Well, as everyone on this board knows by now, I am upset that Clear Channel Entertainment is making the loyal CCS riders purchase the F-USA license just to run in the same classes that they have the entire season just because it is a F-USA event. The increase in entry fee I can possibly justify due to the extended race time and qualifying, but.... the requirement of an additional license was the straw that broke the camels back. As stated in an ealier post, it's just like blackmail - you want the points for that class you better pony up the extra bucks.
We are voting with our $$$ and ask you to consider doing the same. We will not purchase a F-USA license an we will not be running Thuderbike at the MAM event. Take note those who run Unlimited GP or Sportbike, you will have to buy the special F-USA license if you want the CCS points for that event.
My theory behind this rule change is this. Due to the difficulty Clear Channel had retaining and recruting sponsors for the F-USA series, they had to find a way to boost thier numbers to share with the sponsors. One way to show a boost in numbers is an increase in licensed riders. Clear Channel knew they would be assured of the increase in licensed F-USA riders is by making this rule change. Pretty smart on Clear Channels part, but it really sucks on the CCS riders end.
So - vote with your $$$ and don't get the license and don't race the class.
My $0.02
Dawn
Think about what you just said Dawn. I am not taking any sides here, either. You are obviously angry that they are basically forcing the FUSA license down your throat to help promote the series. However, the extra license fee is a way for you to help support the giant company that makes our races possible. You said it yourself, they are trying to boost their numbers and retain or gain sponsors. Our sport is desparate for sponsors, so if you can help cheat a bit by getting a license and appearing to be at all of the events when only actually racing in one, then what is so wrong with that? I definitely understand the money factor (I ride a Duc, remember...lol), but I just want you to take a step back and think about what you are asking. You are asking riders to skip a race in order to damage Clear Channel's chances of gaining new sponsorship. Once again, good or bad, they are the reason we have races to attend. Just my very humble opinion, and I also agree that the way they went about it sucks. Tough situation, that's all. Yuck.
Yep - good point.
However Clear Channel puts more focus on F-USA (a money pit, that's why they race at the CCS events) in regards to sponsors and promotions. They also put more focus on the motor cross events. CCS seems to be treated like a bastard child in the grand scheme of things.
Check out this link - www.clearchannel.com
We were here to fit a nitch market, they really don't give a hoot about us.
Dawn
Point taken, and I'm not a huge Clear Channel fan, but they do (unfortunately) foot the bill at the events that lose money. Like I said...yuck. :( On a positive note on the FUSA series...I look at that series as the next step for me after turning expert on my hopefully eventual road to the AMA. Nice to have something like that where a good rider that is maybe an up and comer can get some national exposure...now if they could just get some TV coverage....... :)
I hate Clear Channel for totally different reasons. They own most of the pop radio stations in the country and alot of the billboards too. If you think not buying their license will put a scratch in their wallet maybe you should look at their stock (CCU). If you really want to hurt them, race with another org and write your Congressman about the bill Congress is currently considering about re-regulating broadcasting.
Ps. I know that was bitter but I'm really not a prick ;D
QuotePoint taken, and I'm not a huge Clear Channel fan, but they do (unfortunately) foot the bill at the events that lose money. Like I said...yuck.
How do you suppose that they loose money at race events??? If you do the math, it is not very easy to loose money on a race weekend...
By the way, on the license issues - it sucks to have to pay extra for a "regional" event run at FUSA weekend, but if you are chasing a championship and need the points, you would pay the extra $50. Heck, I am going to drive to Alabama for a MID-ATLANTIC event.... go figure. Oh and its twin sprints, twice the entry fees than just a double points weekend.
QuoteBy the way, on the license issues - it sucks to have to pay extra for a "regional" event run at FUSA weekend, but if you are chasing a championship and need the points, you would pay the extra $50.
Exactly my point.... Clear Channel knows that anyone who is chasing a championship will pay the additional $50.00 and pay the higher entry fees just to obtain the points in a class that the run all year. It's blackmail.
Dawn
QuoteHow do you suppose that they loose money at race events??? If you do the math, it is not very easy to loose money on a race weekend...
Wow, how do you figure that?
Weekend track rental at about $10k per day, insurance (which they do have a good deal on because of their world wide promotions), expenses for food lodging, etc for the staff, cornerworkers, credit card fees, etc.
Blackhawk Farms usually has huge entry numbers. But the past weekend with the rain and the proximity to recent events, the numbers were down. I had the track on Thursday, so I know what it takes. CCS lost money over the race weekend.
If it were so easy to not loose money, WERA would have continued to have races at Blackhawk, Gateway, and Heartland Park Topeka. They can't do it.
QuoteOnce again, good or bad, they are the reason we have races to attend. Just my very humble opinion, and I also agree that the way they went about it sucks. Tough situation, that's all. Yuck.
That's the chicken... However, if it were not for the racers, CCE would have never bought SFX that had bought CCS. Without racers, there would be no racing organization. You can't create a racing organization without racers. And that's the egg.
I do think it kind of blows for the club, regional racers. It does force them to have an expendature for something more.
As for series sponsors...
There will be no series sponsors until there are serious competitors that promote a proper image. There will be no specators to come see racers who's uniforms are mismatched t-shirts. It's all about image, and until the racers and teams change that, it won't happen. Unfortunately, it is just another expense.
CART is a big open wheel racing organization. It exists because of the big teams that have invested lots of money into their programs, thus, getting big sponsorships. CART only gave them a venue to race. If CART was gone, the teams would go somewhere else to do what they do: race and promote their sponsors products.
QuoteWow, how do you figure that?
Weekend track rental at about $10k per day, insurance (which they do have a good deal on because of their world wide promotions), expenses for food lodging, etc for the staff, cornerworkers, credit card fees, etc.
Blackhawk Farms usually has huge entry numbers. But the past weekend with the rain and the proximity to recent events, the numbers were down. I had the track on Thursday, so I know what it takes. CCS lost money over the race weekend.
If it were so easy to not loose money, WERA would have continued to have races at Blackhawk, Gateway, and Heartland Park Topeka. They can't do it.
Sorry, didn't know about the other regions. It is hard to loose money in Mid-Atlantic, they usually have to turn entries away at Summit and VIR because it passes the track capacity.
Add up the gate fees and the race entries, and subtract the cost, if CCS is loosing money around here, they should look for better way to manage things.
Why does Black hawk cost so much to rent? 10k per day? tracks here seems to be cheaper then.
And in the FWIW department...what if the MAM T-bike/FUSA deal was nothing more than an oversight, rather than some nefarious plot to extract even more money from already-broke racers? What if someone were to write a letter (and get it delivered very quickly now) to the right person at CCS Racing, and point out what appears to be an oversight, and ask that it be rectified?
I don't know the economics of sponsoring this race program at all, but it does occur to me that a company the size of CCS may not really need or want to be petty when it comes to *forcing* regional racers to buy more licenses just to race in classes they normally would compete in. I could be wrong, especially as the Racing division still needs to show a profit, and perhaps the people running it know exactly what they're doing, and the way serious racers will likely respond (ie, you want the points, you buy the license).
I've been doing pretty well with the Am T-bikes - but I'm not gonna join FUSA to race in it.
My $0.02.
The other thing that is different is the gate fees. This is what is posted for the MAM and Road America Weekends:
TICKETS
Tickets available at the gate ONLY
SPECTATOR WEEKEND PASS - $35
Valid for 3 days, May 23-25.
Provides access to infield, paddock and garages.
SPECTATOR SATURDAY & SUNDAY PASS - $25
Valid for 2 days, May 24-25.
Provides access to infield, paddock and garages.
SPECTATOR SUNDAY ONLY PASS - $15
Valid Sunday ONLY, May 25
Provides access to infield, paddock and garages.
WORKING/PARTICIPANT CREDENTIAL - $50
Provides access to infield, paddock, garages, and hot pit road. Available at Participant Registration office.
Normally the gate fees for the weekend are $35.00 for the racers and the pit crew, now it's $50.00. Why is that? Can anyone give me a good reason? Increased insurance cost? I don't get it.
Dawn :-/
FUSA weekend credentials are always $50. I think they hire more personels around the track so they up the price to offset the cost. Last year at summit point we paid twice the gate fee (from $25 to $50) to almost twice the entry fee to race same races (regional points) that were 2 laps shorter. And this FUSA weekend was 2 weeks after a normal regional. I don't think many regional racers even showed up.
Dawn, you've always been nice to me so I don't want to upset you further. I can understand your feelings as a championship would be a cool thing on a race resume. But a championship is usually won by someone who is totally devoted to something. Your reality of home and family rightfully may preclude such financial devotion. Life gets in the way sometimes. We all love the track or we wouldn't be doing something like this, but take a step back a second. Look at the FUSA semi-trailer pits sometime. Compared to the CCS guys grilling burgers, there isn't much laughter coming from over there. Running practice with those guys may get you buzzed as they mark their turff. They are serious and are paying the rent with their winnings. A good start may get you knocked out of the way. I believe it's best if we amatures watch the race unless we are trying to begin a true career in racing. With all the classes for skill level, modifications, and such, I think CCS needed to combine some stuff just to get it all in. Sportsman HW is not generally a full grid. The extra money may be an afterthought or a way of taking casual budget racers like myself, off the grid and out of the way.
QuoteDawn, you've always been nice to me so I don't want to upset you further. I can understand your feelings as a championship would be a cool thing on a race resume. But a championship is usually won by someone who is totally devoted to something. Your reality of home and family rightfully may preclude such financial devotion. Life gets in the way sometimes.
No you didn't upset me, and earning a championship does take dedication. That's why we are putting the effort physically, financially and emotionally this year. Next year we won't go to as many race dates because of the financial commitment we made this year. I guess that's life getting in the way.
Heavyweight Sportsman in the MW has quite a number of participants compared to other classes. We have several who run SV's, Buells, and the 600 in-line fours from 90-92.
F-USA guys, I have nothing against them (except the time that the Arclight Suzuki guys unplugged our motor home so they could plug in thier TV :o ::)), in fact I have developed a friendship with some of the members of the teams that regularly race at RA.
Last year CCS and F-USA ran the classes at the same time with no problems, at least at RA, without requiring the additional license. What changed?
Credentials are $50.00, yep, same as last year, but why? Is it because they expect more participants? I just want to understand.
Dawn
Tiff....Art....Anybody?
QuoteLast year CCS and F-USA ran the classes at the same time with no problems, at least at RA, without requiring the additional license. What changed?
Well, last year, the FUSA classes were basically unique to FUSA, sort of. In the mid 1990's I proposed that there be a class similar to the "pro" class at the regional level. And that's what there is: a similar class at the regional and "pro" level. It at least allows a regional racer to build a bike that is specific for a "pro" class, yet still use it at the regional level.
So, rather than have two Sportbike, (Middleweight) Superbike, Unlimited Grand Prix, and Thunderbike events, there will be one with the PRO level purse. For good or for bad.
Yes, there is an increased entry price and an extra license cost. I can understand the increased entry for the purse, but I would agree that the extra cost for the license is a bit different. It has always been that way, the extra license, but the new race format is different.
I'm NOT complaining, (neat stuff comes from it) just pointing out why I think I'll watch. The wt/hp ratio formula for Thunderbike puts me 25-30 hp off what the FUSA guys will be running. The old Lightning series had a 95hp limit and was a hoot to grid with the fast guys. A 125hp Buell Thunderbike is not something many CCS guys could afford to race for trophys. Yes, hp doesn't count for much. but hp & talent will put me in the way about lap 8 or 9.
QuoteI'm NOT complaining, (neat stuff comes from it) just pointing out why I think I'll watch. The wt/hp ratio formula for Thunderbike puts me 25-30 hp off what the FUSA guys will be running. The old Lightning series had a 95hp limit and was a hoot to grid with the fast guys. A 125hp Buell Thunderbike is not something many CCS guys could afford to race for trophys. Yes, hp doesn't count for much. but hp & talent will put me in the way about lap 8 or 9.
Yeah, you could get the thing down to 340 pounds....That would be cheap too, eh...
QuoteSPECTATOR WEEKEND PASS - $35
Valid for 3 days, May 23-25.
Provides access to infield, paddock and garages.
I'm gonna buy a spectators pass. ;)
In drag racing, your race entry fee includes a gate pass. With roadracing you pay to race them you pay some more. >:(
CRA has a 1 day only gate fee for about half price. Since I race on Sat. only, I can enter an extra race. ;D Gingerman had the same thing last year.
I think my engine weighs 340 lbs ;D
QuoteIn drag racing, your race entry fee includes a gate pass. With roadracing you pay to race them you pay some more. >:(
We used to drag race, at times that is starting to look more appealing. But in drag racing most of the focus is on the machine as long as you can cut a good light. Road racing is more of a challenge and that is what Paul was looking for.
Dawn :)
I drag raced for about 15 years. They call it "Drag" racing for a reason. Roadracing is tons more fun! ;D There is a track 15 min. from my house though. :(
Drag racing? What's that?
You dress up in different clothes?
You're pulling something?
;D
I wish I could race a FUSA race, but the only one I qualify for is...nevermind, I don't think I am legal in any of them...lol. ;D
By the way, I think I'd pay the extra money just for the experience of qualifying. I wish we had more time at the CCS races so we could do qualifying. Just another part of the whole experience. However, I am pre-entered for the rest of the season and it is nice starting up front all the time. ;D
QuoteI drag raced for about 15 years. They call it "Drag" racing for a reason. Roadracing is tons more fun! ;D There is a track 15 min. from my house though. :(
Yep, road racing is more fun. We used to live 10 minutes from the drag strip. It was always fun to listen to the cars at night especially when the jet cars came to town.
Dawn :)
I haven't been to a drag race in years. They are having drags this Saturday night at Moroso before we get the track on Sunday. I was thinking of going to watch if I decide to head over on Saturday. Drags are cool to watch, but I doubt I'll ever get into doing it.
All I can picture now is some guy wearing a dress over his leathers. Thanks Dave, now make it go away.
QuoteAll I can picture now is some guy wearing a dress over his leathers. Thanks Dave, now make it go away.
LOL!!!!
Thanks for the mental picture. Perhaps we could make that a requirement for the pit bike race at the Wegman Benefit Weekend. I will bring the baloons to complete the look.
Dawn ;D
Dave Doe was considering a "costume" portion of the pit bike race. ;D Hold those thoughts...
QuoteLOL!!!!
Thanks for the mental picture. Perhaps we could make that a requirement for the pit bike race at the Wegman Benefit Weekend. I will bring the baloons to complete the look.
Dawn ;D
Will "you" be needing the ballons? I'm confused. ???
QuoteWill "you" be needing the ballons? I'm confused. ???
Ummm....
Could be. Some like them large, some like them small and there are days when I don't think I have any at all.
Dawn ;D
LOL! ;D ;D
If all you cry babies out they want to whine about money, then go race go-karts or lawnmowers. >:( We are racing superbikes here guys (and gals)!!! :)
Simply put. If you want to run a Formula USA race then buy a Formula USA license and quit crying like a bunch of babies. If you can't afford it, then stay your arse at home :o
QuoteIf all you cry babies out they want to whine about money, then go race go-karts or lawnmowers. >:( We are racing superbikes here guys (and gals)!!! :)
Simply put. If you want to run a Formula USA race then buy a Formula USA license and quit crying like a bunch of babies. If you can't afford it, then stay your arse at home :o
Bite me!
Read everything through.... I could justify the extra cost for the race entry fee, but the license fee is just stupid if we are only racing to obtain the CCS points. It wasn't that way last year.
It seems like it never ends, $5.00 extra per race for transmitters, $5.00 extra for air fence at BHF (good deal on that one), $50.00 for addtional license for the F-USA date, $20.00 extra for the gate fee for the F-USA date. Once again, we only race CCS!!!!
If no one complains, no one will know that it's not OK to do.
Dawn
Don't plan anything too wild for the pit bike race as there may not be one. CCS is throwing the insurance thing at us. I have been told we now have to have our own insurance for the pit bike race .... so it's on hold until further notice. :P
QuoteDon't plan anything too wild for the pit bike race as there may not be one. CCS is throwing the insurance thing at us. I have been told we now have to have our own insurance for the pit bike race .... so it's on hold until further notice. :P
First moving the Aug 8-10 RA race to Heartland, now this BULLSH1T!!!!!! >:( >:( >:( Whats next? Telling us we cant have certain colors on our bikes or leathers? Damn I wish I could afford to run SCCA again. >:(
QuoteIf all you cry babies out they want to whine about money, then go race go-karts or lawnmowers. >:( We are racing superbikes here guys (and gals)!!! :)
Simply put. If you want to run a Formula USA race then buy a Formula USA license and quit crying like a bunch of babies. If you can't afford it, then stay your arse at home :o
Bite me II! We race CCS. If they combine FUSA and CCS it shouldn't cost extra. Period. Were still racing the same classes for the same little piece of wood. And no were not racing Superbikes.:P
QuoteFirst moving the Aug 8-10 RA race to Heartland, now this BULLSH1T!!!!!! >:( >:( >:(
Is that a done deal? I don't really personally care for RA, and I do like HPT. And RA is 70 miles from my house. I hope it's hot and humid at HPT.
Look, if you don't want to pay the money, then don't race the FUSA classes. Go run WERA or something and quit crying all the time.
QuoteLook, if you don't want to pay the money, then don't race the FUSA classes. Go run WERA or something and quit crying all the time.
You just don't get it.... ::) ::) ::) ::) ::) ::)
I give up.
Dawn :-/
I'm sorry Dawn... I do get it. But it's like, what are you gonna do. They (ccs/fusa) make the rules, and hold the cards so to speak. It is a no win situation for the paying party, I agree.
If it were me, i would run the whole darn thing different. Like I would narrow the classes down a bit.
You know run like
GTO
GTU
GTL
LWSB
LWSS
MWSB
MWSS
HWSB
HWSS
UNLIMITED
MOTARD
125gp
250gp
SATURDAY
Practice 8:30 - 11:00
Lunch 11:00 - 12:00
Racing starts 12:00
4 lap qualifying races, finishing position determines starting spot on main race for sunday.
After racing, if time is left. run practice till 5:00
SUNDAY
Practice 8:30 - 10:00
2 - 3 Sprint races before lunch
Lunch 11:00 - 12:00
Racing starts 12:00
Run 8 lap sprints on all races (except GT classes 30 min)
Paying for a class would include both days. Of course the entry fees would be a little higher but the format seems to be better.
BUT HEY< That's just me ;D
QuoteMOTARD
125gp
250gp
Sorry, wrong answer. These are not
superbikes. They will have to be absorbed by another organization.
8)