Taken from the newly released 2011 Newletter/License Mailer (http://www.ccsracing.us/forms/2011/license/2011%20license%20mailer%20v2%20.pdf)
Congratulations to the Amateurs who have been upgraded to Expert for the 2011 season. The riders listed on this page have met one or more of the criteria for advancement: scoring 400 points in a single season (from all classes run), won a track championship, won a regional class championship or finished in the top 5 at the 2010 CCS Race of Champions. If you find yourself on this list and want further explanation on how you got there, contact Kevin Elliott - Director of Operations during our normal office hours. (Monday thru Thursday, 9am to 5pm Central Time.).
If you are on this list and are petitioning to remain Amateur for 2011 (or asking for your once per career downgrade), please make certain you completely fill out your license application and attach a letter stating the reason (or reasons) that you should be allowed to retain that status. No evaluations will be made without the license application accompanied by the written request.
ADAM NEESE, BILTMORE LAKE, NC.
ALVARO SANCHEZ, MIAMI BEACH, FL.
ANDREW PERKINS, LAKE MARY, FL.
ANGEL PERDOMO, MIAMI, FL.
BILL SYLVESTER, QUEEN ANNE, MD.
BRUCE BARRY, LAKE INTHEHILLS, IL.
BRUNO SILVA, MIAMI, FL.
CHAD MARTIN, ASHVILLE, NC.
CHRIS BIRDSONG, WASHINGTON, NC.
CHRIS DODD, MILLS RIVER, NC.
CHRIS DONLEY, STUART, FL.
CHRISTOPHER LEIFHEIT, NAPERVILLE, IL.
CHRISTOPHER MEIER, WADING RIVER, NY.
CRAIG WEST, FREEHOLD, NJ.
DALTON HOWARD, OAK GROVE, MO.
DANIEL CHRISTOPHERSON, MILWAUKEE, WI.
DAVID HANIG, OSSINING, NY.
DAVID UR, BLAIRSTOWN, NJ.
DEMIAN NEUFELD, NEW YORK, NY.
DEREK OSNER, BROOMALL, PA.
DOUG GOODWIN, SMITHVILLE, MO.
DOUG STUFFLEBEAM, ENGLISHTOWN, NJ.
DREW KESSLER, WINCHESTER, VA.
DUSTIN WATSON, SPOTTSWOOD, VA.
EDWARD BAIVIER, MEQUON, WI.
EDWIN DELOSSANTOS, MIAMI BEACH, FL.
ELDER MACHADO, MIRAMAC, FL.
GLENN CARNELL, ELBURN, IL
GUILHERME BERG, MIRAMAR, FL.
GUSTAVO VIDAL, HERNDON, VA.
ILYA SALTYKOV, NEW YORK, NY.
JASON ZELIBOR, FAIRFAX, VA.
JAY VANDUSER, BRISTOW, VA.
JEFF PULEO, MIAMI BEACH, FL.
JIM DOYLE, OVERBROOK, KS.
JIRI KOLAR, KEY WEST, FL.
JOE SCHWEIGART, JENSEN BEACH, FL
JOHN WIECEK JR, LEESBURG, VA.
JONATHAN ELIAS, FALLS CHURCH, VA.
JORGE SOSA, MIAMI, FL.
JOSE CONTRERAS, SAN JUAN, PR.
JOSE FERRO, MIAMI, FL.
JOSEPH ROPPO, NEW BERN, NC.
JOSH ROM, OSHKOSH, WI.
JULIAN KIM, SPRINGFIELD, VA.
JUSTIN DRAKE, MASARYKTOWN, FL.
K ROSS WELLWOOD, FREDERICA, DE.
KATHARIN ZIMPEL, MIAMI BEACH, FL
KELLY DANIELS, LONGWOOD, FL.
KENNETH TOMLINSON, JONESBOROUGH, TN.
KEVIN HUFF, BLUE SPRINGS, MO.
LAWRENCE TREPEL, NEW YORK, NY.
LEE LOVETTE, KEY WEST, FL.
LUCAS WALTA, BONNER SPRINGS, KS.
MARCIO PIZANELLI, DORAL, FL.
MARIO BENITEZ, SOUTH PLAINFIELD, NJ.
MARK TAYLOR, LAUREL, MD.
MATT BROWN, MILL SPRING, NC.
MATT GRANZOW, WEST ALLIS, WI.
MATTHEW PARRY, PORT JERVIS, NY.
MAYKEL ESCALONA, MIAMI, FL.
MICHAEL BARSCH, MILWAUKEE, WI.
MICHAEL C JORDAN, STEVENSVILLE,
MICHAEL COPOULOS, HOPE MILLS, NC.
MICHAEL HENAO, MIRAMAR, FL.
MIKE SHINVILLE, MORRISON, IL.
NICOLAS MACLEAN, KEY BISCAYNE, FL
NIGEL LUE, MIRAMAR, FL.
PABLO CASTRO, PALM BEACH GARDENS, FL.
PETER MERINGOLO, WEST ISLIA, NY.
RALPH LONGUS, WATERLOO, IA.
RAYMOND QUINN, MANCHESTER, NJ.
ROB ALLEN, MORRISTOWN, NJ.
ROBERT DAMERAU, PALM BEACH, FL
ROBERT PARMENTIER, STIRLING, NJ.
ROGER HUNTER, TOPEKA, KS.
SCOTT LUCKIESH, HARTLAND, WI.
SEAN CASSELL, ALTAMONTE SPRINGS, FL.
STEPHEN DAVIS LONG JR, BEAUFORT, SC.
STEPHEN RICHARDSON, VIRGINIA BEACH, VA.
STEVE JOHNSTON, PALM BEACH GARDENS, FL.
SUNIL SARDARSINGH, MIAMI, FL.
TAMAS MOLNAR, LIGHTHOUSE POINT, FL.
TERRY WILKINSON, MENOMONEE FALLS, WI.
TIM IVANOFF, BREAUX BRIDGE, LA.
TODD ALBERICO, BROOKLYN, NY.
TODD EVANS, WEST ALLIS, WI.
TODD SEVERSON, NORTH FONDDULAC, WI.
TONY VRENNA, TAMARAC, FL.
TOSHIYUKI NAGASHIMA, TOKYO, JP.
VINCENT STUDT, OSHKOSH, WI.
WILLIAM WISSINGER, KEY LARGO, FL.
WILMER GARCIA, HIALEAH, FL.
ZARED LEON, CANCUN, QR
Whatever. No more trophies for me. It was a good run though.
I'm trying to figure out how I got on that list....
Well as predicted 80 some percent of the lightweight amateur ranks have a bump, sooo who's taking it and who's petitioning hehe
Quote from: twilkinson3 on December 08, 2010, 02:14:51 PM
Well as predicted 80 some percent of the lightweight amateur ranks have a bump, sooo who's taking it and who's petitioning hehe
why was it predicted? to get the numbers up in the ltwt expert classes?
Just my prediction and the base reason is if you showed up most of the rounds you were over 400 points on the season
i got bumped with 302 pts adjusted to 383 pts. Close enough I guess...
Put on the white plates boys and come to the playground.
Quote from: MACOP1104 on December 08, 2010, 02:59:06 PM
i got bumped with 302 pts adjusted to 383 pts. Close enough I guess...
Did you do one of the following:
1. win a track championship
2. win a regional class championship
3. finish in the top 5 at the 2010 CCS Race of Champions?
Quote from: Burt Munro on December 08, 2010, 06:36:19 PM
Did you do one of the following:
1. win a track championship
2. win a regional class championship
3. finish in the top 5 at the 2010 CCS Race of Champions?
no, no, no.
Quote from: Spcassell on December 08, 2010, 10:54:14 AM
Whatever. No more trophies for me. It was a good run though.
I think you might be able to work in a podium or two.... :biggrin:
Quote from: majicMARKer on December 08, 2010, 05:31:24 PM
Put on the white plates boys and come to the playground.
Let the petitioning commence.....
"But I just repainted my tail yellow" sounds like a good reason to me. ::)
Ha! Billy boy break out the white paint! See you on the Bigboy grid in Feb.
i'll be the one spinning around in circles when the fast guys blow by!
tim
Quote from: MACOP1104 on December 08, 2010, 02:59:06 PM
i got bumped with 302 pts adjusted to 383 pts. Close enough I guess...
I think if you add all your points for all classes, not just the classes for 1-10 plates, you will find you are over 400.
Add there is no way your adjusted points can be higher than your base points.
I was surprised to see my name on the list last night so I called CCS today and learned I had earned 402 points!
The white plate has been my ultimate goal since day one but now that it's a possiblility...
At least if we all move up I'd still be among friends!
Woo hoo! The old man finally made it !!! Next podium I see will be the big one in the sky.
good, was tired of starting in the second wave. mid pack here i come. one good thing the white plates will look better on my paint job, whens the first race :)
sorry boys moving up up to a 1000 next year! Now i can start my new diet of pizza and chicken wings
Quote from: Eric Kelcher on December 08, 2010, 08:24:48 PM
I think if you add all your points for all classes, not just the classes for 1-10 plates, you will find you are over 400.
Add there is no way your adjusted points can be higher than your base points.
My bad. I was looking at perf index.
I guess if you add my mid atlantic points with my Southeast points I have over 400. I got points in both regions at one or more rounds I think.
Quote from: Spcassell on December 08, 2010, 10:54:14 AM
Whatever. No more trophies for me. It was a good run though.
{Schwarzenegger voice: } Quit whining...
:thumb:
Thinking long and hard about the lightweight class for next year. If only them damn Bimota's and Ducati's weren't legal. Might have to start looking for a Paul Smart. Any word on their reliability.
Congradulations to all that graduated!
At Bill999s, great work Big Cat! You better race in 2011 too!!!
Congrats to all. We definetly need more racers in the Expert grids. Come on MARCH!!!!!!
Good job this yr Bill!
Quote from: mikendzel on December 09, 2010, 03:08:52 PM
At Bill999s, great work Big Cat! You better race in 2011 too!!!
are you healed up yet or what!
Love it Can't wait to mix it up with the white plates next year. I will prob get my ass kicked, but I still want my white plates.
Quote from: scubabill on December 08, 2010, 07:05:53 PM
I think you might be able to work in a podium or two.... :biggrin:
Let the petitioning commence.....
"But I just repainted my tail yellow" sounds like a good reason to me. ::)
But I DID just paint my tail section yellow...
So file this list check licences for renewal in 2012 and see how many give up after a year in expert. As for me I'd like enough points next year to go to expert then retire for good with a white plate
Thanks everybody. I had a great time this year (except maybe for the final race @ cmp, and yeah I'm all healed up) and although I most likely won't make as many races next year I'll still be around for a while. Well, at least I hope to be.
come on Bill, you know you need to Team Challenge next year! Sean, bring the big duc to SuperTwins!
see ya in the spring!:)
tim
Quote from: honda60071 on December 09, 2010, 06:38:21 PM
are you healed up yet or what!
Not yet Shawn, I was only able to get to 3 rounds this year. The first round sucked because it was my first track experience back from breaking my wrist in 2009, and the last round, someone had inadvertently sabotaged my bike with bad ignition coils and leaky fork seals.... I'm hoping to move up after the VIR round in June.
Welp. Thats a big list!
Quote from: Spcassell on December 09, 2010, 11:31:12 AM
Thinking long and hard about the lightweight class for next year. If only them damn Bimota's and Ducati's weren't legal. Might have to start looking for a Paul Smart. Any word on their reliability.
No you arent. 600...VIR...i get a headstart this time.
Goodbye and good luck Drew and Derrick (and everyone else who got bumped), I'll take good care of the ametuer MW classes for you guys, haha. Meet you up there in 2012! ;)
:preachon:Well I guess that I will be an expert next year. I have read about the points needed to get bumped and never really agreed with it. Supposedly you need 400 points and that is impossible for some racers. I have been racing since 2004 and have never reached 400 points. I was bumped this year with adjusted points of 183. My percentage was in the 750 range. Last year I had more points, (not 400) and had a percentage in the 900's and was not bumped. I never raced enough in the classes that count towards bump points. I am glad that I am going expert, it will make me get faster.
Now to my other reason for finally posting on the Forum. As much as I will hate not racing with my friends in CCS very much next year, it is not due to my lack of racing. I will be running most of my races with WERA because of the rule changes that keep affecting the LW class in CCS. The LW class used to be a class where someone who wanted to get into racing could do so with a chance of winning withour having spent the family fortune. Over the past few years this has changed. They have added Buells, 1000cc Ducati's, Bimoto's, and now they have thrown in the 125 and 250 GP bikes. It really makes me think that it should be changed to the Hodge Podge Class or the dumping ground class for all bikes that don't fit well into another class. The SV's now need to be built to a great extent to be competitive in the class costing the rider money that many of us do not have or want to spend. In the past you could buy a race prepped SV for $2500.00 to $3500.00 and be competitive. This is no longer possible. A TZ250 at VIR is capable of running lap times that would be within the 110% needed to run the AMA Superbike race. The GP bike were not eligible to bump to the LW class for a reason. That reason has not changed. The fact that there may be fewer of them and they can not fill a class grid on their own is not a reason to put them in a class that they had previously not been allowed in for good reason.
The horsepower to weight argument does not work either. I was on the track this last year with bikes that on the straights made me think my chain had fallen off. My SV is no slouch. This HP gap made us ride much more aggressively in the corners because that is the only place we had a chance to pass the larger bikes. Aggressive is good to a point but the Novice rider does not need to be pushed to that level in the first year or years of racing.
Next is the win percentages argument. This is also a bad argument. If you look at the races in a statistically correct manner the large CC bike won a disproportionate percentage of the races entered. When these bikes make up approximately 10% of the bikes entered and win over 30% of the races it clearly shows that there is an advantage. Rider skill is supposed to be the difference, not available money.
If you need to have a class for these bikes that is great. Let them have their own classes. They do not need to have their own race, they can grid with the LW bikes but not be racing against them for points or plaques. If the equallity of the bikes is correct as is being stated by putting them in the LW class there will not be a speed or lap time differential that will cause a danger on the track. You will only need to supply a plaque for the riders. This would be a much better alternative than causing persons to either quit racing, leave your organization or not get into the sport at all.
Where is the thought process here. In a time when grids are getting smaller and smaller, less and less people are entering the sport and more and more tracks are being closed due to lack of race dates why would you make the situation worse. I hope that the powers to be in the CCS organization rethink these changes and address them in time to help save both their organization and Sportsman level motorcycle racing.
I wish the best of luck to all my friends and fellow racers. I hope to see you this year both on and off the track. I have not made my decision as to whether I am going to change classes or racing organizations. I still Love Racing. :preachon:
They're not gonna change the class rules. Just race WERA on your SV and you don't need to mess with the air cooled monsters. That's what I'm doing. I will do some local CCS stuff and I will go to Daytona. At the ROC, I'll only race ULWSB and maybe the LW F40. Any other class on my SV would just be a waste of time....
Quote from: Spcassell on December 08, 2010, 10:54:14 AM
Whatever. No more trophies for me. It was a good run though.
Shut up Sean. We'll be chasing you. :)
I'd like to bump back down to AM. It was a total blast beating up on many of the experts in LW in 07...Now the podiums are few and far between and I missed the chance to win a championship by just a few points. Oh well, it's all for fun anyway at this point.
I'll keep going as long as I continue to have fun, my lap times creep down but if I plateau I may follow up on the promise to the family to hand it all up when I hit 50 (17 months).
Quote from: poppop587 on December 11, 2010, 10:57:55 AMThe horsepower to weight argument does not work either. I was on the track this last year with bikes that on the straights made me think my chain had fallen off. My SV is no slouch. This HP gap made us ride much more aggressively in the corners because that is the only place we had a chance to pass the larger bikes. Aggressive is good to a point but the Novice rider does not need to be pushed to that level in the first year or years of racing.
Power to weight ratio (P/W/R) calculations must use the COMBINED weight of the bike (wet) AND THE RIDER to be accurate in a comparison. Different sprocket gearing can also cause changes in WHERE a certain bike and rider combination has an advantage and where they make a sacrifice (more grunt out of a turn or more top end - you only get one or the other by changing final drive ratio gearing, not both).
One mile per hour is 1.467 feet per second, so if another racer is passing you at a rate of apx 1 bike length per second their only going about 4.7 miles per hour faster than you. If your (combined weight) P/W/R is identical to theirs then they are either carrying more speed thru turns and/or their sprocket gearing is different than yours, but if their gearing was much more aggressive than yours you should catch them by the end of the straight (unless your geared to go faster than needed for that specific track). As long as a certain P/W/R can be applied to the ground, and the sprocket gearing is correct for the track, then the rest is all about the rider. BUT....If they truely do have a lower weight per Hp then your never going to be able to keep up with them if you both have similar gearing and can carry the same speed thru turns.
Here's some interesting examples:
350 lb bike + 130 lb rider = 480 lbs, divided by 85 Hp = 5.65 lbs per Hp
350 lb bike + 180 lb rider = 530 lbs, divided by 85 Hp = 6.24 lbs per Hp
350 lb bike + 230 lb rider = 580 lbs, divided by 85 Hp = 6.82 lbs per Hp
405 lb bike + 130 lb rider = 535 lbs, divided by 95 Hp = 5.63 lbs per Hp
405 lb bike + 180 lb rider = 585 lbs, divided by 95 Hp = 6.16 lbs per Hp
405 lb bike + 230 lb rider = 635 lbs, divided by 95 Hp = 6.68 lbs per Hp
405 lb bike + 130 lb rider = 535 lbs, divided by 105 Hp = 5.10 lbs per Hp
405 lb bike + 180 lb rider = 585 lbs, divided by 105 Hp = 5.57 lbs per Hp
405 lb bike + 230 lb rider = 635 lbs, divided by 105 Hp = 6.05 lbs per Hp
415 lb bike + 130 lb rider = 545 lbs, divided by 115 Hp = 4.74 lbs per Hp
415 lb bike + 180 lb rider = 595 lbs, divided by 115 Hp = 5.17 lbs per Hp
415 lb bike + 230 lb rider = 645 lbs, divided by 115 Hp = 5.61 lbs per Hp
In a race between 2 riders of similar ability, a 230 lb rider on a 415 lb 600cc middle weight bike with 115 Hp (5.61 lbs per Hp) would be almost exactly matched to a 130 lb rider on a 350 lb Lightweight bike with 85 Hp (5.65 lbs per Hp). For a bike to have 30 more Hp than another and be equalized out thru weight is a tough pill for alot of people to swallow, but it's accurate.
I would be very interested in knowing accurate Weight and Horsepower numbers for the bikes in question and the weight of the riders who are blowing past you vs. your own combined P/W/R.
Nice charts..... you are forgetting a little thing called torque... sorry to have to point it out.
Quote from: Cowboy 6 on December 12, 2010, 05:33:02 PM
Nice charts..... you are forgetting a little thing called torque... sorry to have to point it out.
Again, you gain in one area and sacrifice the other (either Hp or Torque, choose one).
If your engines highest torque is at a lower RPM it's going to have better grunt coming out of a turn and during initial acceleration but the higher RPM torque of an I-4 screamer engine is going to catch up to a torque monster engine of the same Hp (if both bikes are geared properly). If the bike / rider combination's have the same P/W/R, the bikes are geared properly, and they are both able to get that power down to the ground, then they should end up tied at the end of the longest straight. That's certainly not saying that one set-up doesn't have advantages over the other in unique applications, of course some tracks are going to be more suited overall for lower RPM grunt and others for higher RPM power (though the same Hp). If you only race at 1 track (or 1 type of track) then I'm sure you would probably see a certain engine type consistently finishing well.
Being around 1/4 mile drag racing is how I know this, online you can easily look up a '1/4 mile time and MPH calculator' and most will only ask your vehicles peak Hp and total weight (including all fluids and driver) - it doesn't care where your torque is at because as long as your vehicle is geared properly for the power delivery of the engine then at the end of the track it all works out the same (as long as you can put the power to the ground with each combination).
:thumb:
Torque = acceleration
HP = top speed.
Yes, I4 will eat the torquey twin at the top but what this really means is that the I4 is still making good torque at the top while the twins torque is falling off. Oversimplified
HP = Torque * RPM
The I4 can get by on less torque because it makes it over a greater band so is able to take advantage of gearing. Gearing can increase or decrease torque to the rear wheel but gearing can NEVER change HP.
Back to the topic at hand, I didn't see the 85HP 225lbs bike in your chart.
It sounds like everyone is worried about the GP bikes. Well, they aren't allowed in superbike and supersport so there's some salvation. We'll see what happens if Brian Kragcet rides a GP bike at VIR. That dude rails.
Quote from: MACOP1104 on December 11, 2010, 01:21:28 PM
They're not gonna change the class rules. Just race WERA on your SV and you don't need to mess with the air cooled monsters. That's what I'm doing. I will do some local CCS stuff and I will go to Daytona. At the ROC, I'll only race ULWSB and maybe the LW F40. Any other class on my SV would just be a waste of time....
I think CCS has good intentions in that they are trying to boost Grid Numbers, but I think what they are really doing is running the SV crowd off. My plan is very similiar to yours, race WERA this coming year and throw in a couple local CCS rounds just for the fun of it.
The 125GP bike is legal in Ultralight which is a Superbike class. Unless they are creating new Ultralight classes.
Quote from: Cowboy 6 on December 12, 2010, 05:33:02 PM
Nice charts..... you are forgetting a little thing called torque... sorry to have to point it out.
More torque does not mean more acceleration. High torque at low rpm can be out accelerated by less torque at higher rpm.
Power is what determines the rate of acceleration.
As you gain speed, you also gain (kinetic) energy. The energy gained divided by the time to gain the energy is power. That is why acceleration falls off as speed increases, at higher speeds, the same change in speed requires more power because the difference in kinetic energy is not the same. Accelerating from 90 to 100mph requires 6.4 times as much power as accelerating from 10 to 20 mph in the same amount of time (not even including wind resistance) or given the same power, it would take 6.4 times longer to accelerate from 90 to 100 than 10 to 20.
2 bikes, same weight, one that is making more power will accelerate faster (assuming geared properly).
I can make the torque (rear wheel) any value I like with gearing, but the power will not change. There is an optimal gearing combination for maximum acceleration, just going to lower gearing does not always make for better acceleration.
A 100 hp engine can only do 55,000 ft-lbs of work per second regardless of the torque.
Yes, having a couple degrees in physics does help with (understanding) racing.
Mark,
The addition is the 250 GP bike. That is a whole different animal.
Gee, Professor McLaughlin, that was fun!
Now can you explain why a pound of feathers doesn't fall slower than a pound of lead ? :kissy:
:biggrin:
QuoteA 100 hp engine can only do 55,000 ft-lbs of work per second regardless of the torque.
Since horsepower is not measured but is calculated from measured torque {(torque x rpm) / 5,252 = hp} indeed, the torque is what matters.
Quote from: HAWK on December 13, 2010, 01:26:21 AM...I didn't see the 85HP 225lbs bike in your chart.
225 lb bike + 130 lb rider = 355 lbs, divided by 85 Hp = 4.18 lbs per Hp
225 lb bike + 180 lb rider = 405 lbs, divided by 85 Hp = 4.77 lbs per Hp
225 lb bike + 230 lb rider = 455 lbs, divided by 85 Hp = 5.35 lbs per Hp
At 4.18 lbs per Hp a 130 lb rider on that bike would have a P/W/R capable of winning regional Middleweight races.
At 4.77 lbs per Hp a 180 lb rider on that bike would have a P/W/R capable of easily winning regional Lightweight races.
At 5.35 lbs per Hp a 230 lb rider on that bike would have a P/W/R capable of placing well or possibly winning Lightweight races.
Quote from: Spcassell on December 08, 2010, 10:54:14 AM
Whatever. No more trophies for me. It was a good run though.
LOL.. Gonna do just fine Mr. Cassell.. I remember when we were working together at JGP, and while on track i was trying to hang AND observe with just take-offs. Nope.. I thought to myself.. shit, im gonna need to get some freshies to ride with this guy.
Quote from: Cowboy 6 on December 13, 2010, 09:07:53 PM
Since horsepower is not measured but is calculated from measured torque {(torque x rpm) / 5,252 = hp} indeed, the torque is what matters.
That is just the way most dynos are designed because it is easier to package a system that measures torque rather than the power.
Why would measuring the torque to calculate the power imply that torque is what matters?
If I made a dyno that measured power directly, then would power be what matters?
http://autospeed.com/cms/A_108647/article.html
http://autospeed.com/cms/title_Power-versus-Torque-Part-2/A_108648/article.html
I have to say I agree with Ross and I think the turnout for the class speaks volumes. The Lightweight classes it used to be you could buy an affordable bike in the sub $5000 range and be competitive. It was a poor man's class. Now that 1100DS engines are allowed and buells and somehow even $50,000 Bimotas are allowed in the class, in order to be remotely competitive you need to put $3500-$5000 of motor work into that SV and even then you are still far outmotored by stock 1100 ducati engines, let alone the worked ones. Lightweight used to be pretty popular but now that the price to enter is higher than the middleweight class it ruins the class and causes people to leave and go elsewhere.
Z
Quote from: zman on December 14, 2010, 11:19:19 AM
I have to say I agree with Ross and I think the turnout for the class speaks volumes. The Lightweight classes it used to be you could buy an affordable bike in the sub $5000 range and be competitive. It was a poor man's class. Now that 1100DS engines are allowed and buells and somehow even $50,000 Bimotas are allowed in the class, in order to be remotely competitive you need to put $3500-$5000 of motor work into that SV and even then you are still far outmotored by stock 1100 ducati engines, let alone the worked ones. Lightweight used to be pretty popular but now that the price to enter is higher than the middleweight class it ruins the class and causes people to leave and go elsewhere.
Z
I agree. I think I can get around the track decent enough. To have to try and ride to overcome a 30 - 50 horsepower defecit is unrealistic. I gave it hell at the ROC on a 65hp SV and even I gave up after riding the wheels off the thing only to be passed on the straights. The class should be a low entry grass roots class. There are Bimota's that make more horsepower than my CBR600RR. Are you kidding me. WERA has addressed the issue and now it's time for CCS. I guarantee if you fix the rules the class will grow.
Amen. CCS lightweight rules blow donkey dong.
As a poor old slow guy on a SV - I have to concur. I'm still building a newer SV for this season and it'll be an essentially stock engine and running pump. But without engine work, race gas, weighing less than 130lbs, etc and running against the Buells and Ducs it does make me wonder why I am bothering. Now running against 250cc GP bikes too? Seriously? I have always run CCS exclusively and I plan to run CCS this year, but I am thinking about trying a WERA round this season for this very reason.
Well I'm here until it stops being fun, and if getting smoked on every straight makes it no fun, then I'll be done and have to figure a new way to risk bodily injury and hemmorhage cash while emptying my adrenal gland. Here's hoping for a fun and competitve 2011 with CCS!
Brian
Old, fat and slow but still grinning
CCS 757
Glad I didn't get bumped.
Quote from: Burt Munro on December 13, 2010, 08:42:18 PM
Gee, Professor McLaughlin, that was fun!
Now can you explain why a pound of feathers doesn't fall slower than a pound of lead ? :kissy:
:biggrin:
:lmao:
Yeah, don't forget Aerodynamics... :thumb:
OK back to questions about AM-EX bumping. If you are bumped up and accept it becoming a new expert, can you later still request a "once a career" move back down to amateur?
Quote from: grasslander on December 16, 2010, 09:13:50 AM
OK back to questions about AM-EX bumping. If you are bumped up and accept it becoming a new expert, can you later still request a "once a career" move back down to amateur?
If you go Expert and feel that your not adapting to it after racing a few events then go talk to the Race Director and explain why you feel you should go back to Amateur status.
I've had fast Amateurs pass me that were just plain scary to be on the track at the same time with, they were all over the track and obviously riding way beyond their experience and ability. In my opinion being an Expert is more about racing predictably than it is about being faster than every Amateur racer. Most Amateurs who go Expert will get faster and smoother in their 1st season by simply racing with the Experts, often times they will be turning faster lap times almost immediately by simply interacting with faster and smoother racers.
Many Amateur racers have alot of apprehension about going Expert but it's not as bad as you think. Even though it may take you some time to work your way up the finishing results as an Expert, the experience will definitely improve you as a racer.
A great quote:
"The anticipation of an event is usually far more dramatic than the event itself"
I hope that someone who has some authority at CCS is watching the posts. It is clear to me that there is quite a bit of concern in the LW class with the rule changes. I know of no other racing organization that has a class that has bikes that go from 125cc to 1200cc. That does not even sound reasonable. Again my concern here is with the number of people who will continue to race. No one goes out to race to finish last. That is what Track Day Organizations are for. Keep up the rule changes and racers will either be racing WERA or doing Track Days. You have killed the LW class!!!!!
I will continues racing with CCS regardless of the LW rules. Yes I do bitch at times because many times the changes don't make sense. it is then my responsibility to submit my formal request for change to where the rules will suit my program a little more.
I like tha fact the WERA is different than CCS. If both organizations were the same there would be no reason to change from either. At least this way there is a variety.
Yes to me 1000 anything just doesn't seem to me as LW. I do believe the aircooled Duc900 and the water-cooled SV is a pretty good match. You must remember when the FZR400 was considered LW.
125cc is now Ultralight and the 1200cc is LW. I do race at times on my FZR400 fully expecting to be last, but sometimes I SURPRISE MYSELF.
Quote from: Carnag3 on December 15, 2010, 01:28:22 PM
Glad I didn't get bumped.
I know you didn't request to remain as an Amateur, did you?
Get a rope...
Quote from: GSXR RACER MIKE on December 16, 2010, 10:54:13 AM
... Many Amateur racers have alot of apprehension about going Expert but it's not as bad as you think. Even though it may take you some time to work your way up the finishing results as an Expert, the experience will definitely improve you as a racer.
A great quote:
"The anticipation of an event is usually far more dramatic than the event itself"
Thank you. Great post