2012 Ultralightweight Thunderbike?

[vance]

1st, I would say WERA has their shit together because they've got a 3 (give or take) year head start on CCS with this class.  Trust me, if you followed the thread that was closed over there you know it wasn't a pain free process setting this class up.
We racers are a bitchy group, for certain! 


2nd, I emailed Eric for the times for Homestead race #7 to compare:
James' 250 (Expert) 1:56.088
Miguel's 250 (Expert) 1:56.111
Am 250's 1:59-2:02
Jason's 350 1:56.239


That, to me, can't get any better!  To my previous point it's good for the class IMO if the AMs are at least in gun shot of the EXs at the end of the race.


Now to the Moriwaki...
Dillon Tuttle 1:51.570
I don't know Dillon Tuttle, but IMO when an AM youth can run 4+ seconds faster than the experts who he would potentially race against then that seems to create some problems for the class.
I have the results emailed to me for race #7 and if anyone would like to present this in a CALM manner    to Eric, I'm sure CCS will see the problem and choose to eliminate GP bikes from the class.
Anyway, buy a freakin' 250 and fill the grids and all of this crap won't matter.  Put 250's and even 350's on the grid and then use it as a bargaining tool to get our own class.

[Knedragon]

Anyway, buy a freakin' 250 and fill the grids and all of this crap won't matter.  Put 250's and even 350's on the grid and then use it as a bargaining tool to get our own class.

Or get some moriwakis and 125's and keep a proven class alive.Nothing is more rewarding when a 2 stroke is in full song and everything falls into place.The Moriwaki is a close 2nd :-) ... these bikes are tools for the younger kids to get into racing and for us older guys who don't want to buy a new bike every year.

[Race125]

Or get some moriwakis and 125's and keep a proven class alive.Nothing is more rewarding when a 2 stroke is in full song and everything falls into place.The Moriwaki is a close 2nd :-) ... these bikes are tools for the younger kids to get into racing and for us older guys who don't want to buy a new bike every year.

Music to my ears  I am looking to get a 250 but if will be a GP bike

[vance]

Or get some moriwakis and 125's and keep a proven class alive.Nothing is more rewarding when a 2 stroke is in full song and everything falls into place.The Moriwaki is a close 2nd :-) ... these bikes are tools for the younger kids to get into racing and for us older guys who don't want to buy a new bike every year.

The GP is and always will be a proven class. It will probably evolve away from the smokers as MotoGP moves away from them. The class will still be the starter class for serious young racers.
I've owned a 125 before and must say its the most fun I've ever had on the track. But... I don't have the time or the mech ability to run a 2 stroke every year.
The 250's are a proven class on the wera grid and may be here as well given some time. This is not the class for up and coming young racers who have the pockets to really race. I was looking at Moriwakis before they announced the 250 spec class. $8,000 was the cheapest I could find used race ready. That's a big jump in price from a 1st gen $1,000 ninja that will be competitive.
Everyone will have their own reason for trying this class. For some it may be tire/race cost, supply of cheap machines, no required mech knowledge, etc. 
The GP class might provide some of these attractions but it definitely doesn't provide all of them like the 250 class.
I'm keeping track of expenses this year but my estimate will be $7,000 for the bike and 10 rounds and that will drop to $3,500 next year.  You can't come close to that on a Moriwaki, or am I wrong?

[Jiggyfly]

@ knedragon: it wasn't pointed at you, but that's cool.

I'm talking more about, let's say Daytona ROC.....what kind of bikes do you think will be on the top 3 steps there?
Sounds like a great way to pad Jr's resume, "yep, little Johnny here took his bike with 10 more hp, & 150lbs lighter & whipped all of 'em to win a national championship!"

:D

Hell, if I had one, I'd do it....there's no asterisk next to your trophy. :D
It's exploitation of a bad set of rules.

[Jiggyfly]

The GP is and always will be a proven class. It will probably evolve away from the smokers as MotoGP moves away from them. The class will still be the starter class for serious young racers.
I've owned a 125 before and must say its the most fun I've ever had on the track. But... I don't have the time or the mech ability to run a 2 stroke every year.
The 250's are a proven class on the wera grid and may be here as well given some time. This is not the class for up and coming young racers who have the pockets to really race. I was looking at Moriwakis before they announced the 250 spec class. $8,000 was the cheapest I could find used race ready. That's a big jump in price from a 1st gen $1,000 ninja that will be competitive.
Everyone will have their own reason for trying this class. For some it may be tire/race cost, supply of cheap machines, no required mech knowledge, etc. 
The GP class might provide some of these attractions but it definitely doesn't provide all of them like the 250 class.
I'm keeping track of expenses this year but my estimate will be $7,000 for the bike and 10 rounds and that will drop to $3,500 next year.  You can't come close to that on a Moriwaki, or am I wrong?

^^
This!


125's are dead. I raced one, too. It was a blast! But it's a dead class. Last year in the Midwest sometimes there were only 2. On good weekends, 3.

First ULWTB race last year, 5 bikes.

[roadracer162]

For the comparison of WERA to CCS(old conversation) I think WERA is more rider skill inclined and CCS is more towards the bike builder. For me being old and not wanting to go lose weight to compete, HP is the great equalizer. Of course me on my Ducati 800 racing against the Bimotas and Ducati DS1000/1200 I have no HP advantage, yet I am still somewhat competitive. So my choice has been CCS. Having the tracks in my back yard helps too. WERA's closest race is 6 1/2 hours. I also like using the odd or old bike to race against the competition that has the commonplace bike/package. It's unbelievable to me seeing the performance of my FZR600 being matched by the SV650 and and Ducati 1000 which are considered lightweight. The FZR600 is considered a middleweight bike

I just don't believe the little GP class is dead because in Florida it is still healthy enough. It does make a good starter class on a del race bike. With the Moto3 coming into play I am sure there will be more Moriwaki like riders and bike combinations which can only be good.

[CHIRINOM]

The 125 class is always expanding and contracting. Definitely a place in my heart for the class. If the budget and class structure were there, I would still be running both.

Once a rider can get past the bigger is better mentality, the 125 will show them a thing or two about carrying serious corner speed and being consistent. It is the next best bang for your buck behind a 250 Super Sport class.

I hope that the other ULTB riders out there are on the same page as the ones on this forum. It is frustrating that we have to deal with the possibility of showing up and being out classed, but it is what it is. I too would like to have a fair shot at the Daytona ROC this year.

[roadracer162]

i might have to borrow one just to race Daytona

[Knedragon]

I hope that the other ULTB riders out there are on the same page as the ones on this forum. It is frustrating that we have to deal with the possibility of showing up and being out classed, but it is what it is. I too would like to have a fair shot at the Daytona ROC this year.

I'll make you a gentlemans agreement,you won't see me at Daytona with any of my bikes :-) .... that goes for VIR,Loudon and more then likely PBIR as well

[apriliaman]

Did you know for Thunderbike it says   2 stroke unlimited displacement
Does that mean that i can run a 2001  500cc moto gp bike?????
Or an old yamaha tz 750???

[Race125]

Is it single cylinder? Guess not