Motorcycle Racing Forum

Motorcycle Racing => Wrenching => Topic started by: gsxrsrad1000 on April 20, 2006, 06:37:37 AM

Title: 2001 R6 Track issues
Post by: gsxrsrad1000 on April 20, 2006, 06:37:37 AM
Hello all, I am not a mechanic, but know my way around bikes.  I was at a track day this past Monday and my 2001 r6 bucked on me at 90mph, I looked down and notice the oil light was flashing and the temp guage read 280 then flashed HIGH...HIGH....HIGH so I squeezed in the clutch , pulled over and took it back.  The bike would not start after that.  I would turn the bike on with the kick stand up and the clutch pulled in, the lights would work, but when I hit the starter button you would hear a click and the lights would shut off.  I waited a day to let the battery charge and went for it again, now the starter button does not do anything.  After reading I noticed that the Startup Control Cutoff Circuit (SCCR) could be the problem, along with the Starter switch.  I tested continuity in the SCCR for the circuit, ignition, starter, and fuel pump.  Everything checked out but the fuel pump.  The Starter Switch relay passed the continutity test as well.  I went to test the fuel pump by applying 12v strait to it and I got nothing.  Now linking thsee two issues together leads me to believe I got a bad fuel pump.  My question is, If the fuel pump is bad, would the SCCR stop the bike from cranking?  Furthermore, since the fuel pump test failed on the SCCR does this mean I should replace the SCCR as well as the pump, or just the pump?  Has anyone experienced this problem with a 99-02 Yamaha R6 Before?
Title: Re: 2001 R6 Track issues
Post by: Super Dave on April 20, 2006, 07:39:55 AM
QuoteI was at a track day this past Monday and my 2001 r6 bucked on me at 90mph, I looked down and notice the oil light was flashing and the temp guage read 280 then flashed HIGH...HIGH....HIGH so I squeezed in the clutch , pulled over and took it back.  The bike would not start after that.

Does it have oil?  That hot and locking up...sounds mechanical, not electrical.  Especially if it "won't start"...  Does it have any coolant in it?

Just my quick thoughts...not necessarily an answer.
Title: Re: 2001 R6 Track issues
Post by: cardzilla on April 20, 2006, 07:52:25 AM
I agree with Dave, it sounds mechanical.  The combination of the oil light and VERY high temp is bad. Is the light oil level or pressure?  I ran into trouble on my R1 by assuming it was pressure when it was the level.

Before you pulled in the clutch was the rear tire still spinning or did it lock?  If your starter won't turn the motor over, remove the cover and try by hand.  If it's not moving you've found the problem and it's mechanical.

The only other thing I can think of without seeing it is a complete ECU melt down.  Something that may have sent crazy numbers to your dash and shut the bike down.  Did the bike seem to you to be at 280 degrees?
Title: Re: 2001 R6 Track issues
Post by: gsxrsrad1000 on April 20, 2006, 09:56:44 AM
Oil level was fine and coolant level also, the bike read 283 before it dissapeared and started reading just HIGH.  I took the starter cover off and I didn't spin the starter gear but I'll have to try that.  When I pulled in the clutch the bike just rolled to a stop, nothing seemed to have locked up and after breaking the bike down and looking over stuff, there were no metal shavings in the oil and no coolant so that was good sign.  It just seems electrical because when you press the starter button you can hear the SCCR relay click, then you do not hear anything else until a few seconds later you hear another click.  If you try and press the start button, you click and it sounds like the starter wants to engage but it does not.  I took the gear off the starter thinking that if I start it with the gear off I will at least hear it spin, but that was not the case.  That is what lead me to believe it was something electrical that was not permitting the bike to start.
Title: Re: 2001 R6 Track issues
Post by: Super Dave on April 20, 2006, 10:06:53 AM
Start with the easy stuff.  Attach a socket to something that will allow you to turn the crank.  If you had a catestrophic failure, it's locked and there wouldn't necessarily been time to circulate a whole bunch of pieces in the oil.

I think this question was asked of you before...Was the bike hot?  Not the guage, but did it feel hot?  Hotter than normal hot.
Title: Re: 2001 R6 Track issues
Post by: Super Dave on April 20, 2006, 10:09:16 AM
QuoteI took the gear off the starter thinking that if I start it with the gear off I will at least hear it spin, but that was not the case.  That is what lead me to believe it was something electrical that was not permitting the bike to start.

Which gear?  Did you remove the starter or take off the cover and try it that way?
Title: Re: 2001 R6 Track issues
Post by: gsxrsrad1000 on April 20, 2006, 11:24:57 AM
I took off the cover and took off this gear that connects to a bigger gear that looks like its attached to the crank.  I took off the plug to the timing gear so I could turn the crank with a socket, but it seemed as though I was over tightening the bolt.  When I went in the other direction, I actually loosend the bolt.  The bike did not feel hot and out of the ordinary.
Title: Re: 2001 R6 Track issues
Post by: Super Dave on April 20, 2006, 11:39:15 AM
QuoteI took off the cover and took off this gear that connects to a bigger gear that looks like its attached to the crank.  I took off the plug to the timing gear so I could turn the crank with a socket, but it seemed as though I was over tightening the bolt.  When I went in the other direction, I actually loosend the bolt...

From here, I can't see what you're doing or give you an exact answer.  But...

it might be worth taking out hte spark plugs and trying to turn the motor over again.  If it's stuck and it feels like you're over tightening...it might be mechanically locked up...  But no way for me to really say via the internet...
Title: Re: 2001 R6 Track issues
Post by: gsxrsrad1000 on April 20, 2006, 11:44:25 AM
Great, naw you bring up a very valid point, that is one thing I did not think about.  Compression will be freed up a lot so I should be able to do that, if it doesn not crank over than I know one of those damn pistons or camshaft have seized.
Cool, thanks for your help and prompt responses.  I checked out your site, I like that.  Rider schools are great.  Not sure if you heard of corner speed, but I went to them for my license.  Take care, I'll let you know what I find out just for kicks.
Paul
Title: Re: 2001 R6 Track issues
Post by: Super Dave on April 20, 2006, 11:57:04 AM
I've met Aaron a couple times.  Nice guy.  I teach amateur and expert licensed racers how to go quicker too.  Even worked with a group out at Summit Point a couple years ago.

Tell us what you find.
Title: Re: 2001 R6 Track issues
Post by: gsxrsrad1000 on April 20, 2006, 12:09:03 PM
Cool no problem, yeah I like Arron, been out to like 3 of his track days at VIR.  Man I love the Grand course there.  So how did you like summit?  I am an hour from there and I'll probably head up there in the next couple of weeks for a track day.
Title: Re: 2001 R6 Track issues
Post by: Super Dave on April 20, 2006, 12:19:41 PM
Summit's cool.  VIR is neat too.  You've got a couple of very good opportunities.
Title: Re: 2001 R6 Track issues
Post by: cardzilla on April 21, 2006, 05:20:49 AM
QuoteGreat, naw you bring up a very valid point, that is one thing I did not think about.  Compression will be freed up a lot so I should be able to do that, if it doesn not crank over than I know one of those damn pistons or camshaft have seized.
Cool, thanks for your help and prompt responses.  I checked out your site, I like that.  Rider schools are great.  Not sure if you heard of corner speed, but I went to them for my license.  Take care, I'll let you know what I find out just for kicks.
Paul

It doesn't bode well.  You should easily be able to turn it over with the plugs in.  Taking one or all of them out will obviously help, but it should be possible with them in.  It's a lot smoother with them out, that's the biggest help.  Good luck, hopefully we're wrong about the mechanical failure.
Title: Re: 2001 R6 Track issues
Post by: gsxrsrad1000 on April 21, 2006, 05:41:32 AM
QuoteIt doesn't bode well.  You should easily be able to turn it over with the plugs in.  Taking one or all of them out will obviously help, but it should be possible with them in.  It's a lot smoother with them out, that's the biggest help.  Good luck, hopefully we're wrong about the mechanical failure.

yeah, after further investigation it looks as though the motor locked up, but the fuel pump also seems to have gone down hill.  12v directly to the fuel pump and nothing happens.  I ended up getting the starter to turn without the gear attached to the bigger gear that I am assuming is attached to the crank.  With the little gear off the starter spinns freely, with the gear on and eveytthing bolted back up, the starter moves nothing and all I get is a click, so something is definatly locked up in there.  I also tried turning the crank with a socket on the end of the magnito and you can feel that its siezed up without a doubt.  Thanks for all the help, I am going to look for another motor and part the good parts out on this one.  Thanks again and if you know anyone with an r6 motor stock please let me know.  You can email me at pbrown@umd.edu Paul.
Title: Re: 2001 R6 Track issues
Post by: cardzilla on April 21, 2006, 05:21:52 PM
That sucks, man.  Luckily motors & parts for that bike are pretty easy to find.  It's very odd for a modern 600 to lock up like that.  Hopefully you can find the cause and prevent it from happening again.
Title: Re: 2001 R6 Track issues
Post by: GSXR RACER MIKE on April 29, 2006, 02:18:53 PM
That sounded to me like a siezed motor as soon as I read your original post.

So have you torn into it to find out what it is yet? I'm curious if it was the pistons, bearings, or what?
Title: Re: 2001 R6 Track issues
Post by: aberg12012 on May 26, 2006, 07:26:37 PM
I'm also curious to hear what caused the lock-up.  I have a 99.


Was this motor built at all?  Slotted cam sprockets?  Was any motor work done at all after the factory?  Usually major motor failure such as this occurs within the first few miles of break-in, or when the motor has reached the end of it's life.  (Hows that for an oxy-moronic statement!)  Meaning, either some one really screwed up during assembly, or something in the motor is so worn out that it fails.

Captain obvious over-and-out!    :blahblah: