
As for the speed differences, just a fact of life at just about every level except MotoGP and WSB. Besides, I wonder what percentage of multi-bike crashes are because of slow riders getting in the way, or fast riders dicing with other fast riders.
I am still a new racer this year. Yes I have gone pretty fast and have pretty much run up front all year. However, I can't wait to get into the Expert ranks, cuz I feel that following the faster riders will make me that much faster. I owe a lot of my speed this year to Michael Mills and Scuba Steve. They are going fast, and I ride that much harder to stay with them. They have more track time than I do, so I basically have to be able to watch and learn some from guys like that to improve myself, etc. etc. If you keep some Amateurs out of the expert class because of lap times, how do you expect the old theory of "riding with faster riders makes you go faster" to take effect?
The thing that keeps coming up in my mind is that the AMA pro's have the same issues that we do. Think about the 200 at Daytona. Any 'qualified' expert with a GSXR 1000 can go out and get gridded in the field. Most of the guys do not complete all 57 laps. Many guys struggle to break the 2:00 mark during the race. And these are fast guys! Guys that are quick at the various local tracks around the country. Every year, Maladin or DuHamel or whoever, has a few near misses passing the privateers, Especially late in the race.
We have these same issues to deal with as Amateurs, albeit on a much lower level. Does a rank amateur/newbie have the same skills as a pro trying to race with the big dogs at Daytona? Hell no, but how does one get experience? How do you gain confidence to hold your line and not freak out when being passed or passing? By doing it. Just like anything in life. I think it just makes all of us better riders.
In mountain biking (another love of mine) people will move big rocks or logs off of the trail simply because they can't clear the obsticles easily. This makes the trails less enjoyable for those riders that do have the skills to jump or ride over such impediments. How will a rider (of any kind) get any better if we simply remove the challanging parts.
It reminds me of the crap that is happening in youth soccer leagues where they don't keep score and both teams are winners. BS.
Want to gain confidence riding a racing bike? Buy a cheap dirtbike and take it out for a weekend. Try feet up powerslides until you can't stand crashing anymore! Learn front braking technique where in the dirt the wheel will plow easily. Steer with the rear tire spitting up roost. Big fun and great excersise. And your bike skills will soar, not to mention your confidence. Spend a grand on a bike and some good gear and have fun.
My 2 cents, I will sit down now. Thank-you.
QuoteI am not sure qualifying times from practice is a good idea. Practice can be crazy enough without people trying to get in a fast lap.
We've discussed this before. With the all-skate practices CCS runs, qualifying times taken from them would make practice even more dangerous than the races. Better to look at the times a guy is turning in his races, and asign him from there.
Of course the record keeping required to do this would probably be beyond the skeleton crew that CCS is allowed by Clearchannel. Look at the points...
Just wondering where everyone thinks the extra time needed to run a third class or qualifying sessions will come from. Are we going to get two 5 minute practice sessions in the morning, 15 minute endurance races and 4 lap sprint races?
Dealing with slower, inconsistant riders is part of being an amateur. If you don't like it, that is your motivation to move to expert. The fast amateurs should quit sandbagging and move up to expert class. I am pretty sure you can petition CCS and even make the move mid-season.
Another hurdle for qualifying set by practice lap times is the fact that many people race multiple bikes on a given weekend using the same transponder. I doubt that CCS is in position to provide a transponder for every single bike to take the track, therefore, the possibility (probability) exists that someone is going to take their Superbike out to qualify for a Supersport race. Even worse, take their Heavyweight bike out to qualify for a Middleweight race. Considering how many people I know that use Superbikes in Supersport races already, this is not a stretch of the imagination.
Seems like there are a couple different conversations that are getting intermingled here.
IF we were to eliminate half the classes, then we would easily have enough time to get an extra practice session in the morning, and call it "qualifying". Everybody gets 2 hot laps or something.
As for someone using their SB to qualify for SS - well I'm not talking about qualifying for grids. I was just thinking of holding qualifying to differentiate between "slow" and "fast" groups. And really, we could probably even break it down to those who have already once qualified for the "fast" group - will remain in the fast group.
QuoteSeems like there are a couple different conversations that are getting intermingled here.
IF we were to eliminate half the classes, then we would easily have enough time to get an extra practice session in the morning, and call it "qualifying". Everybody gets 2 hot laps or something.
As for someone using their SB to qualify for SS - well I'm not talking about qualifying for grids. I was just thinking of holding qualifying to differentiate between "slow" and "fast" groups. And really, we could probably even break it down to those who have already once qualified for the "fast" group - will remain in the fast group.
There you go again... wanting to get rid of the LW class... sheesh.. can't we 'little bike' guys get a break? Just because we're not on the 'big bikes' doesn't mean we don't count.
:P :) :D
I'm puzzling over all this. Maybe rather thsn jumping in the middle of the 600 Am. Riding some of the Sportsman classes would be a better idea. A competitive bike is relavtively inexpensive and there's a good mix of slow and fast riders, just not 40 of them.
ROB!!.
How'd you do at Jennings?
QuoteThere you go again... wanting to get rid of the LW class... sheesh.. can't we 'little bike' guys get a break? Just because we're not on the 'big bikes' doesn't mean we don't count.
:P :) :D
DOWN with the LWs! Just look at 'em. They're so... so... lightweight. I mean, c'mon. Won't you hate them with me? They're not REAL machines.
I'm going to organize an anti-LW march.
JOIN THE HEAVYWEIGHT NATION!!! HEAVYWEIGHT POWER!!!!
;) ;) ;D
1st of all, we should stop all these crazy little bikes from being able to race. what is this anyway? racing? get off the stupid mopeds, stop being afraid of speed. (it is racing isn't it?) get a real bike. does miguel duhamel race an RS250? hell no. then, give all the track time to the REAL racers out there.
second of all, there's not enough time to quantify who belongs, and who doesn't. if you got a license, you belong. besides, if you can't pass someone who is ten+ seconds off the pace, the problem lies with you.
Like it was said..this is club racing. When you do away with the LW classes...30% of the bikes are eliminated! I run LWGP, Thunderbike, Supertwins and yes... F40. I do it with the Buell. It was bad enough that NRRS did away with the Buell Lightning series. That was a timed qualifying event and it went to nowhere land. And even tho there was qualifying in that event...they let everyone run even when they didnt qualify. I know.. I was one of them! By making amatueres qualify, it cuts down on the number or races and classes you are able to run. AND it takes too much time at the club level. We would have to add a Friday in the schedule just to get everyone timed for the weekend and I, like most othere have a full time job that runs M-F. Were not in CCS to make money or fame....were here to race on the weekends, enjoy the company of fellow racers, and most of all...just have a fun weekend! Mark Bernard "Kegels" am #391
Quote1st of all, we should stop all these crazy little bikes from being able to race. what is this anyway? racing? get off the stupid mopeds, stop being afraid of speed. (it is racing isn't it?) get a real bike. does miguel duhamel race an RS250? hell no. then, give all the track time to the REAL racers out there...
pppfffftt.. whatever fruitcake.
Don't be jealous of me just because I know how to race a real bike around and know what 'corner speed' really is.
At least I don't need a big bike to go fast around the track. :P
Miguel, pffftt, whatever, Hopkins did, Kcraget did, Nikky did, Rossi did.... etc..
I think we should get rid of all the SVs.. THOSE aren't fair in the LW class ;)
QuoteI think we should get rid of all the SVs.. THOSE aren't fair in the LW class ;)
Right on!
Quotepppfffftt.. whatever fruitcake.
Don't be jealous of me just because I know how to race a real bike around and know what 'corner speed' really is.
At least I don't need a big bike to go fast around the track. :P
Miguel, pffftt, whatever, Hopkins did, Kcraget did, Nikky did, Rossi did.... etc..
it is just tooooooooo easy to get you clowns. what, with your "cornerspeed" argument and all that. ;)
never been passed by an RS on my 600, or R1. so your fabulous "cornerspeed" don't mean nuttin'.
tool. ;D
Maybe that's because you only went to one race weekend this year, and that was Daytona. ;) :D
J/K.
what's that got to do with anything?
done a few trackdays, and an RS250 still has never passed. me. that whole cornerspeed argument is stupid. if so, moto gp would all be RS250's . (since that horsepower crap is over rated)
little bikes suck. get them of the track, it's racing you know. (cept for SV's, they are cool in a cute puppy sort of way)
What are we talking about here? Honda RS250 or Aprilia Cup bikes because Aprilia Cup bikes are kinda gay. ;)
QuoteWhat are we talking about here? Honda RS250 or Aprilia Cup bikes because Aprilia Cup bikes are kinda gay. ;)
the aprillia, and anything else like it. ;D
Quotethe aprillia, and anything else like it. ;D
eh? What do you mean anything else like it? >:(
Quote.... never been passed by an RS on my 600, or R1. so your fabulous "cornerspeed" don't mean nuttin'.
tool. ;D
- That's b/c you've never ridden on the track with ME ;D
QuoteWhat are we talking about here? Honda RS250 or Aprilia Cup bikes because Aprilia Cup bikes are kinda gay. ;)
They might gay, but they can beat SOME SVs.. which are gayer.
;D
Quote- That's b/c you've never ridden on the track with ME ;D
i'll be looking for you at the ROC. be sure to enter unlimimted GP. ;)
ROC, whatever. There's too much straight on that puppy. Gives you an advantage to catch up, and pass me after the infield, with that HP of your's
QuoteROC, whatever. There's too much straight on that puppy. Gives you an advantage to catch up, and pass me after the infield, with that HP of your's
funny ;D
alright, vir in two weeks then. ;)
Micheal!
We were loaded and ready for Jennings but bailed at the last minute. Then I find out it didn't even rain.
Oh well, See ya at VIR.
Watch out for the evil twins!!
I wanna race Brad at Jennings! ;D
bring it woman! :D
how's about daytona? cause if my ass goes all the way to fla. it ain't for jennings. roebling maybe, but not jennings.
funny MY A S S is interpreted as (i disagree).
what a load of SPOOOOOOOP!!
Hey MIghtyDuy, you ain't gotta chance against DOC. (anywhere)
And by the way DOC... if it wasnt for your horsepower on the R1 at VIR a few weeks ago I would have passed you in a few corners ON MY SV. :o ;D
In case you didn't know,,, that was before my exhaust can blew in half :-/
Quotealright, vir in two weeks then. ;)
A'ight.. I'll be there. Although I have to take it easy on the bike, b/c I'm selling it afterwards ;)
No Way?????????
You moving over to the darkside???
No, no, no... never!
I'm getting a 125
Moving to the LIGHTside. :D
great, an even wimpier bike. ::)
he he
QuoteHey MIghtyDuy, you ain't gotta chance against DOC. (anywhere)
And by the way DOC... if it wasnt for your horsepower on the R1 at VIR a few weeks ago I would have passed you in a few corners ON MY SV. :o ;D
In case you didn't know,,, that was before my exhaust can blew in half :-/
that's what you get for even trying to hang wid me big dog.
go go gadget exhaust missle. ;D
If I had three times the horsepower would i be three times as fast?
doubt it.
i have net yet reached my best R6 times with my R1.
having a blast riding it though.
Y A M A H A F U G G I N R U L E S!!!!
yes sir, they do.
come on 04 R1!!!!
Quoteyes sir, they do.
come on 04 R1!!!!
What?.. you need MORE horsepower?
Maybe you should learn some racing technique first. :P
mikey, i've won more than my share of races. i think i can get by. ;)
how many you won yet? :P
Well... I won my very first race ever, and I won LWGP a couple weeks ago.
So 2.
:P
So anyways... whatcha doin' wit' dem purty guitaarrs you're buying.
You just collect em or you actually play?
i play them all.
you play mikey?
yup... well, at least used to.
Used to be in a band back in H.S. and in ECU.
Then got into the real world and sold all my equip for food :)
Had a black Les stndrd, mosvalve, 2 fender cabs, wireless, MP1, quadraverb, the works.
Kinda wish I didn't sell it now.
All I got left is my tob. sunbust Gibson acoustic (given to me by an ex. that didn't know what it was (or how much it was worth) :)) and some other guitar I swiped from another girl 'friend'.
that's why i dated strippers in my band days. steady income, and they LOVE to buy stuff. ;D
I had a Cherry Gibson ES335 and Fender Twin Reverb Amp but they got stolen out of my trailer home along with my orange windbreaker when I was in College. The mofos even ate my cheese danish in the refridgerator.
wouldn't you have loved to catch them eating your danish?
i'd kill the basTards!!