2003 Top 10- new rule

Started by Bender, December 19, 2001, 10:40:21 AM

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Bob Robbins

There is no way to make it work without someone feeling they were outspent. If you require the top ten to have finished the season in the top 3 for the points to count it will reduce points chasing by lower finishers, and will actually reflect the rider more than the present system. In the Northeast, they do not acknowledge points overall. I had the most points by far, competing in 5 classes, finishing the season in all classes in first through third, and I would not have felt that I was the no. 1 guy there. You need to remember, when people see a no. 1 plate, they assume you're fast and will target you. At Loudon, you can wear the no. 1 in the class you won only, so you change numbers for everything else.

Sean Wyatt

I think there should be a #1 plate for each weight-class (ex. #1 ULW/Super Single, #1 LW, #1 MW, #1HW, #1Unltd.)  This may seem like a lot of #1 plates, but it will definitely illuminate whom are the dominate people in a particular weight-class.  Of course this makes the corner worker's job a lot harder, but I think the recognition from being seen and known as the #1 in particular weight-class would mean more to the racers and make watching the races more enjoyable.  It can also be an added sponsorship seeking tool.

If you compete in more than one weight-class, add letters to signify where the number applies.  Even better, have different colored number plates for the different weight classes.  I'm tired of seeing Europeans and Australians with all different colors number plates.  I can see it now, red number plate with 629 emblazoned across it.

Super Dave

Letters attached to number ones is how AHRMA does it for each class champion.  Does make it a bit confusing during a practice session.

I feel that the championship now is based on how much money one has to spend.  How many bikes, how many races.  Indeed, there are riders that are fast that do win championships, but it isn't a race to a championship, it's a matter of money.  Often times, good riders don't chase the championship because they can't compete at the "money" level.

Would it be easier to compete with fewer races counting toward the championship?  I believe so, but it would be cumbersome for CCS to do this.  But would it now as Sportsman racing does not count toward the overall points championship?

Here's a new idea....  But maybe it has been thought of before.

Take a rider's number of points and mulitply it by the performance index.  An index of 1000 would be 1, an index of 500 would be .5 (we're talking percentages here.)

So, rider Billy Bo has 27,000 points, but has a performance index of 50.  Adjusted points are 1350.  Meanwhile, Sally Rotten Crotch has 2,000 points with a peformance index of 850,  Her adjusted points are 1700.

Any thoughts?

New bikes every couple of years?  That's what we call marketing, folks.  Last year at Blackhawk, there were several of us doing 1:13's on 600's.  In 1993, while riding CBR600F2's at Blackhawk, there were several of us doing 1:15's.  Two seconds in ten years?  The change is not as big as one thinks it is.  Tires change, the bikes become more powerful, but a fast rider on a well set up bike will go fast.  The HP does not make that much difference.  If it did, 750's and 1000's would be killing 600's.
Super Dave

Dawn

QuoteSally Rotten Crotch

Gosh Dave...

I'm glad my name is not Sally!   :o

Dawn  :)

Super Dave

She got that name from her husband, Billy Bo.  

You can see that she's cleaning the house with him at the track.  Makes for interesting dinner converstations.
Super Dave

gpconcepts

Why not just allow combined point totals from a limitted number of classes. Say each rider combines point totals from the three classes where he or she has the highest point totals. Are there any bikes that connot compete in at least three classes?

Rich

Super Dave

CCS riders enter an average of 4.7 classes.  If you limit the number of entries that count toward the "championship", CCS would loose money from riders entering fewer races.  

I agree with the idea, limiting the number that "qualify" toward overall championships.  It would level the playing field a bit, and maybe more would vie for the overall championship.  

Apparently, it would be hard to do from a software stand point for CCS.  I've made the case for several years.
Super Dave

Sean Wyatt

I still like the colored number plates and weight-class championships, of course with limited races counting towards the championship, is the way to go..  

I think weight-class championships are more indicative of the true track champions.  Allow I believe the weight-class champions could probably change weight classes and still do well, but they may not have the same success.  I also think it could generate more participation in each of the weight classes because you are not penalizing the racers who can't afford to race in 10 races/weekend.  If I race only in LW races, I should have a legitimate chance at winning a #1 plate, and not just be grouped with everyone else.  

This should reward racers even more come sponsorship solicitation time.  My idea is that I can crunch the numbers and prove that I am the #1 LW racer and state that in my sponsorship solicitation package, but a bright and shiny #1 on my bike says it all, especially if Jack takes plenty of pictures of me and bike.

One major issue is that it may be possible to win more than one weight-class championship.  Although it probably won't happen much from LW to MW/HW/Unltd.  Maybe in that case you pick one color, or extend the range of colors to include this possibility.  Maybe it's not in the color of the number plate itself, but the number plate border/background.

Super Dave

Your idea has some merit.   ;D

I think the hardest would be spectators identifying different nubmer 1's.  How about number 2's?  Where do we stop?

At best, CCS is sportsman racing;  it is racing that is intended for the consumption of the racers, not really the spectators.  FUSA with CCS in 2000 was for spectators.  Everything else has not been up to that standard.

If were talking about sponsorship, first and foremost, teams (read as riders) must bring their programs up.  Press releases, uniforms (a t-shirt would be good), whatever.  NASCAR did not grow over night.  Neither did AMA Pro Racing.  That has changed substantially from ten years ago.

Indeed, the problem with all that is that the riders that are fast for their riding sake sometimes become overlooked in the wake of a decent rider that has money or a big sponsor.  It's happening now in the AMA.  Watch what happens in FUSA.

Ok, so you have LW, MW, HW, UL categories.  Four number one's, four number 2's?  Thoughts?
Super Dave

Sean Wyatt

Definitely a lot of numbers, but the emphasis is on who's the best in a particular class, not just who is the best amatuer.  Not to take any thing away from Michael Chachere because he is definitely a top 3 or better rider who deserves to hold the #1 plate, but what about other fast amatuers is classes Michael doesn't participate in they deserve the honor as well.

Basically, I think it is an absolute necessity that there be weight-class #1 plate holders.  CCS and it's competitors need to make it happen.

I think it will only raise the bar of the competition in all of CCS.  Rich Oliver and Chuck Sorenson are talented riders that have tried their craft in other classes, but they'll probably always be known as 250GP riders, for which they have honorably carried the #1 plate.  I want the same opportunity if I choose to race lightweight only.

About the team presentations, I agree.  It may be the responsibility of the more experienced racers to put there arms around newer racers, and collectively advance our marketability.  If everyone just wants to race for themselves only, it probably won't happen.  I think it may even be up to CCS to promote and encourage.  Provide racers with sample solicitation packages, resource to get pit crew wear a reasonable prices.  I think it nice to see all of the VRS and LCR t-shirts and race leathers.  I think W3 Racing and Moon Supercycle are definitely things in the right places.

Obviously I have a lot of idea, I just need to sit down for a while a write them out.

Super Dave

A lot of people put the responsibility of promotion in the lap of the racing organization. It really doesn't work that way.

A good friend of mine works for a company that does work for many CART teams.  The organization CART is cr@p.  They don't do anything.  The only reason there is anything happening there is because of the teams.  The teams took the responsibility to up their programs.

As for what we have happening by us...

I have to rent the track with my money, pay my insurance, supply my cornerworkers, and pay for everyone's lunch.  I have a lot more to loose, and I will always have much less to gain financially.  I can offer more track time, set up work, and RIDING instruction.  CCS's school program offers a quick hitting safety course during race day.  I've taught that program myself for CCS.  Good money too, but no personal satisfaction.
Super Dave

sdiver68

Super_Dave...

Granted lap times ahven't changed as much as the marketing would have you beleive (though I question 1:13's???), but bigger bikes or more powerful bikes give a big advantage in passing even on smaller tracks like BHF, and really stretch their legs on bigger tracks like RA .

MCRA Race School Instructor